Prefetch is Supposed to Be Super Important for Performance, Right?

Discussion in 'other software & services' started by HandsOff, Feb 9, 2007.

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  1. lu_chin

    lu_chin Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    Since you mentioned the title, notice it says "Prefetch is Supposed to Be Super Important for Performance, Right?". May be prefetch is "super" important to you but personally I don't care about 10, 20, 30 seconds of extra load time. I care more about my CPU's and my video-card's performance. :D

    No where did I ever mention about disabling prefetch manually. My point is that there are those who like to tweak their systems for valid / invalid reasons and it is their choice. For example, I can run myriads of security applications just to feel "safer" when using my PC. I probably do not need all these applications and they will likely slow down my applications' load times by seconds too. Others can ask why I slow down my PC by doing so. How many folks run multiple layers of security applications here? Do they all need to prove that every single security application is really needed, useful, efficient, etc.? Are they making their machines SLOWER too? It is just a preference thing.

     
  2. ThunderZ

    ThunderZ Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?


    My point is Why do you so veomontly care what others chose to do to their PCs`?
     
  3. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    You did not answer the question:

    WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    If you are playing an online game, you don't care that it takes 30 seconds longer to load? Tell me another one. :rolleyes:

    I just don't get this, if this was some tweak that increased load times of your applications by 30 seconds it would be the biggest "secret" tweak ever!!! The problem is this is a default setting of Windows XP that people need to just leave alone. And in many cases requires people undo some of their "tweaks" they thought were helping. If you don't "Care" why are you posting?

    Of course it is their choice. If someone wants to slow down their PC they are entitled to. They are not entitled to misinform others who do not wish to.

    If you are aware you are doing something to just "feel safer" than you should correct that. You need next to nothing to be secure on XP:

    1. Firewall (XP SP2 firewall is fine)
    2. AntiVirus Program
    3. AntiSpyware Program (Windows Defender)

    Just because many people do something that is a waste of time does not justify it. What kind of argument is that?

    They do if they are telling other people they need to do the same thing.
     
  4. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    I don't care what you do, I care about misinformation. Many people read this nonsense and unknowningly slow down their PCs.
     
  5. lu_chin

    lu_chin Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    First, as I said many times, I did not care about a few extra seconds of load times and I hope I answer your question one final time. I use hibernation mode on my XP notebook and I don't reboot it often. I leave it running and I don't play online or offline games, except those few that come with XP. I only use Firefox to surf the web, to pay my bills online, etc. I also use Wordpad to type my documents. And I don't exit Firefox after it is loaded by the way unless it crashes or I really need to reboot my notebook. I never misinform or inform others about that "prefetch is supposed to (or not) be super important for performance". In my example, I want to feel "safe" (and in reality it is quite safe) when going online and I run layers of security applications to do so, thus making my PC slower than when not having such applications. People can tweak theirs PC to their likings, claiming to do so for one reason or another. Each person has to make up his/her own mind to do it or not. How many times do we read here that some folks use overlapped combinations of security applications to be safe while in reality a few less security applications may be equally safe (and faster) too. If your listed 3 applications are enough to make your XP secure, so be it. I am sure that some people will concur and some will not on this forum, as it is evident from the myriads of posts on different security setups mentioned here. One final comment before I end this discussion. I have not told people here to use or not use prefetch. All along through this exchange with me, it is you who tell others adamantly to use it.

     
  6. pugmug

    pugmug Registered Member

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    Mastertech,may I ask you how your main system is tweeked?In other words,what XP stock services do you turn off and apps. do you feel are good?Thank you for your reply if given.
     
  7. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    You didn't answer the question. I didn't ask if you cared. I asked why would you want them to load slower. What are you gaining by disabling prefetching? This has nothing to do with your security applications vs performance.

    Of course I have told people to use it. Windows XP comes with it enabled by default for a reason and there is nothing negative about it, only positively improved load times. So why would you not use it? Do you not understand this? This has nothing to do with how many security applications you have loaded. This is not some argument of if you have less security apps you may be less secure but your PC will perform better. I can tell by your comments relating to your security configuration/performance you are posting in the wrong thread. You are making an inaccurate analogy.

    With Prefetching enabled (it is by default) you ONLY get a positive = improved load times. Disable it and you get a negative one = reduced load times. There is NO REASON to disable it. DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THIS?
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2007
  8. Franklin

    Franklin Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    Ahh, GLAD TO SEE YOU HAVE FINALLY WOKEN UP - "Disable it and you get negative load times" and which is hardly noticeable on a newish machine.

    None of that nonsense about "CRIPPLES" an application launch time.

    Now please be a nice super duper spaceship cadet and edit your XP Myths site to reflect as such.
     
  9. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    Negative as in reduced not no change. Don't be a dumb ass. Franklin how does it feel to completely not understand how something works and continue to argue about it? People like you continue to amaze me with your incredible levels of ignorance. It is one thing being proven wrong it is another to mislead others simply because you were proven wrong. Try being responsible for once in your life.
     
  10. pugmug

    pugmug Registered Member

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    Mastertech,what is up with the name calling and fighting?I have not seen nor even knew you had a website but is this a ploy to have people go there to see what you have written?
     
  11. aigle

    aigle Registered Member

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    Hi users, I think we can disagree in a much better way than this.
     
  12. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Huh? What? No I am apparently in vain attempting to try and stop people from slowing down their computers.
     
  13. pugmug

    pugmug Registered Member

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    Can you then see yourself giving an answer to my post #106?
     
  14. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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  15. pugmug

    pugmug Registered Member

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    Is this link your site or just how you belive things should be done?
     
  16. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Yes and Yes
     
  17. pugmug

    pugmug Registered Member

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    That is all I needed to know,thank you for your response.
     
  18. lu_chin

    lu_chin Registered Member

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    Please do not change the subject title

    As I said before, I did not care whether an application loads slower by seconds or not. Did I ever say I disable prefetch on my XP machine? I just don't care one way or another. I just want to stress that people have different preferences, be they based on valid or invalid reasons (to others). So just let them decide for themselves.

    Imagine in my mentioned example, I don't reboot my notebook often, I don't run big applications in anyway, do I really worry about those few extra seconds _even_ if I were to disable prefetch? Not to me. I probably spend more time reading and replying to posts here than on loading some applications. My analogy is about choices that we all make are based on personal preferences and many other factors, not just speed (or fact). For example, redundant security layers are slower but may seem safer. Do I need to use/enable all cool features in XP, Vista, etc. Nope. It is still a person's choice to tweak his or her PC in ways he/she thinks fit.

    You insist people to use prefetch while I do not tell others to use or not to use it. That's the difference. If we judge things only purely by technical merits, we may have only one single best program for each task at hand instead of having so many choices out there.

     
  19. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    You still state the same irrelevant nonsense. So tell me why would someone disable prefetching? What is their reason for making this "choice"? You are not making ANY sense. I don't understand what the decision is about, can you clarify please.

    WHY WOULD SOMEONE DISABLE PREFETCHING?


    All your analogies are irrelevant to this. This is not about more security vs. more performance or application A vs. B. This is absolutely unbelievable. lu chin you don't even understand what you are debating.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2007
  20. Mrkvonic

    Mrkvonic Linux Systems Expert

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    Hello,

    Well, you just sinned and broke your own rules.

    First, you propose a list of what is needed to be secure. Which is exactly what everyone else does, from their own perspective, with their own convictions. ABC security formula is no different than the GHK formula. What decides the usage should be the user's skill, not the other way around. The more skilled you are, the more you should be allowed to use.

    But you preached against preachers.

    As to the components mentioned, you should be aware that outbound control is also important for many, as Windows itself cannot be trusted with phoning home.

    Of course, Windows Defender is crapolla galore.

    Finally, the most important element was not mentioned: non-MS browser. Firefox preferably, but Opera, K-Meleon or others will work too.

    Second, why do you even go into tweaking on your site, if you so vehemently oppose it?

    You suggest disabling services - far worse than playing with prefetch. While prefetch can simply slow you down, playing with services can seriously cripple a machine.

    You suggest a tcp/ip optimizer - most people don't know what tcp/ip stack is and how it works, and you suggest they optimize it.

    You suggest a memory optimizer - defies the Second Law of Thermodynamics.

    And yet, you're against prefetching.

    Mrk
     
  21. TairikuOkami

    TairikuOkami Registered Member

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    To improve PC's performance, because it uses CPU & RAM and does nothing.
    If someone likes to have a constant PC activity to get 5 sec, it is his choise.
    Anyway prefetch needs the task scheduler and that is an exploitable service.
     
  22. tlu

    tlu Guest

    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    Oh come on, ThunderZ! If that's your general guideline, most discussions here in the forum would be simply superfluos. The question here is only if "tweaking" prefetching makes any sense. It should be possible to discuss this topic while sticking to the facts. In my view, Mastertech is absolutely right, whereas most disputants here in this thread obviously don't understand how the prefetch mechanism really works.
     
  23. lu_chin

    lu_chin Registered Member

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    OK, here go some examples why someone may disable prefetch in XP.

    - A developer or QA person who works on disk/file drivers/utilities. Why? To do benchmarking, testing, development work, etc.

    - Say I am either someone who prefers to have a "clean" machine state who does not mind using some programs to clean up my browsing history, cookies, etc. (for personal preference or being security cautious). Or may be I am someone who wants to save as many KB or MB of free space on my tiny notebook PC with an old slow and miniscule hard-disk. Assume that I am willing to save as much free disk space for one more MP3 file I like to listen to by disabling prefetch (and cleaning out temporarily files, etc.) and I DO NOT MIND spending 10, 20, 30 extra seconds to load my applications. It is my personal choice to save 500 KB just like you cannot bear extra seconds of application load time. An analogy will be like there is a default browser cache inside Internet Explorer. I turn it off to save some free disk space even though I may (or may not) know that by doing so the load time of revisiting some websites will be greater. Others may do the opposite and increase the browser cache size. As I mentioned before, it was a personal choice and to each according to his/her need. People have to decide for themselves.

    By the way, there are tweaks + addons for custom themes, gadgets, mouse pointers that people use or don't use. What are their technical reasons to use more RAM and/or CPU (for example) if they choose to do so? Tweaks are a personal thing. :D

     
  24. pugmug

    pugmug Registered Member

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    Citizens arrest,citizens arrest!Double post,lol.
     
  25. Mastertech

    Mastertech Registered Member

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    Re: WHY WOULD YOU WANT YOUR APPLICATIONS TO LOAD SLOWER?

    No I told you what you need. I never stated any "rule". How "skilled" you are has nothing to do with "using more programs". That is just absurd. You simply need the minimum to provide yourself with adequate security.

    On a Windows XP Machine running as an admin it is impossible to secure outbound control. With Windows Vista it is possible.

    Actually it is the best real time free Anti-Spyware program.

    Wrong again. You can run Internet Explorer 24/7 without problems.

    Opposed to BAD TWEAKING. Ones that do nothing.

    Please state which service that is recommended to be disabled cripples a machine. Please I would love to hear this one.

    Of course they don't which is why a program is provided to do so.

    Where? Where is a memory optimizer suggested? Are you on crack or reading another page? No where is a memory optimizer suggested. They are clearly listed on the XP Myths page.
     
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