Please help w/new graphics card & system build

(226) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hairy Coo,

Thanks, I'm very pleased with Antec . They didn't give me a bit of trouble.

My left side panel with the thumbscrews is simple to attach. The other one gives me fits. I'm fairly gentle with it so that may be the problem. I was going to leave the cage in place, but the temps weren't quite right so I removed it and it helped some. The test will come trying to balance airflow while gaming.

I'll also send the dog sled, but the dogs might get upset without any snow . It's now spring here and normal high's this time of year are around 15C. It did snow for Easter though .

 

(227) Re: Please help with new graphics card

i'm know i'm right. i wouldn't suggest doing something like that unless i'm sure. i know it sounds risky if you new to it. do you know why i'm right? because the manual says so! LOL

now you can breath easy

it not necessary if you enable AHCI in the BIOS and load the AHCI driver when you install XP. the software won't be needed. i was just over emphasizing a point. it will work fine on SATA drives but it wont work on IDE drives.

I suggest this PSU - Comes with 5 year guarantee. pricey but quality,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139001

The advantage if you fit a 3rd party cooler now , you won't have to remove your board again in the future to fit it.

 

(22 Re: Please help with new graphics card

Thanks markymoo, I'm breathing easier now LOL.

I was just reading a post about rails and looking at this PSU.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139004

I see the HX you suggested is greater than the VX series though. What are your thoughts on the number of rails or did the above link cover it?

You do make a good point about fitting a 3rd party heatsink now rather than later being more convenient .

 

(229) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Ran the-a switch,
but the install says-
"computer does not meet minimum requirements for installing this software"
Could this be because of SP3?
Does the Intel Chipset Software Installation Utility have to be installed?
If there are any further problems,may use markymoo's F6 AHCI and RAID Slipstream System,for when I next slipstream the final version of SP3 as a repair install

 

(230) Re: Please help with new graphics card

@Hairy Coo

Yes the Intel Chipset Software has to be installed before. You should always do that anyway. It will work fine on SP3.

Download the Chip ID Util for 965 here.
http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Product_Filter.aspx?ProductID=816

There is a alternative way than using -a

If you do this instead which is part of the method for slipstreaming into the cd. It's also on the motherboard cd under floppy but this way ensures you have the latest drivers.

Run iata78_enu.exe but DO NOT click Next, instead browse to C:\WINDOWS\Temp\IIF\Winall\Driver and you see IaStor.sys. Copy all the files to a safe location to use in future. The IaStor.sys file will be there. When you have copied the files cancel and exit the iata78_enu.exe installer.

 

(231) Re: Please help with new graphics card

The VX series is just as good for cheaper. It might even be quieter. The HX is a modular PSU which cost more but i prefer as i can unscrew each PSU connector and is tidier. You lose a tiny amount of effiency using modular as some of the current is lost through the connectors. The HX is claimed as 3 rails over 50A but its just 2. They still top PSU's. The Vx has 41A and the HX has 50A so both enough.

It's alot hype from the time SLI came out. You only have to concern yourself with the +12V as the +3.3 and +5V add up to 10% of the power used. You better off with a single rail PSU. On a multiple rail PSU If you use a maximum of lets say 10Amps on a 18A rail then if the system needs more power on the other rails it can't use the spare 8A, that's a waste right there which can be critical on a lower PSU. That EarthWatt 380 is claimed as 2 rails but it's actually 1 rail. In the end you will have a total of 31 34 Amps. Look at your PSU label on Total Power under +12V and divide it by 12 to get the total amps. I think it 17Amps per rail but check this.

Watts = Amps x Volts
Amps = Watts / Volts

So for example a Q6600 at 105W would use 8.5A but it will be less like 90 as the voltage drops in windows on idle. So as long as you don't overload each rail you be ok. It good to look at how much can be supplied on each rail. It good to look for higher amps. A decent PSU should provide 18A per rail. Nvidia recommend 22-26A for there 8800GT so if you have 30A on the combined rails that be enough but that wouldn't leave much for the rest of the components. There are some good quality true multiple rails that make claims that if you get a power spike, fault on one rail it will only damage the parts on that one rail and not damage the whole system. Don't add lots of components to one PSU connection. It wise to seperate components like hard drives on a seperate PSU connector.

Here's another PSU calculator
http://web.aanet.com.au/SnooP/psucalc.php

 

(232) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Unfortunately that driver isnt in the Temp files-also did a complete search!

I'll just try to slipstream on the next SP3 install as mentioned, but even that looks doubtful the way its going.


Will do some more checks.

Thanks for your great help!!

edit; a local seller of DFIx48 mobo -(1.00 AUD = 0.916590 USD ) here
And this guy is a well known discounter-wish Newegg would start up locally at US prices!!

 

(233) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

Thanks for the PSU information. Both of the Corsair models look good .

A pic of my Antec PSU sticker can be found here.
You might have to click on it to see it larger. It's the 3rd picture going left to right. The description also says this. "Dual 12V outputs: 12V2 for Motherboard and peripherals; 12V1 for processor".

 

(234) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Well, if you didn't run the install but just dbl clicked the setup file so the blue screen is still showing they will be there.

Great. Is it any cheaper to buy it from a neighbouring country and pay shipping and tax ? edit: is the cost worth it for parts you can't get in your own country...

The Xigmatek HDT-S1283 air cooler in some reviews is giving better temps or equal to the Ulta-120 Extreme and it's alot cheaper.

 

(235) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Your link took me straight to it. 2 rails of 17A each. 17A + 17A = 34A x 12V = 408W / 80% effiency = 324W usable power on the +12V.

 

(236) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo,

As my computer does not meet the standards etc for some reason-that is the message in the Temp file-nothing else, so the first step of the install obviously didnt even put the driver in the temp because of this.

Sometimes the price differences for computer parts here are extreme-but once an item has been well established,the prices are more reasonable,sometimes downright cheap-so generally its not worth the time and effort to bring them in from the States.
Its only a comparitively small market.

 

(237) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hairy Coo

I'm running SP3 v3311 and the temps are all now making sense. Maybe you can try using VirtualPc or VirtualBox and install XP that way that or get another XP on there If you want the files in the setup i can post them.

I notice good thing about that top air hole in the Antec is the TR Ultra-120 Extreme can be mounted, aligned 90 degrees alternatively to the way the fan blows out the back, so the fan can blow out the top for the hot air to escape. The NB heatsink can be tall on some boards and can get in the way preventing, mounting so the fan is blowing out the back.

 

(23 Re: Please help with new graphics card

Something to bear in mind...

There is no performance gains whatsoever in using DDR2 1000mhz opposed to 800mhz 667mhz 533mhz in everyday use only in benchmark tests but what it will do is get to your needed FSB for overclocking. If you overclocking a new Intel 8000 series cpu to 4gig or beyond then you have to have at least 445FSB, which is at least 890Mhz on the memory. This means with DDR2 800 you would have to overclock it, which some might struggle to do this. It best you get the value/performance G.Skill 1000 which gives you the oppurtunity to goto 500FSB without it being overclocked and no strain. Don't buy Crucial Ballistix 1066 memory being raved about this has had problems working right or alot gone faulty. I used to use Corsair but in my opinion G.Skill are better. 2 x 2Gb put's less strain on your system than 4 x 1Gb...

List of actual memory chips used on branded DDR2 memory. The best ones to get and give the most overclock are Powerchips or Micron D9GMH. Those G.Skill use Powerchips.http://ramlist.ath.cx/ddr2/

Track memory prices here.
http://www.dramexchange.com/

 

(239) Re: Please help with new graphics card

This is a good PSU and for the money. Ignore the 2 reviews.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817128012

This is a good PSU but not as good as the Corsair and it's no cheaper.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371002

 

(240) Re: Please help with new graphics card

So, 324W/12A = 27A of usable amperage? Would the 27A be divided by 2 for each rail (13.5A) or is it one rail like you said above? It still should power my next setup fine shouldn't it (not overclocking)?

Thank you for your advice on this . Hopefully the good price on the G.Skill 1000 will continue into April. That is the Ram that I will probably get unless something better is offered. I didn't know about the memory chip brands. The link and the Powerchips/Micron D9GMH advice will come in handy if I choose to go with something else. Nice find markymoo .

What do you know about the Hiper brand? I have no problem with getting a Corsair or Antec if I get a PSU.

 

(241) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Thanks for your kind help-do you have a separate file set up to correct the temp fault-otherwise I intend to carry out a repair install of the final SP3,which hopefully may correct the problems.?

Excellent idea regarding the mounting direction for the fan.

ATM the CPU fan is blowing the air towards the back fan,so it should be exhausting reasonably well.
Also it looks like the memory,right next to the Ultra,would stop turning it around.

Anyway,you certainly are taking a lot of trouble with your advice and research-which should prove very useful for others apart from Innerpeace,in building a computer and generally-myself of course included!

 

(242) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Innerpeace-

Getting towards the final decision time, quite exciting,you will have a top system,excellent components

I have an Antec PSU,so can verify that they are problem free and quiet,but as markymoo said,Corsair seem to be a bit better.
Dont forget buying those new SATA connectors with the right angled heads at the time.
Is your new fan cooling OK?
Generally I found the low settings were whisper quiet,but medium were necessary for optimum cooling.

 

(243) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hi Hairy Coo,

Yes, it's very exciting. Everything is narrowed down to a few great components. I'm still up in the air as far as a processor though. Pricing will decide a lot of it. I know that an E8200 would be more than enough for me and I think the only difference between it and the E8400 is a little speed and the multiplier which I read is important when overclocking. If I could get the E8200 to 3GHz economically (with my current PSU and E8200 stock cooler), I would be happy.

The quad is also tempting, but the price would have to be the same or very close to the E8400. I'm also very open to the idea and would probably prefer the Xeon equivalent to all 3. I like to be different and they may be a tab bit better in quality.

Regarding the fan, I actually removed it yesterday because I'm not sure it helped. I was using the top, rear and front fans on low. After an extended play on Battlefront, my temps were almost the same as using my old case with the side off. I'm sure medium settings would be better, but it is noticeably louder. I also wish I had a remote control rather than crawling around flipping fan switches LOL. I may also need to block off all the cracks and crevices if it would help. I'm also debating if I should tape up the vented PCI blanks though they might help with the gfx card cooling.

Was your CPU power plug long enough to fit behind the MB? My current Antec PSU's plug isn't long enough and I was considering an extension like this or these. However, I don't like the idea of using an extension for such a critical connection.

Edit: spelling

 

(244) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Innerpeace,

I also found as I said that the temps weren't fantastic on low settings,but improved considerably on medium.
Personally found the noise was quite moderate on low,certainly compared to my previous case
Think that the top fan really is needed -its important for exhausting the hot air and maintaining negative pressure,which I proved to myself does work.
Dont really think blocking anything off on the case would be worthwhile-purely extremely marginal.
On the P182 ,there are external fan controls on the rear panel for the top and rear fans in the upper chamber -would just leave them on medium or you could experiment on high if the fans are quiet enough.
Of course what will help somewhat is when you get a super CPU cooler and a new cooler running CPU.
If you really are not happy you can try fitting that middle interior fan we discussed before,that certainly kept the interior and the graphics card cooler for me.
In my P180 case, the PSU cables run direct,there is no provision for hiding them behind the right side.
I should imagine the current PSUs may have longer cabling,especially the Antec range-you could try to find out beforehand,but those extension cables look plenty sturdy enough.

regarding the CPU,the e8200 looks good-it seems to be a replacement for my e6600,but in fact will overclock more.
here
Guess it depends how much you are prepared to spend and how long before the next upgrade after this one-of course the main question is , shouldnt you get a quad core which markymoo favours.

 

(245) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Thats right, but in reality it's only 1 rail of 27A which works out better not the false 2 claimed. If you buy a decent PSU like the Corsair then you don't have to concern yourself too much with this anyway. It parts like graphic cards that uses external power that consume alot which yours isn't. Forget the Hiper! its' not the model i had in mind, it's claiming 580W but only 380W on the +12V rail which is very low. The other 200W is for the +3 +5. My bad. I used Hiper no problems, still a good PSU but that one just too low. It the Corsair or nothing. No better PSU under $100 than the Corsair. The Corsair 550W VX pumps out 492W on the +12V, very efficient and clean power. Good to see you getting the Corsair! It comes with a 5 year guarantee which is excellent. That says alot right there.

These are useful.
http://www.ambientweather.com/p3inkiwaelus.html

Yeah Top Info! D9GKX are also good but need alot more voltage to perform. What will happen as DDR3 goes mainstream DDR2 will start going up but wont be for a while yet. Example my motherboard has only dropped a 1/6th of it's price since 2006 which is excellent but it's because the 965 chipset is less popular but still worthy with lots of features. The newer chipsets are cheaper.

@Hairy Coo
It wont make much of temp difference turnng the heatsink but more for when you can mount a bigger heatsink on the NB. Strapping a 120mm fan to the NB is an effectivev way to cool it try that! A good measure if you can't hold your finger on the NB heatsink for 3-4 seconds then it's too hot and so need to do better cooling.

My own experiences and been researching alot lately as i been out of it and getting reacquainted, plus 4 hours reading forum posts, sharing the good info not just from one source. Asus quality control doesn't seem as good these days and Gigbayte the same. Asus technical support is not got a good reputation but they great at bringing out lots of updated BIOS which is opposite of Abit. I mention customers have been duped $350 false advertising for the Gigsabyte GA-N680SLI-DQ6 with the capability to run Quad Core but no it can't. Gigabyte tells the users to send a picture of the box that says the board supports quad-cores lol....The DFI boards just have more going for them. Waiting delivery . The layouts are better especially for watercooling. There hasn't been anything revolutionary in the last 2 years while away from watercooling. We seem to be at the peak of flow rates and design. It just more pumps and more radiators now.


@Innerpeace the debate goes on...
Type e8400 vs q6600 into Google.

 

(246) Re: Please help with new graphics card

markymoo

Yes,at this stage,when I do the next update on the hardware,will probably carry out all these mods for the cooling!

Thanks for the AHCI drivers,but unfortunately it was impossible to import the AHCI reg. file into the registry " some keys are open by other processes etc",which may mean I would have to slipstream the lot on the next install-anyway I now have all the files and info!

Strange tale about gigabyte DQ6 Seems the way,when companies grow too big,they lose control if they arent careful.

edit; great about the DFI board,which model did you settle on,still the Dark?-should help the q6600 o/clock!!
How is SP3?

 

(247) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Hairy Coo,

Thanks for your reply and the link. I'm Sorry about the confusing info on my fans. My case comes factory with a lower chamber fan and the top and rear fans. I tried adding the old, vibrating fan in the front, upper chamber position behind the filter but it didn't really seem to help on low speed. I've removed it for now.

My desk sits diagonal to a corner so I think the sound get bounced around to me which may cause the medium fan speeds to sound a bit louder. My desk also only has 4 inches of clearance above the case which probably doesn't help with the noise either. When the fans are on low, I could almost swear that I can hear the cpu fan over the others. I guess the sound doesn't matter as all I wanted was a cooler machine which is more important. And from what I have been reading, you are right, the new 8000 series chips will be cooler.

I also forgot your case doesn't have the feature to hide the wires behind the MB . I'm must be getting burnt out on hardware LOL.

 

(24 Re: Please help with new graphics card

innerpeace
by now you are a real hardware fanatic!
I also found the internal middle fan seemed louder than the others for some reason,but if there is no advantage ATM it may be worth considering later with a quiet fan.Low speed is a fairly useless setting generally.
Found I was also listening to every sound initially,but certainly in my case ,figured the case was quieter than most,so I forgot about it and now its just subdued grey noise which doesnt bother!

 

(249) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Thanks markymoo! I'm glad to see I got the 27A part right. Your a pretty good teacher. I'll also avoid the Hiper and stick with either Corsair or Antec. My build budget is getting tight because I didn't really plan on a new PSU. I can always get it later and stick with the essentials (CPU, MB, RAM and OS). It will also be interesting to see what the prices on all components will do this month.

LOL, yes I've seen many discussions. I guess it all boils down to price, availability, how you use your computer and energy consumption. The newer quads and more software taking advantage of multiple cores will eventually end the debate though.

It's also good to hear your new DFI board is on the way. Can't wait to hear your thoughts .

 

(250) Re: Please help with new graphics card

Ok after all that this could be an easier way.

1. Go into the BIOS and enable the JMicron Controller (if not already enabled) and also change the system SATA drive to IDE which probably is already.

2. Boot into windows and install the JMicron driver. You should find this on the motherboard cd or get the newest from here.
http://www.giga-byte.com/Support/Motherboard/Driver_DownloadFile.aspx?FileType=Driver&FileID=2733

3. Shutdown PC, open the case and move the boot drive to the Gigabyte SATA 2 Controller (a re-badged JMicron JMB363) It's the 2 purple connectors. The 6 yellow are the Intel ICH8R.

4. Start machine and enable AHCI in the BIOS for the Intel Controller.

5. Boot into windows. Install Intel iata78_enu.exe driver.
http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Product_Filter.aspx?ProductID=2101&lang=eng

6. Shutdown machine, Go into BIOS, Disable JMicron Controller again (or leave it enabled if you like).

7. Open PC and move the system drive back to original intel SATA (now with AHCI enabled).

8. Boot into windows.

9. Uninstall the JMicron driver.