Questions about RVS 2008

Discussion in 'General Returnil discussions' started by doveman, Aug 20, 2010.

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  1. doveman

    doveman Registered Member

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    I still use RVS_2008 because as far as I know it's the last version to allow ONLY memory caching, which is how I want it as I use it for privacy and don't want to have to worry that traces might be lingering in a file RVS has created somewhere.

    However that brings up a couple of questions that I've been meaning to ask about for a while. Firstly, I can imagine that it doesn't take much memory for it to track deleted files, as it only needs to store a marker to pretend the file is deleted, but how does it cope with a file or files being written to the system partition that is larger than can be cached in memory? It's not something I'd ever want to do, but I guess I'd like to know if I should expect it to crash in those circumstances!

    Secondly, even with memory caching it still creates a RETURNIL folder with a RVSYSTEM.DAT file in it. I can delete that file and it still seems to work, but it gives an error every time I boot. So, what, if any, purpose does that file serve if the user's only using memory caching?
     
  2. Coldmoon

    Coldmoon Returnil Moderator

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    The key here is Memory = RAM + Disk so some remnants will remain on the disk. These remnants cannot be found using casual inspection, but can be found using advanced forensics tools and techniques. This is why the cache wipe option was developed.

    Changes are not tracked by "markers" within the file system as RVS/RSS virtualization does not really care what happens within Windows itself; rather it tracks the actual changes that would be made to disk and redirects them to the cache where they are dropped at restart of the system unless deliberately saved to the real system.

    As Memory = RAM + CACHE, large changes (large file or large number of concurrent changes) are tracked partially in both RAM and Disk...

    The DAT file is where your preferences are stored, and this is why you are getting the error. Uninstall and then reinstall to clear the errors and don't delete the dat file unless directed to do so as part of a specific fix suggested by technical support.

    Mike
     
  3. doveman

    doveman Registered Member

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    OK, thanks for explaining but if Memory = RAM+DISK, why does RVS_2008 ask whether you want to use Memory or Disk caching?

    Where does RVS store this Disk part of the Memory cache?

    Which version of RVS introduced the Cache wipe option and what level of wipe does it perform (1-pass, 3-pass)?

    I'm afraid I don't understand your explanation about RVS not using markers. Clearly it doesn't actually delete the files, so the only other explanation I can think of is that it "pretends" to have done so (by using a marker) and discards the "deleted" markers on rebooting when it's deactivated. If you were just trying to make the distinction that the markers are stored in RVS' cache, rather than the filesystem, I assumed that.

    I just restored the DAT file from the Recycle bin to stop the error. Good to know what it's for though.
     
  4. Coldmoon

    Coldmoon Returnil Moderator

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    It is simply a difference to resolve a specific issue. Memory caching in RVS 2008 is extremely fast and uses less disk space by default, but it suffers from having a higher risk of file damage than using strict disk caching. This is why saving content to disk is not allowed when using Memory caching in 2008.

    The disk portion is internal to the program itself.

    RVS 2008 and it uses a single pass single overwrite wipe method.

    RVS/RSS can be though of as a disk filter, though that is not an exact analogy, but accurate at a high level. This means it is only interest in attempts to write to the real disk and tracks those changes in the cache (IOW - redirects to the cache to maintain the fantasy world for Windows).

    Products that virtualize on the application (or IOW, the file system level) must continuously monitor the file system to track changes within Windows with the obvious performance implications that entails. RVS/RSS on the other hand does not care what happens within Windows itself as they are simply manifestations of the attempted disk changes.

    The virtualization driver will simply replace the file at restart if it is missing, but there are prerequisites to deleting the file that must be taken into account (GUI exited and Windows booted into safe mode for example). This is only required however when there is a problem with the virtualization being "stuck" in the active mode for whatever reason. This is rare and is usually associated with interference from other products.
     
  5. doveman

    doveman Registered Member

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    That doesn't make any sense to me I'm afraid. Windows and applications have to save to C: to operate properly. Or did you mean that dumping the cache to disk, to make any changes made in virtual mode permanent, is only allowed in disk caching mode and not memory caching mode? I certainly wasn't aware that data stored in RAM was more vulnerable to corruption than that written to disk, but I'll take your word for it.

    Even so, I'd still like an option to purely use RAM caching whilst taking responsibility for minimising writes to C: to avoid overloading the cache and crashing the system.

    Sorry, I don't understand that either. Surely if it's saving to disk it must be saving to a certain location. Are you saying that it writes to an unused part of C: but outside of the filesystem, so that it's not visible to Windows and can only be seen by examing the disk at a lower level with certain utilities?

    Hmm, I've never noticed the wipe option, I'll have to look a bit more closely.

    Well I understand that at least!
     
  6. Coldmoon

    Coldmoon Returnil Moderator

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    The problem was when saving very large files or a large number of concurrent saves to the real disk while in Memory caching mode. When first developed, this was allowed, but reports and subsequent testing proved it would be best to allow saving of content to the real disk when using Disk caching mode only.

    I meant exactly what I said, the disk portion is handled within the program itself where RVS 2008 is concerned when using Memory caching. The data within the cache can be discovered using forensics tools however.

    Mike
     
  7. doveman

    doveman Registered Member

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    Oh well, looks like I'm going to have to accept that you're not willing to explain what you mean in a way that makes any sense to me!
     
  8. Werderforever

    Werderforever Registered Member

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    Hello Mike,

    I like to use RVS 2008 free because I don´t like VirusGuard in 2010 and 2011.

    Supports RVS 2008 Windows 7 in 32-bit and/or 64-bit-Version?

    Another question: Which is the last build of RVS 2008 free?

    Many thanks for pour help and I hope you understand me, because english is not my motherlanguage.

    Best Regards
    Thomas
     
  9. Coldmoon

    Coldmoon Returnil Moderator

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    Hello Werderforever and welcome to the forums :)

    Then you may be interested in REV Lite 2011 which is a direct decedent of the 2008 and Labs series which use the same architecture. There is no free version for it however...

    32 bit only. For 64 bit support you will need to upgrade to RVS Lite 2011.

    It should be 9002

    No problem; perfectly understandable.

    Kind regards
    Mike
     
  10. Werderforever

    Werderforever Registered Member

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    Hello Mike,

    many thanks for your help and your friendly "Welcome" to the forums! :)

    First I will try RVS 2008 free and when I´m happy, it is interesting for me to switch to RVS Lite 2011, because in near future I will use 64-bit-system.

    Thanks again and kind regards
    Thomas
     
  11. doveman

    doveman Registered Member

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    Mike,

    I've had another look at RVS 2008 and I can't see any Cache Wipe option anywhere. Where is it supposed to be?
     
  12. Coldmoon

    Coldmoon Returnil Moderator

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    In the advanced options section. Select the Wipe change remnants option
     
  13. doveman

    doveman Registered Member

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    The closest I see is something that says Advanced Settings - Drop Changes - Change.

    If I click on the Change button, it says "This function needs the disk cache mode".

    This is on a PC with RVS in Protected Mode. On my other PC, with it in Unprotected Mode, that Change button isn't even visible (nor is the text "Drop Changes").
     
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