WIN98 won't install

Discussion in 'Acronis Disk Director Suite' started by cgbjr, May 21, 2007.

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  1. cgbjr

    cgbjr Registered Member

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    I’m trying to install WIN98SE on the second physical drive in a FAT32 active partition. The 1st drive (C: ) has a small (8MB) partition for Dell Utilities that I don’t want to mess with, and the rest of 40GB is WIN XP Pro and NTFS. The second drive has 180GB in NTFS (D: ), and 10GB in FAT32 (T: ) that I created with Acronis.

    I have set the boot sequence in OS Selector for installing WIN98 with the second drive moved up to first checked, as the manual says, but when I boot it sees the C: drive first. After a lot of messages from the WIN98 CD about finding non-MS-DOS files and whether to configure unallocated space the last one asks me to reformat the C: drive. Obviously I say NO to all of these and have to exit setup. I don’t know if it matters, but the CD is marked “For distribution with a new PC only.” It’s the disk that came with my Dell, so it’s not warez, but it may be locked into installation on a C: drive in spite of Acronis software.

    How do I get this to work? Thanks in advance – Chuck B
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 22, 2007
  2. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    Is the 10GB FAT32 partition at the beginning of the second hard drive? Win98 can't see it properly at the end. You may have to move the NTFS partition to make room for the FAT32 partition at the beginning.

    It should be like this: [10GB FAT32][180GB NTFS]
     
  3. mangoman

    mangoman Registered Member

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    Isn't Acronis DD supossed to take care of problems like "a 10GB FAT32 partition at the beginning of the second hard drive" automatically?

    The Dell install CD probably has blocks in it. A Win98 full version (not upgrade) may be the only installer that works.
     
  4. K0LO

    K0LO Registered Member

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    I can't vouch for the Dell Windows 98 install CD, but I do have a Dell Windows XP install CD and it is BIOS locked so that it will only install to Dell hardware.
     
  5. cgbjr

    cgbjr Registered Member

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    Mudcrab - you're right, the FAT32 partition is at the wrong end. I will move it (when my daily duties are done) and try again. Thanks.
     
  6. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    According to the manual this problem is the result of DOS code: Due to the limitation of boot code in most DOS–like operating systems, their boot partitions should be located in the first 2 gigabytes of a hard disk.

    Since cjbjr has the Dell utiltities on the drive already, I assume (perhaps incorrectly) that it is a Dell computer.
     
  7. cgbjr

    cgbjr Registered Member

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    Well well, another problem. When I invoke the "move" command, I get a small window with the instruction to select the space to which I want to move a partition, but I can't do it. Nothing I click on has any effect. The "Next" option is grayed out. There is plenty of space in the D: drive. In this window the space is shown at the left side of the bar graph, but in the main window the space is shown on the right. Whatever all that means. The bottom line is I can't get the Move command to function.
     
  8. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    If you deleted the FAT32 partition at the end of the drive, does it look like this: [NTFS 180GB][Unallocated 10GB]

    Are you trying to do this from Windows or from the rescue cd? One way may work better. Since it's not the Windows boot drive you should be able to do it from Windows.

    If it won't let you move it, then can you resize it twice? Drag the end to the end of the drive and the beginning to allow 10GB of unallocated space in front.
     
  9. mangoman

    mangoman Registered Member

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    Did you try to resize the big first NTFS partition to create unalocated space at the begining of the drive, then move the fat32 or just make a new fat32.

    A different problem...
    This could be the answer why I cant do any dual boot on my new Vista notebook
    =====
    According to the manual this problem is the result of DOS code:
    Due to the limitation of boot code in most DOS–like operating systems,
    their boot partitions should be located in the first 2 gigabytes of a hard disk.
    =====
    Please define DOS-like?
    Are you saying that if my first say 30 gig on a drive is Vista NTFS, then I cant install win98 fat32 anywhere else, how about XP fat 32 or XP NTFS?
     
  10. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    mangoman,

    "Dos-like" is refering to OS's that use DOS or are running off of DOS, such as DOS, Windows 3.1, Win98, WinME, etc. You have to remember that MS-DOS is very old and doesn't access large hard drives well.

    So to answer you question, Yes, you'll need to make room at the beginning of the drive if you want Win98 installed on it. If you want two boots of Win98 they would both have to be inside the 2GB area at the beginning of the drive. If this requires that you move your XP/Vista partition you may need to edit the boot.ini file or run Vista Repair to enable booting into those after the move.

    XP doesn't have that problem. I have Vista and two XP partitions on my 320GB RAID drive. The only thing with XP & Vista is that they want to be on the first drive. You change the order in BIOS or by using boot managers like OSS to allow booting XP on a different hard drive.
     
  11. mangoman

    mangoman Registered Member

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    MudCrab,

    I was busy posting to "vista on Hp dual boot" while you wrote this...

    Thanks again, I knew that once before about DOS. When I read the Acronis ad-- something like "it used to be... you had to first install oldest dos then newer win then newer XP , BUT not anymore! Acronis DD takes care of all this automatically." I thought they meant it could/would move partitions around as necessary so dual\tri\quad boots work for all thier supported op systems. A program in the future could do that, right?

    XP can use fat32 or NTFS right? Can both of these be outside the first 2 gig?

    I was going to start a new thread about this, but MudCrab you can probably give me a quick answer... Do I have to create a new seperate partition in the front for OSS to reside in (like Partition Magic)? I assume not, so where is OSS hiding?
     
  12. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    XP can use either FAT32 or NTFS and either can be outside 2GB.

    If you do the "custom" install of OSS, you can select where OSS installs its files. If you install with only Vista on the computer then they'll be in a hidden folder on the Vista partition.

    If you want, you can make a small partition for OSS. It can be either FAT32 or NTFS and can be anywhere on the drive or even on a different hard drive. I have my OSS files installed to a small FAT32 primary partition on my third hard drive. This way when I restore any of the OS partitions (I use TI) it doesn't mess with my OSS files and possibly screw up my multi-boot system.
     
  13. mangoman

    mangoman Registered Member

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    MudCrab,
    You are good!
    Acronis is paying you, right?
     
  14. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    Nope. I'm just another Acronis software user.
     
  15. cgbjr

    cgbjr Registered Member

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    <<If you deleted the FAT32 partition at the end of the drive, does it look like this: [NTFS 180GB][Unallocated 10GB]>> -- Yes, that's what it looks like.

    <<Are you trying to do this from Windows or from the rescue cd? One way may work better. Since it's not the Windows boot drive you should be able to do it from Windows.>> -- I'll remember that if all else fails, but...

    <<If it won't let you move it, then can you resize it twice? Drag the end to the end of the drive and the beginning to allow 10GB of unallocated space in front.>> -- I'm not sure I follow. I don't seem to be able to do *anything* with the mouse. Clicking, dragging, swearing - nothing has any effect. Can you explain "resize it twice"? Although the manual says I can use already occupied space to move and split and so on (assuming there is also enough *free* space), I can't get any instructions other than using unallocated space.
     
  16. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    cgbjr,

    What I meant by "resize twice" was to do the following:
    The drive starts like this: [NTFS 180GB][Unallocated 10GB]
    Select the 180GB partition and select to resize it. Then move the end so it now takes up all the Unallocated space.
    The drive will now look like this: [NTFS 190GB]
    Apply those changes.
    Then select the NTFS partition again and select to resize it.
    Move the beginning of the partition to the right until it shows 10GB of free space before the partition.
    Now the drive looks like this: [Unallocated space 10GB][NTFS 180GB]
    Apply those changes.

    You are basically doing a "move" but doing by two separate "resize" procedures.

    If you don't care about the data on the NTFS partition (or have it backed up and can easily get it back) it might be easier to just "clear" the drive and then create the partitions the way you want.

    Does the mouse not work at all in the DD interface? Can you select menu items, etc.?

    What kind of mouse are you using? PS/2 or USB? Can you try a different one?
    I assume the mouse problem is from the rescue cd? Does it work correctly in DD when run from Windows?

    Can you post a screenshot of the DD screen showing the drive and current partition layout? It might help to see what it actually looks like.
     
  17. cgbjr

    cgbjr Registered Member

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    Mudcrab - your 'resize' advice worked. Personally, I'd call it 'moving', but hey, now I know how Acronis works. So, now the 98 CD boot recognizes the 2nd drive FAT32 partition at the beginning and happily tries to install itself, calling this the C: drive, even though it is not. And then, after copying files, it reboots and I find myself in a Catch 22. The OS Selector gives me the choice of booting from the CD, a WIN98 DOS prompt, or the new WIN98 OS. None of them work. The CD boot tries a new install, the DOS prompt has some files not installed, in particular WIN.COM, so it doesn't work, and the new WIN98 OS fails because, I guess, of those missing files, and it reboots. Or maybe it's looking for the faux C: drive and can't find it.

    On another thread someone advised pulling drive #1 and installing to drive #2. then putting #1 back in, and claimed that OS Selector will recognize the WIN98 installation. That's what I'll try next.
     
  18. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    You may need to move the 2nd drive into the 1st postition in the drive order list in the OSS settings for Win98 and Win98/DOS menu items. This will make Win98 think it's on the first drive when it really isn't.
     
  19. cgbjr

    cgbjr Registered Member

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    The second drive is already set up that way - it's the only way to get the 98 install process started. Something else is messing up.
     
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