Writing to double layer dvds (or not as the case may be!)

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by cdorling, Jan 25, 2007.

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  1. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    I have belatedly read some previous threads about using TI (v10) to write an image to more than 1 dvd, and like many others I have ended up with a pile of bird scarers, having got fed up with constantly re-inserting 1 disk after the other. I even got my image down to 4,575gb, thinking it would fit onto a 4.7gb dvd, but I have read it needs to be more like 4.3gb.

    I've also read about the 2 step method of backing up an image in smaller chunks, but as I really wanted TI to burn directly onto one disk and add copies of itself in case I ever needed the whole kaboodle (I should say that I have 2 hard-drives, so this will be my defence if major things go wrong, which they did once before - a fire!). I also don't yet have nero loaded as I took it off to reduce the image size.

    So out I went and bought 5 very expensive double layer 8.5gb DVD+Rs. But at my 1st attempt TI treated it like a 4.7gb dvd and ejected it before it could hav ebeen full and asked for another dvd. In frustration I aborted the backup and it will soon be another bird scarer. In explorer it says its full up, at about 4.7gb. But now I am wondering, did it just want me to push it in again so that it could write to the 2nd layer? I think TI is supposed to accept 7.5gb dvds, do I have to tell TI that I am using a larger dvd? My pc is a Dell, which I bought about 8 months ago (yes, after a fire trashed the last one), so it should have a dvd writer that copes with a double layer. Shouldn't it??

    Before I add even more to the dvd mountain, can anyone tell me if I'm doing something wrong? Many thanks inhope and anticipation.
     
  2. USAAlone

    USAAlone Registered Member

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    Try the other side of the dual layer DVD.
     
  3. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    I don't know exactly how it works, but I'm pretty sure there's only one side to it, with one layer somehow below the other, all on the same side.
     
  4. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    I bought a 4600 Dell in 2004, and ordered it with a dual layer DVD+R writer. I thought I would use it to do backups too. I was unaware at the time though, that dual layer disks don't come in re-writable disks (DVD-RW) as this was a new concept to me and I hadn't read up on it before I bought the Dell. That said, I quickly realized that I wasn't going to buy new DL disks every time I did a back up, and have continued doing back ups with DVD-RW 4.7 GB disks. I have yet to use the DL feature. :p I am looking into the possibility of getting an external HD for back ups instead of DVDs.
     
  5. Carver

    Carver Registered Member

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    I just got this external Drive http://www.provantage.com/seagate-st3300601cb-rk~7SEGR00Y.htm So far I haven't done a backup on it yet, but I have formated it from FAT to the NTFS file system connect it useing USB 2.0, and 279.46 Gigs took about 1 hour 20 minutes. I haven't tried dual layer DVDs yet, I'm scared of the price and making a mountain of frisbees.
     
  6. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    Carver - Thanks for the tip. I only have an 80GB HD, 74% free space so far. I checked out the site you provided. Can you recommend one that would be the best for backing up my system? I'm not too knowledgeable about what to look for. Thanks in advance. :)
     
  7. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    Cdorling - Yes layer 1 is on the same side as layer 2. If I remember right from an illustration I saw, the "grooves" of layer 2 are between the "grooves" of layer 1 in a layer below layer 1.
     
  8. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    You are correct. The current disks are double layer not double sided. There were such disks briefly, but it was such a stupid idea that it died quickly. Think about where do you write labels on a double sided disk? On the edges of course.

    As far as I know, TI doesn't support writing to DL disks, but you can use the two step method to write to them. What I don't know is whether the Recovery CD can read DL disks.
     
  9. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    Tccch, thats not good news, hopefully someone can confirm both. Burning to 2+ dvds does seem to be a failing with an otherwise great prog.

    So, what I'll probably do is uninstall 2 or 3 more progs to get the image down to 4.3gb, get that + the TI progs onto a single dvd using TI & keep that as a last resort 3rd line back-up. I'll restore back to where I am at the moment, add any other progs I need then use the 2 step method as 2nd line, plus backup regularly to my 2nd disk as 1st line. I'm determined not to lose everything again!
     
  10. shieber

    shieber Registered Member

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    DLs cost about double what single layer disks cost. So you can gain some disk changes but probably not save anymoney going DL.

    But if money isn't the key factor and convenience is, do yourself a favor and reconsider backing up to harddisks. The time savings alone might be worth the costs. If you do images, you can fit a lot of most images on a 500GB drive. Depending on your setup, a much smaller and cheaper drive might do for you.
     
  11. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    Mine cost me 5 x as much :(

    I found this on the Acronis website:-

    'Supported formats include: DVD+R, DVR+RW, DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD-RAM, and DVD+R Dual-Layer is fully supported; DVD-R Dual-Layer is not supported. The entire process is completely transparent — just put a blank DVD disk into the drive and you can save your image to that disk without any additional software'.

    The double layer discs I've tried are DVD+R. As I said earlier, only 4.7gb of it was used. Assuming double layer = dual layer, and that Acronis have stated the position correctly, I'll try and double check that my DVD writer is up to using them.
     
  12. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    Well, my dvd writer can write to double layer disks. As TI spat it out after 4.7gb was saved I can only assume that TI cannot, despite what they say in their blurb.

    Or has anyone else managed to write successfully to a double layer disk?
     
  13. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    I think we were sold a white elephant with respect to DL disks. I have yet to need to use one, and haven't bought any disks. Maybe they will go the route of 8 track tapes. :mad:
     
  14. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    Hello cdorling,

    You talk about DVD Double Layer. However, DVD Double Layer is NOT the same as DVD Dual Layer. TI is advertised as being compatible with DVD+R Double Layer (DVD+R DL) therefore please confirm the type of media you are using - Double Layer or Dual Layer?

    Regards
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2007
  15. seekforever

    seekforever Registered Member

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    I don't think they are different. DVD+R is referred to as double-layer and DVD-R is referred to as dual-layer but they are the same thing with respect to 2 layers being on the same side as opposed to the double-sided, single-layer disks. Naturally, they have the +R,-R differences regardless of the number of layers. The consumer world tends to use the double, dual interchangeably.
     
  16. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    Seekforever, I agree. When I first got it I did alot of reading, and they were referred to as both.
     
  17. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    I definately tried a 'DVD+R DL' (on the box it also said double layer). The reading that I have done suggests that they are the same.

    I'm still hoping Mr Acronis Support may post a reply...
     
  18. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    Like I said. :D
     
  19. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    Hi seekforever,

    I agree that both formats result in a double layer, single-sided, disk. However, there are difference in their physical composition (http://www.audioholics.com/news/editorials/DVDInsider-DVDR9.php), which may be why Acronis only recommend DVD+R Double Layer. If you recall, Acronis didn't recommend the use of DVD-R media for earlier versions of True Image (although some users, myself included, had no problem with it).

    Still, who knows, maybe Acronis are just being a bit loose with their terminology and that TI 10 is indeed supposed to be compatible with DVD+R Double Layer and DVD-R Dual Layer. o_O

    Regards
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2007
  20. cdorling

    cdorling Registered Member

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    Thanks MMan, nice to know someone has written something to an 'extended' DVD with a version of TI. Do you remember if it did it in one go, or did it spit the dvd out 1/2 way through?
     
  21. seekforever

    seekforever Registered Member

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    cdorling found on the Acronis site the statement that +R DL was supported only. Given that, I wouldn't say that -R DL is supported because there are differences in the +,-R disks. However, it seems the terms double and dual are used interchangeably by consumers but the "official" +R people call theirs double not dual.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 8, 2007
  22. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    I have never used DVD+R Double Layer or DVD-R Dual Layer disks. Sorry if I gave you that impression. I merely wished to point out that the two types were not exactly the same.

    For earlier versions of TI, Acronis Support always maintained that they couldn't guarantee compatibilty with DVD-R (single layer) media. Perhaps there is a similar situation with TI and DVD-R Dual Layer disks? I guess the only people in a position to comment authoritively are Acronis Support. In any case, Acronis should really change their compatibility statement to read DVD+R Double Layer rather than DVD+R Dual Layer.

    Regards
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2007
  23. Acronis Support

    Acronis Support Acronis Support Staff

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    Hello everyone,

    Thank you for choosing Acronis Disk Backup Software.

    We are sorry for the delayed response.

    Please notice that there are actually only two different formats of two-layer DVDs: DVD+R Double Layer and DVD-R Dual Layer. These are official names, but words double/dual are often interchanged by different media.
    Please notice that, as this FAQ entry states, DVD+R Double Layer is fully supported and DVD-R Dual Layer is not supported by Acronis True Image 10.0 Home.

    Thank you.
    --
    Marat Setdikov
     
  24. Acronis Support

    Acronis Support Acronis Support Staff

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    Hello cdorling,

    Thank you for choosing Acronis Disk Backup Software.

    We are sorry for the delayed response.

    Please download the latest build (4940) of Acronis True Image 10.0 Home. To get access to updates you should first register your software.

    If updating does not solve the issue, could you please collect some information to let us investigate it thoroughly and provide you with a solution?

    To obtain CD Recorder log, please proceed as follows:
    - Run regedit from Start -> Run;
    - Open HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Acronis\DebugLogs registry key;
    - Please create the folder DebugLogs if it does not exist yet;
    - Add cdrecord value (Type: DWORD; Data: 1);
    - Please reproduce the problem
    The cdrecord.log will be created in Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Acronis\DebugLogs folder.

    Please also collect the application log of the operation:
    - run the program;
    - select Show log on the toolbar or from the Tools menu;
    - select the log with error messages;
    - click "Save the log entry to file" (the diskette icon).

    Then submit a request for technical support. Attach all the collected files and information to your request along with the step-by-step description of the actions taken before the problem appears and the link to this thread. We will investigate the problem and try to provide you with a solution.

    Thank you.
    --
    Marat Setdikov
     
  25. twl845

    twl845 Registered Member

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    I'm glad to hear that DVD+R double layer is supported, but I find it expensive to use them in a back up at about $5 a disk, and not being rewritable. I'm going to look into a extrnal HD for back ups. Right now I'm using 4.7GB DVD+RW disks.
     
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