Researcher Who Stopped WannaCry Arrested in US After Def Con...

Discussion in 'other security issues & news' started by hawki, Aug 3, 2017.

  1. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
  2. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
  3. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
  4. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
  5. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    Yes and its interesting the author makes the point that what Hutchins did was to use a known technique called sinkholing, to learn more about the malware, yet the media and the industry branded Hutchins intervention, a lucky accident.
    Everything they say, has a reason and a purpose. The industry knows full well what Hutchins did was no accident he used an established known technique, but if the world knew that they might start asking awkward questions about THIER strange lack of action.
     
  6. plat1098

    plat1098 Guest

    I'm probably missing the point because the "news" media seems to change its stories every five minutes. lol.

    Too speculative for me, to be honest witcha--unless we can get a glimpse of those sealed documents (yes, right). Can you provide a more detailed explanation about why you feel WCry was a marketing tool and not an experimental test run? Recall NoPetya that followed; somehow, "marketing tool" doesn't fit there in my eyes.

    Whether or not his arrest was prompted by a revenge narc is kind of immaterial, right? But crowd funding made his bail, he's out now.
     
  7. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    Well you can either believe the official story that the entire tech industry, multi billion dollar corporations that were all over the media congratulating themselves on how they "watched" the ransomware infecting hundreds of thousands of computers by the hour across the world but only this one guy from England actually examined and tested it, saw it connecting to the internet and decided to check on what it was attempting to do.
    Or you can say, that's bs.
    Kinda like when Bruce Schneier said,
    He was talking about the time Sony infected half a million computers in 165 countries with a rootkit and trojan it planted in it's music CDs.
    He also said,
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2017
  8. Rasheed187

    Rasheed187 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2004
    Posts:
    17,606
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    Thanks for your insight, it was interesting to read. So things are not looking good.
     
  9. boredog

    boredog Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2015
    Posts:
    2,499
    It might turn out like Kevin M. some jail time then probation and not being able to near a computer. Then start his own security business and write a book on social engineering.;)
     
  10. emmjay

    emmjay Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Posts:
    1,552
    Location:
    Triassic
    If the mystery co-defendant is a known contributor on the dark side he knows too much, knows too many and too many may know him. Using a coded online identity is not enough to live a totally obscure life. With both law enforcement and his past associates, cohorts and customers interested in his whereabouts, he might be currently studying a survivalist's handbook in the Wisconsin Ranges.

    Could he be the bigger fish that the FBI is interested in. Coconspirator applies more than just having contact though.
     
  11. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    "WannaCry hero Marcus Hutchins 'prevented from working by US bail terms'...

    ...Marcus Hutchins, 23, of Ilfracombe, Devon, was banned from using the internet among the numerous conditions set for his release after he was charged with creating and selling a malware that harvests bank details...

    Naomi Colvin, from civil liberties group Courage Foundation, said one move discussed was crowdfunding for his living costs as well as his legal fees, to allow him to fight the charges in Milwaukee, Wisconsin."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...cus-hutchins-prevented-working-us-bail-terms/
     
  12. itman

    itman Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    Posts:
    8,593
    Location:
    U.S.A.
    Appears this is concerning working for his existing employer which would require and provide him with Internet access. I have never heard of bail terms preventing anyone from being gainfully employed. Also he would need a work permit to also be employed and getting one in his current status could be the problem.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
  13. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    Of course, yes, anything that benefits a large corporation is good, justified and excusable. Now everybody let's all say that together in unison.
    An-y-thing-that-ben-e-fits....

    The point is, an individual does it, he's a criminal, hang him out to dry, make him suffer in prison, deprive him of ten years of his life.
    A corporation does it and the activity has the word "business" associated with it, then its good, then its moraly justified. Then its not malware its a product. Then its not a backdoor its a feature. Then its not a virus its a marketing tool. Then its not spying its telemetry.
    That is what is so wrong and as long as everyone keeps buying into this BS and defending it, its only going to get worse.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
  14. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    "Marcus Hutchins: cybersecurity experts rally around arrested WannaCry 'hero'...

    The cybersecurity community, however, has rallied behind Hutchins, with many experts expressing disbelief that he would have knowingly been involved in a criminal conspiracy. The case is also driving a wedge between governments and the independent cybersecurity experts they often rely on, with one pledging that he will no longer collaborate with law enforcement....

    As with most software, Kronos incorporated portions of code from other available tools including banking trojan Zeus, malware package that attempts to steal confidential information such as bank details from the compromised computer, and botnet creation kit Carberp. Some of the components of Kronos may have been originally developed for non-malicious purposes. This makes it hard to determine which parts of the malware, if any, Hutchins could be responsible for, despite the government’s allegations that he was its sole creator.

    Even if Hutchins did create or adapt the Kronos malware, prosecutors have to show he sold malware with the intent to further someone else’s crime. Otherwise they run the risk of criminalizing the act of writing some kinds of software...

    'If that’s the case half the industry is screwed,' said Tor Ekeland, a computer crime and technology lawyer who has extensive experience with the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, the law under which Hutchins was detained..."

    https://www.theguardian.com/technol...d-wannacry-kronos-cybersecurity-experts-react
     
  15. itman

    itman Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    Posts:
    8,593
    Location:
    U.S.A.
    Does make you wonder if what is going on here is a "precedent setting" prosecution against forensic penetration software development since many of those tools are currently being abused by malware developers.
     
  16. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    They turn the law on its head whenever they feel like it so I wouldn't be surprised if its purpose is to set a precedent.
    I hope the judge remembers its supposed to not be a crime to own a weapon, only a crime if you use it to attack someone.
    I'm also wondering how he came to be at defcon in the first place, did he go there off his own back or was he "invited" they said it was a sting operation, sometimes they blur the line between that and entrapment.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2017
  17. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    There is in the law the concept of "Illegal Contraband."
     
  18. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    I think creating computer programs should be considered freedom of expression under the first amendment, then criminal law should only apply to those who use a compiled program as a tool for criminal purposes.
     
  19. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    "...For nearly 20 years in cases pioneered by EFF, the courts have recognized that writing computer code is protected by the First Amendment..."

    http://time.com/4248928/code-is-free-speech/
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2017
  20. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    "WannaCry Malware Hero Likely Considering Plea Deal On Hacking Charge...

    Several factors surrounding Hutchins’s case indicate that prosecutors are likely offering or negotiating a plea deal, and that the U.S. is interested in using him to catch the real mastermind behind Kronos, according Boston University legal professor Ahmed Ghappour, a former defense lawyer and scholar of U.S. hacking laws.

    'Hutchins is not the lead defendant. That’s pretty clear from the indictment,' Ghappour told BuzzFeed news. 'Typically, a prosecutor will try to flip a lower name defendant, provide them with an opportunity to plead to a less serious crime, and/or provide a recommendation for a lower sentence in exchange for info helpful to the government.'...

    In Hutchins's initial court appearance Aug. 4, prosecutor Daniel Cowhig made it clear that the US is interested in capturing his alleged partner, saying that the other defendant 'is still at large.'...

    'Given the public outcry, given Hutchins’s knowledge, given that the other suspect’s likely at large, the government’s likely giving him a golden opportunity here,' he said..."

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/kevincolli...g-plea-deal-on?utm_term=.pqmJgYZJk#.lsLZEaAZ6
     
  21. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    I don't see how a foreign citizen can be charged in the united states for actions he did in his own country.
     
  22. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
  23. itman

    itman Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2010
    Posts:
    8,593
    Location:
    U.S.A.
    The Kronos malware affected banks worldwide including those in the U.S..

    As log as Hutchins remained in the U.K., the only way to prosecute him would be to extradite him to the U.S. which the U.K would have to agree to. Such is not the case when he is on U.S. soil.
     
  24. RockLobster

    RockLobster Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Posts:
    1,812
    Well, if creating malware is a crime in the US, surely you have to do it in the US for it to be under US jurisdiction?
    I'm sure we all do things in own own countries all the time that are against the law in other countries but we wouldn't expect to be arrested years later for it when we visit one of those countries.
     
  25. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    6,080
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    This case charges Hutchins with conspiring with the yet-to-be-named co-defendant to do far more than the act of creating the malware. In a conspiracy case, provided the prosecution can prove the elements of a conspiracy, the act of any one co-conspirator is also the act of all the other co-conspirators.

    Prosecutors love conspiracy cases because they cast a wide net. One simple intentional, overt act in furtherance of the conspiracy is all that it takes.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.