Retunil, FirstDefense-ISR, DeepFreeze, etc. + all image backup softwares are NOT....

Discussion in 'other security issues & news' started by ErikAlbert, Sep 13, 2007.

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  1. ErikAlbert

    ErikAlbert Registered Member

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    Retunil, FirstDefense-ISR, DeepFreeze, etc. + all image backup softwares are NOT security softwares, they are RECOVERY softwares.
    All these softwares don't even know or recognize infections, only security softwares can do that, like AV/AS/AT/AK/AR-scanners.

    Recovery softwares simply restore your system in a previous healthy state and you still need security softwares to stop the installation/EXECUTION of infections.
    Recovery softwares ONLY REMOVE infections and do that much better than any existing group of scanners and much, much, much faster and without false/positives.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2007
  2. EASTER

    EASTER Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    You're right, literally speaking, but in some users opinion, Recovery Programs, especially one on the order of FD-ISR just as well double for a Security App.

    At least if you get hit with a bad virus you can safely rebuild your system again to exact formation as if nothing ever happened.

    For some, including me. that IS Security!

    The term Security, although thought of in many forms, is also interpreted roughly the same. It PROTECTS, SECURES!!! against destruction/intrusion, maybe not immediately like scanners & resident guard apps, but it certainly can be considered a security app if practiced in that manner. And especially if it's the ONLY program that not only SAVES your system, but restores it again completely intact.
     
  3. ErikAlbert

    ErikAlbert Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    Easter,
    If I don't install any security software in my FDISR-snapshots, all infections can do whatever they want on my computer, because there is NOTHING to stop them. Only when I reboot, I remove all these infections, but that is often TOO LATE, because they had enough time to do their evil job (execution). Sorry, but I can't call this security.
     
  4. EASTER

    EASTER Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    Well, then if i had to recant my choice due to the terminology nature of Security App, then my choice would absolutely have to be Anti-Executable.

    I don't see how ANYTHING can compromise it on a routine level, BUT, it works courtesy it's driver from SDT Table levels, and even those HOOKS can be Unhooked.
     
  5. ErikAlbert

    ErikAlbert Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    That's why I have Faronics Anti-Executable, a very annoying software, but it stops any unauthorized executable on my frozen on-line snapshot and many infections are executables.
    The rest of infections is removed during reboot. I scanned recently my computer with KAV, NOD32, SAS and a few others, because I don't use these scanners anymore for many months. They couldn't find anything, not even a false positive. So my boot-to-restore seems to work and I have only 3 security softwares installed : LooknStop+router, Anti-Executable and DefenseWall and I don't even trust them. LOL.
    The only thing I really trust are my clean images and clean archives and my off-line snapshot = computer without internet.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2007
  6. EASTER

    EASTER Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    I don't find AE annoying at all given it's obvious strengths. Only takes a moment to disable but i see you point. We live in a world of which, especially in the computer world, we expect making changes to settings to be INSTANT

    Well, we're not there yet, we still have to stop cold what we're doing and run thru a series of boxes/windows just to get to certain settings for making changes, then re-enable matters after that. It's a small price of time (seconds) to make but still i see where this could be better done thru say a contect menu.
     
  7. LockBox

    LockBox Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    And that's not security? I agree that many of the imaging/snapshot programs serve dual-use as security software. The "security" term would have to be narrowly defined to not include them. Especially if you admit they are the only things you really trust!
     
  8. Chuck57

    Chuck57 Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    As far as I'm concerned, Returnil, Powershadow, Sandboxie, and the rest are security. They don't stop things from getting in, but they can eliminate them with a simple reboot in the first two cases.

    At the moment, I already have only one Security app on this computer, Blink Personal.

    For absolute security, I don't keep any sensitive info, such as credit card, banking, etc on my computer. Neither do I shop or do any business involving credit cards, banking, etc online. I don't trust the Internet or any business security setup that much.
     
  9. ErikAlbert

    ErikAlbert Registered Member

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    That's not security, that is recovery. Two different things.
    ShadowProtect will never tell you "Hey you have virus." ShadowProtect will backup and restore that virus, just like any other object. The same for FDISR.
     
  10. lucas1985

    lucas1985 Retired Moderator

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    Re: If you could only use 1 Security App. what would you use?

    Security includes more things than simple protection against malware :)
     
  11. Perman

    Perman Registered Member

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    Hi, folks: The term"security"means to remove any threat/harm. Therefore if any app is capable of doing just that--removing any infection, no matter of how, as long as the ultimate result is clean, it is a security app. All these apps mentioned in the thread are INDEED as such.
     
  12. EASTER

    EASTER Registered Member

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    Very True, and i agree although ErikAlbert would surely take exception, but rightfully so.

    I think for sake of distinguishing Intrusion Security vs. just plain security, we all will most likely express differing opinions. But for sake of discussion, we do need to draw a definitive line between the two in some fashion.

    I like to use the term "shielding" regarding anti-spyware & HIPS, but i know thats also too vague.

    If anyone would like to better categorize between the groups feel free. I completely understand Imaging Apps ARE recovery methods but too feel them as important from a Security standpoint and even more so than an AS.

    So now that i've completely confused myself by the Term security, i'll leave the rest up to other members opinions. o_O
     
  13. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Erik. Actually the software you mentioned could be considered security, what they aren't is "detection" softwares.
     
  14. ErikAlbert

    ErikAlbert Registered Member

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    Re: Retunil, FirstDefense-ISR, DeepFreeze, etc. + all image backup softwares are NOT.

    Sorry guys, but I can't consider Image Backup and ISR as security and I certainly draw the line between the two : security and recovery.
    I guess it's a matter of opinion, just like partitioning and separating system from data, which is also an endless discussion.
    I give up and keep my opinion for myself.
     
  15. LockBox

    LockBox Registered Member

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    ErikAlbert,

    Here in the USA a lot of people own guns for security. It's not like the guns will keep the intruders (malpeople) out, but the shotgun blows them right back into the front yard (reboot). The shotgun provides - security.
     
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