Please help w/new graphics card & system build

(251) Re: Please help with new graphics card

it most likely the SATA controller in use stopping it. try the other method it sure will work.

The DFI DK P35 T2RS. Got it today A flashy board the PCI connectors glow in the dark under UV. Not alot comes packaged with it but enough. Didn't take long to swap the motherboard around, as the cpu water block(swiftech storm) is contained so no need to drain the water . Applied the AS5 paste correctly for quad core(horizontal line). It's every bit as good as reading about it. First time using a board with right angled SATA connectors, certainly a plus. There's 2 push buttons on the board to power it and reset it and an extra clear cmos at the back of the io shield. The NB heatsink is adequate enough and had a 120mm fan blowing at it. It didn't start getting hot until 3.6Ghz. The board monitors NB and VRM temps. I was considering waterblocks for the NB and VRM(voltage regulator chips) but with 2x 120mm fans blowing down on the motherboard i don't think the need to. Pc runs very quiet due to water only a slight sound from PSU. enough talk time to put my words into action. 2 hours later... http://artco.adsl24.co.uk/markymoo/3rdApril2008.jpg it stable at that. hit a wall around 3.3Ghz and stuggled for awhile. then broke through that. the board drops alot voltage on full load more than others, this confirms the reports by others. i had to whack up the voltage quite abit after 3.3 to get stable but glad getting the result i was looking for near to 3.8 and confirms what i was reading. alot BIOS settings to play with but didn't touch that many. it alot easier to overclock this board than i read about. nice temps don't you think. can go abit more perhaps. This much performance for the money is great value. Comes with high definition 8.1 sound. Certainly another plus. The motherboard cd didnt obviously detect Server 2008 but installed all anyway except for the ICH9R chipset and sound. No issues was straight forward. Didn't bother flashing the BIOS as the current one did fine. The newer BIOS correct more problems but can slow things down with all the fixes so can be worse for overclock. It sure runs alot cooler than my 965 chipset P5B Deluxe at higher speeds. A big thumbs up.

 

(252) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Good results markymoo . Nice low temps too. It's great to hear you like the board. Interesting comments on the NB cooler as some said it wasn't adequate. I feel myself leaning towards the DFI now . I also looked up the audio chips on the DFI (885) and the MSI board (888T) and the snr is better on the DFI by 11db. It has some sort of content protection though .

I see the prices on the E8400 have dropped to $189-199 OEM and $209 retail. The Q6600's are still the same. Maybe they won't drop until they slash the price on the Q6700. Heck, the Q9300 is $279. I also see the processor that Hairy Coo is getting is now released .

 

(253) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Thanks to your great assistance,I have finally enabled AHCI following upon your last suggestions.

The JMicron Controller in the Giga BIOS is in fact enabled by the onboard sata/ide control mode,but everything was reasonably straightforward,except on reboot Windows stated that NTLDR was missing,which of course was cured by sorting out the rearranged drive sequence.
Have had to reinstall a few apps only.
I can now hotswap the external SATA drive.

Questions

How do I enable AHCI for each drive to enable faster speeds and correct shutdowns-or is this auto?
At boot up, Intel AHCI BIOS is installed each time,is this normal?

Anyway,congrats on your new mobo and the overclock- a great result

 

(254) Re: Please help with new graphics card

I liked the board it's a keeper. It's certainly gave me i've got the the best bang for the buck feeling. The board did have a great layout and that made it look plain and bare. DFI LanParty are a great m/b for the enthusiast. I could of paid nearly double for the next DFI P35 model up and not got the price/performance but a few more luxuries. It's a mid-range board and get that many BIOS options on a board of that price is a big bonus. You won't need all those BIOS functions unless you heavily into the overclocking side. You can get a similar result on good other P35 m/b's with less BIOS functions. I still recommend the MSI board for features and value. The DFI will still do good things with a dual core. It had the performance and enough features without paying the price of a high end board. The real star is the P35 chipset. The P35 is very good value and stable and giving great performance on duals or quads. I am used to a m/b with lots of features in the high end and this m/b was plain compared but enough for me this time. When you buy a good board requiring one or two useful features it can come with alot you don't need but you still have to pay high price just to get that one or two features...that's the way it goes. It certainly will give me the performance i need and won't be upgrading again in a long time. I will build a HTPC with the spare motherboard.

The content protection is to decrypt High Definition Video.

Regarding the overclock i did take a heavy handed approach to quickly see the potential. I ran OCCT for 1 hour for stabilty which maxed out all 4 cores which is meant to put out more stress than Prime95. I will explore all the suttle BIOS features and do better stability tests at a alot more leisurely pace.

The E8400 was $183 when it first came out so that more like it. Despite what's been said, go for the dual core its not a scandolous price and plenty of performance. It's good buy and more than enough for your needs and with the difference in price buy a good air cooler. I'm pretty sure you won'r miss quad core looking at your scenario but maybe presumptuous to say...or would get a E6700 over an Q9300 or Q9450 as it has a 10x multiplier. You would need to order 2 of those qx9775 and i dont mean for me too, it takes 2.

 

(255) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Good Job!

Sounds like to me you had another XP bootable hard drive trying to boot up instead of the system drive or the boot.ini on 1 drive and your windows on another. It sometimes good just to unplug all your hard drives except system drive and get that going with AHCI it less confusing especially if you many SATA leads.

It's all auto you do nothing and yes it normal to see it disalay AHCI mode on POST. Think of AHCI as a enhanced IDE. You might find writeback caching disabled as it uses it's own. It also works in RAID mode too as this is standard. It wise to turn off write cache then less chance of any data being lost if unplugged. This is what removable drives are set to do. Hotswapping a drive is instantly detected or instantly removed. Using the utility Hotswap does actually make it safer to remove any drive. It's 100% safe physically removing a drive but Intel state even Hotswapping it not 100% safe due to data still might be in the cache. eSata comes with the same risks. The utility Hotswap will remedy this. There is an option on drives 'Optimise For Quick Removal'. So it safer to hotswap connect than to hotswap unconnect. If you havent any processes running on that drive and you hotswap then less likely. It can be similar to the reset pc instead of shutdown windows properly. you do it 100x and 99x you get away with it but the 1x you ruin the windows due to data not being written. I add this is a common way why entire Firefox bookmarks disappear.

 

(256) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Unfortunately-I had to go back to IDE mode,because of a few problems-but it was good while it lasted !
A few of my apps.wouldnt work properly despite reinstall and others hunted around for driver installs.
The backup apps had problems and of course the backups prior to the change to AHCI couldnt be used.

Some of this could well be due to confusion caused by the fact that another drive is active apart from the system drive-you picked it immediately-
Cant see any simple way to change it,certainly not with Disk Management-would you know a way?

AHCI did seem faster somewhat,apart from the other advantages.
I get the impression that I could once again revert to AHCI,just by changing the BIOS,as that was enough to revert back to IDE.
The Intel Matrix Controller(Intel iata78_enu.exe driver.) is still installed somewhere,even though it no longer shows up in Add/Remove.
Anyway,your advice and knowledge was appreciated-it was interesting and spot on accurate

So you have already stress tested the o/clock for one hour-great!
In real life that would probably indicate there will be no problems, in my experience.
Previously stress tested my e6600 for 10 hours,but after having to start from scratch after some incident,only stress tested for less than an hour also and having no problems.

edit; re changing drive from active,so it wont attempt to boot etc-Used G Parted under flags management -unticked boot option-now seems inactive.

 

(257) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Thanks for the info on the content protection.

I'm also not sure the price of the E8400 will get much lower because the E8300 was supposed to be $170 I think. That also may mean that the E8200 might be a bargain if you overclocked it a little. I plugged some figures into the PSU calculator using the link that Hairy Coo provided on a 3.6 overclock and ended up with 332watts. I don't need a 3.6 OC on a 8200, 3Ghz would be plenty so I may be able to use my existing PSU with a small OC. If I wanted to go higher I could always get the Corsair or Antec 500+watt PSU's then. Would that be a good idea if the prices were right?

Also, thanks for the update on the DFI board. Both would work for my needs so I guess it all comes down to whether or not the extra heatsinks and better audio are worth $20 more vs. the eSATA ports on the MSI MB.

Re: The QX9775's. That is insane. It would be a very expensive build from the what I've briefly read.

 

(25 Re: Please help with new graphics card

Innnerpeace,

From my experience,as mentioned,the onboard audio codec sounds tinny compared to even a cheap Creative card,so suggest that sooner or later,it would be worth getting a card if you listen to music.
Dont know if a small increase in DAC SNR DBs could be heard,could it?

 

(259) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hairy Coo

Thank you for your suggestion. It looks like they have several cards in the $30 range and they may only take around 10 watts according to the PSU calculator .

I'm not sure what DAC means, I will look it up.

Ok, I found this and will have a read. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital-to-analog_converter

 

(260) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Well i disagree you can buy a Creative 5.1 seperate sound card that wouldn't be as good as certain audio onboard. The cards are basic and provide approx. 85-90db SNR. If you wanted to get the same 8.1 audio and sound chip and SNR above 100 on a seperate sound card you would have to buy a professional sound card costing alot! If you talking of the lower range m/b's that don't dont have great sound then granted but the sound on motherboards is generally better now than the cheapest creative.

If you not going to do profesional recording then there's no need to buy a sound card with high SNR. A good DAC is 24bit good enough for professional use.

I don't know why you getting these problems with applications. If its AHCI it should see the drives and data fine just like IDE. If you had this problem and the SP3 and temp problem it all doesn't sound good.

 

(261) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Yes,the problems could well be something else other than AHCI-as I said, will do a repair reinstall as soon as the final SP3 arrives and try AHCI again,installing at that time.
Little faults are cropping up all the time.

Would you believe that after all the work,yours and mine,in finding a way to enable AHCI on my current system,I accidentally discovered that using Shadow Protect,the F6 function for installing storage drivers can be used when restoring,which actually is logical

I use a Creative Audigy card and must say the sound really is very good and does sound fuller than with the onboards I have heard.
However my experience with onboard sound isnt with my current mobo,but with previous ones,which may have had mediocre onboards-so your opinions would be more comprehensive and up to date.

edit; re SNR-SNR, is a measure of signal strength relative to background noise. The ratio is usually measured in decibels (dB).
The higher the figure,the less background noise.
My point is that once you get to a certain level,the human ear cant really pick up the difference and a certain amount of marketing hype would be going on.
Of course the lower the speaker and amp. quality,the less the difference is percieved.

This is the cheap card I have installed here

 

(262) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hairy Coo,

The card you have looks really nice. It seems better than the one's they make today. Also, thank you for the explanation of SNR. I guess I'll stick with the onboard for now because things are getting tight and I probably wouldn't be able to take full advantage of it because I live in an apartment. FWIW, some of the cheaper cards do have 100db SNR though.

 

(263) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Right that be the Universal Restore feature to restore back onto any hardware not just the original hardware .

I do agree with you still. There is a problem with certain onboard audio and some can be rubbishy. I say if you not happy with the onboard audio then go out and buy a seperate soundcard. I had previously 7.1 onboard surround sound on the infamous Asus P5B Deluxe motherboard and there is definite random hissing and clicking. It's not just rubbish it's a definite fault on this once high end m/b. Despite numerous complaints and driver updates it still there. Just about everybody who has got that board has gone out and bought a soundcard. It's been linked to high cpu resources and not interference. I got a Creative 5.1 soundcard and though it fixed the fault the sound is still inferior. To get a noticeable margin of sound better i would of had to pay $100+. As you will know even if the sound is better certain pc speakers don't transform it into better quality. The difference comes when you do recording.

It depends on what you want to run now and in the future. If you not going to upgrade for a long while spending like $30 more for the 8400 or a quad is justified long term. 3Ghz be plenty if you sure and the current PSU be fine but the new motherboards take a extra 4 or 8 pin PSU connection which some don't always power on if not connected. Does the current PSU have this 4 or 8 pin? Yes it does, ok then go with the 8200 . Glad you got it nailed, narrowed down .

 

(264) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Re SP and storage drivers-can be included during the CD Recovery Environment

as here

That Asus sound card sounds good!!

My next case will be a Thermaltake Kandalf LCS-35c. o/clock under load!!

You've talked me into Water-quieter and cooler


Innerpeace

Keep us up to date with your progress

 

(265) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hi markymoo,

Ok, I'm confused (again). My current Antec EA380 has the 20+4 MB power connector and has a 4 pin CPU connector. It should work with the MSI or DFI boards correct? Or were you talking about something else?

I'm just about ready to start collecting parts. Neither MB is in stock and the memory keeps jumping on and off sale which is a $50 price difference so I'm going to have jump on the deals when available. I'm still not sure if the prices on the CPU's will get much lower. I guess the prices are still going to drop the 20th, but I don't think it will effect the E8400.

The case you are looking at looks cool. Does it have good reviews? It is supposed to be really heavy. If I'm looking at the right one, it's almost 50lbs.

 

(266) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Innerpeace,

Well if you wait a few years no doubt the price will be lower,but according to the Hairy Coo Law,which has never failed me- the moment you buy hardware,either the price drops or it becomes obsolete-happened to me with my mobo
Seriously,I dont know the market-just wait-theres no hurry a few months or whatever doesnt matter.

That Kandalf case is expensive and heavy-has a radiator like a small car mounted on the front door-which is a good idea as others have the radiator inside the case where the hot air would recirculate.
The only design weakness may be the fans still seem to be blowing the heat into the case,but I guess the fans could be reversed .
The mid term idea is that I will really o/clock next time,creating more heat.

 

(267) Re: Please help with new graphics card

yes all sorts of drivers can be installed that way. i think the method i described is just as quick but if the drivers are slipstreamed into the original XP install cd, that is a good long term solution then you not scrambling around for a floppy disk and have to remember to press F6 and at the same time use nlite and make a unattended XP, so you don't have to type in your serial and other customizations.

http://www.asus.com/news_show.aspx?id=10219 yes but quite expensive here from $200 usa but that for the next model up.

Yes it has the 20+4 pin but i was asking if it had the extra 4pin connector as well which it does. That is fine. Some lower Watt or older PSU's don't have that other 4pin connector. your PSU be fine with new boards .

The 8000 and Xeon 3000 series will only drop $2. The Q6600 will drop $43 and the Q6700 $260. The P45 chipset is out in June held back from May. This will add to the P35 chipset Crossfire and DDR3 which both are not worth bothering with.

 

(26 Re: Please help with new graphics card

LOL, I completely concur with Hairy Coo Law. It won't be much longer before I take the bait. I also just read a review on the E7200 and with a simple change of the FSB, it's as quick as the E8500. The cache is smaller though. It should be a fun chip for it's price http://legitreviews.com/article/690/1/

If this is the right case, here is a quote from their site. Also see that link for a small diagram/pic of the airflow about 2/3 the way down the page.

Maybe it has extra 'secret' intake slots. Anyways, it looks interesting and without having to make any case mods.
Here are a few more pics

Ok, I understand.

Cool, I didn't know about the Q6600 price cut. Things are going to get interesting really soon. I hope they can keep everything in stock. I wanted to buy everything at one time and it looks like it's not going to be possible.

 

(269) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Yes i applaud your decision. It is alot fun at first. Once you goto water you won't ever go back to air. If you decide to go with a Thermaltake watercooling kit solution then i would strongly advise against it. Thermaltake are considered poor quality in the land of watercooling. Yes they may look great but the parts are inferior and give average performance. They did use aluminium radiators which when used with a copper cpu waterblock results in corrosion. I don't know if they still do. Decent WC parts will cost about the same anyway. TT give average performance so much that it been suggested might as well stick to air. Anyone who has taken there system seriously has upgraded from TT. The pumps are not noted for being quiet. Also the tubing isn't so thick. Post on any overclocking/watercooling forum that you going to get TT and wait for the reaction. You want your first watercooling setup to be a great one with great performance. I own the original Kandalf case and it sure is heavy, i took the doors off as it looks better without the doors and looks more like the Armor. There is no fan on the side panel but it can be had on the upgrade. I recommend there cases but not there watercooling parts! You can fit your own radiator in the doorway anyway on those cases without any modification needed.

 

(270) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo-

This isnt going to happen immediately-but interested in your comments.

What sort of water kit and case would you recommend?

What intrigued me about the Kandalf LCS was that the radiator was mounted OUTSIDE the case-surely this must be important for thermal performance!

innerpeace,

Thanks for your research,but markymoo wont let me buy the Kandalf!!. I was thinking along the lines of reversing the fans so the heat would be directed into the room,not the case ,which is stupid!!

That q6600 will soon be irresistable the way its going

 

(271) Re: Please help with new graphics card

It is not stupid there's a good reason the fans blow into the case. There is good margin of heat reduction of the water/radiator if the fans inside are pulling the air from outside off the radiator than if the fans were on the other side pushing the air from outside through the radiator. Blowing warm case air over the radiator will raise up the cpu temp. The best solution is fans on the inside of the rad pulling the cold air in. It might not sound better but i have tried both ways. If you mounted the radiator outside and had the fans pulling then yes it be better than internal but if blowing out then not great. If the case is big enough it far better to have the radiator mounted inside for praticality or modify it so it all as one unit. If you don't mind a radiator hanging off the back or on top then that's fine.

A ideal kit i recommend.

Thermochill radiator is what you need. It is deeper has the best heat dissipation and is worth the extra. There is no comparison. There is only 1 reseller of Thermochill in Australia. Thermochill is 2x the price there, shame as the designer lives there. Advantage of a good radiator is you can cool your CPU NB, Graphics card all together without suffering a big temperature rise.

Performance Quality Reservoir Setup - This will last forever won't need upgrading just draining and cleaning every 6-8 months.

CPU Block
DTek FuZion CPU Water Block
http://www.petrastechshop.com/dfuuncpubl1.html
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_87&products_id=392

Radiator
PA120.2
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_2&products_id=6
or
PA160.1 good performance can be fitted in smaller cases
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_2&products_id=5
or
PA120.3 for even lower temps - needs a bigger case
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_2&products_id=1

Pump
Laing-D5 Vario 12v Pump
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_88&products_id=400
or
Laing DDC-Pump
http://www.thecoolingshop.com/product_info.php/cPath/33_57/products_id/1763

Reservoir - takes up less room in a drive bay mounted at highest point, gets bubbles out very quick this way plus easy filling.
Danger Den Single 5 1/4" Bay Reservoir
http://www.dangerden.com/store/product.php?productid=52&cat=27&page=1

Fans
2x D12SL-12 Yate Loon 120mm - for the radiator
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_121&products_id=505

Tubing
10ft MasterKleer Tubing - 7/16" Tubing just as good as using 1/2" performance wise, fits tight onto 1/2" barbs eliminates hose clips
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_3&products_id=94

Barbs
2x 3/8" BSP to 1/2" Nickel-plated Barbs for the radiator
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_91_104_108&products_id=2
2x Barbs (High Flow) G1/4" to 1/2" for the reservoir
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_90_125&products_id=546

Fluid
Feser View UV Dye - UV Green, 50ml + 3 litres of distilled water
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_90_125&products_id=546

Optional Extras not essential.
FuZion Accelerator Nozzle Kit - To restrict flow and drop pressure
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_87&products_id=393
Radiator Shroud
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_4&products_id=10
Neoprene Gasket
http://www.gammods.com.au/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=51

Alternative setup to Reservoir is a T-Line setup which eliminates having a reservoir with just a T-Piece to the top of the case with a fillport. Takes up less space but harder to get the bubbles out and harder to drain/fill like so
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._T-Line.JPG/800px-DIY_watercooling_T-Line.JPG
fillport http://www.christianlykke.net/Lasse/Computer/29-05-2007/CAM_1015_800x600.JPG
I don't recommend T-Line starting out, there is pros/cons for either. Forget about cooling the graphics card until later as it involves another loop which i don't recommend for the beginner unless you want to jump in the deep end.

Cases i recommend to fit 120.2 without modification. Any Thermaltake Armor or Kandalf ior any case with 9x 5 1/4" front drive bays like some Lian Li. http://thermaltakeusa.com/product/Chassis/chassis_index.asp other cases it has to be laid down in the bottom or mounted in top of case. Easiest mod is to cut out a rectangle at bottom of case and screw it down and mount wheels on the case if not so the air can reach and mount the fans on the inside of rad. Like so http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff80/chad_clemmons/Project 832 Stacker/Stacker_832029.jpg No need to cut out fancy octagonal shapes, 1 large neat rectangle will do and can also be done to fit in a Antec P182 at top. How not to mount the fans http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x149/Colapics/Cola_wc1.jpg

other great cases for WC i recommend either for a 120.2 or 120.3
Silverstone TJ07
http://www.silverstonetek.com/products/p_contents.php?pno=tj07&area=usa
CM Stacker 832 SE - check out the side panel fans
http://www.coolermaster.com/products/product.php?language=en&act=detail&tbcate=17&id=17
Lian Li Pc-P80
http://www.lian-li.com/v2/en/product/product06.php?pr_index=131&cl_index=1&sc_index=26&ss_index=67
Lian Li Pc-A77
http://www.lian-li.com/v2/en/product/product06.php?pr_index=212&cl_index=1&sc_index=26&ss_index=65
Lian Li 2000b
http://www.lian-li.com/v2/en/product/product06.php?pr_index=138&cl_index=1&sc_index=26&ss_index=65
and the Antec P190 which has come down in price here.

or you skip watercooling altogether and get one of these...
http://www2.asetek.com/main/page.asp?sideid=391

 

(272) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Wow-you took a lot of trouble setting out the ideal watercooler-thanks and I will study at leisure

Re the ideal fan/radiator placement-obviously it would be where both could access fresh.cool air.

My idea is the radiator placement of the Kandalf LCS,with the fans positioned to blow outwards,away from the case interior.

I didnt make myself clear-I would leave the door open,say at 90degrees,so no case air would be sucked out and only fresh air by and large would be used.I usually have doors open in any case when in use.

Or another place as you said could be on top,assuming there wasnt a top fan.

At the back there would again be interference from inside air.

 

(273) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo

Tell me about it-some prices here are just ridiculous and effectively the locals are subsiding the other markets-but its a small market without much power.

But thanks for listing a local supplier,GAM Mods,not far from home.

That VapoChill Micro Low Noise look like a nice little CPU cooler too

That looks reasonably efficient,but top mount would appeal more to me.

Will study a lot more

 

(274) Re: Please help with new graphics card

I did because if you serious i wanted to save you from what others have gone through. There has been many bought a kit and learnt the hard way. I looked up the price of the Kandalf LCS it's 3/4 the price of top watercooling parts and yes ok you do get the case as well. The radiator is alumunium and mix copper and aluminium and you get galvanic corrosion. It even mentions in this review it aluminium. http://www.modthebox.com/review527_1.shtml The weaker metals get eaten away which would contaminate the water which would result in less effective cooling. This would then require more cleaning. If you read that review the temperature drop was disappointing. It said in the review it will take a long time to put together which means you no better off than buying your own parts. The Kandalf LCS tubing is only 3/8" and the pump is weaker. In the kit i recommend you can budget with a cheaper radiator like a Black Ice or XPCS which is alot cheaper than TC and still get great performance. The only thing i left out of that kit was PTFE tape to go round the barbs to make it more watertight as a comfort, though not needed with 7/16" tubing.

I see what you mean now the doors swing open and the cool air can be sucked from outside without the air going into the case. Even so wider tubing, a superior cpu waterblock,stronger pump and better radiator will give much more performance plus the radiator wont rot and keep the water cleaner meaning better temps and less cleaning. It will carry more heat away amd the radiator would cool it better. If it was me i buy seperate parts and convert your Antec P182. I said my peace .

Yes but that would require a fan grill which would add to the price but looks neat and out of the way.
http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w292/marcus000/P182 Mods/DSCF0008.jpg
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=46681&d=1146427952

or certain triple radiators
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/9629/dsc00396ig5.jpg

You could fit one like this, http://www.swiftech.com/assets/images/products/QuietPower-P180/as-shipped-frontx600.jpg and fit a single radiator such as a Thermochill 160.1 which is not far behind the performance of a PA120.2. This is a good setup with a rad on the back http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j186/amichalski00/3_rad019.jpg with an optional radiator down below that gets cold air from the front or
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/2838/p180proposedsetupqv5.jpg or http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/5123/niceandcleanir0.jpg or off the back like this http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/4197/dsc03117gp5.jpg

one way not ideal lol
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=62985&stc=1&d=1187273352

 

(275) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Once again your hard work,consideration and excellent details are really appreciated-yes I am serious about using WC.
The photos of the install in the P180 case are tempting,but I am more likely to wait until the next build.
The current one probably wouldnt benefit much from WC,as the e6600 cpu is already o/c'd around the limit and thermally and acoustically its performing well.
Its also already outdated -965p etc,not much sense modifying it.

So it makes more sense to start from fresh with a more overclockable CPU and all new hardware in the medium term future.

At this stage a PA120.3 Bundle seems a good solution,may as well do it properly if at all.
Black Ice would have to be imported from New Zealand and probably cost more landed than the equivalent PA120

This intrigues me-how is this done?

Would you believe the Armor LCS complete with WC is selling here for $280(about $us 250)-sounds as if there is a problem selling them!

As said,your help will save me a lot of time and potential mistakes later on!!

ps Is this marki you here

edit-just found out how to wc the GPU etc-with waterblocks of course