Paragon Conflicts with McAfee Enterprise?

Discussion in 'Paragon Drive Backup Product Line' started by Beleaguered, Jan 25, 2012.

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  1. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    The Setup
    Paragon Hard Disk Manager 11 Suite (version 10.0.17.13908 ) (paid license)
    Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit, SP1 (version 6.1.7601 SP1 Build 7601)
    Intel Core i7 CPU, 6GB RAM, twin 1 TB disks.
    McAfee VirusScan Enterprise version 8.8, McAfee Agent version 4.6.0.1694

    The Problem
    It looks as if there's a conflict between Paragon Backup Manager and McAfee Enterprise.
    Paragon differential backup will run in Windows Safe Mode, requiring about 2 hours to scan/backup 600 GB on a 1 TB disk, right after running a full disk snapshot (sector-wise backup of all volumes on the disk). Paragon differential backup stalls indefinitely when run in normal Windows operating mode. Turning off all programs that are run automatically at boot time, and all services that can be disabled does not change the result.

    Paragon complementary backup (file-wise increment based on sector-wise full backup) runs, but seem to take 48 hours or so, and it needs to run daily.

    We cannot test Windows in normal operating mode with McAfee disabled, because McAfee protects itself from any intervention except by the domain system administrator.

    The administrator is willing to work with us to add Paragon executables to the trusted programs list, but the Paragon documentation does not explain what services, exe files, device drivers, etc. it will run during a backup. (And of course it is silent on the common problem of getting Paragon to coexist with virus scanning software). Adding Launcher.exe and Plauncher_s.exe to the trusted programs list didn't solve the problem.

    Plea for Help

    I'd ask Paragon tech support, but their 90 day help period has expired. Therefore, has anyone here managed to get Paragon backup working with McAfee VirusScan Enterprise, and if so, how did you do it?

    Thanks for any insights into this vexing problem.
     
  2. seekforever

    seekforever Registered Member

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    What about buying a single license for HDM and use the Paragon support for it?
     
  3. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    Thanks for your reply, seekforever.

    If I understand you, you're suggesting buying an additional Paragon license for Hard Disk Manager and using that license to claim support from Paragon for this problem. An interesting idea. It would be cheaper than the charge for single-issue support. Between us, I don't have too much hope that Paragon would be able or willing to solve the problem, but it could be my only chance.
     
  4. SIW2

    SIW2 Registered Member

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    Just ask Paragon - they will probably respond.

    They seem to have lost interest in this forum - in favour of Twitter it seems.
     
  5. Mech_An

    Mech_An Registered Member

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    @Beleaguered,

    Do not hesitate to contact Paragon Support. They will answer even after 90-days :)

    In addition to Launcher.exe and plauncher_s.exe, please try to add backup.exe to exceptions.
     
  6. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    Thanks, Mech An, for the suggestions and encouragement (thanks also to SIW2). I'll add backup.exe to the list of requested processes, but I will see what Paragon has to say first, as I don't want to hit the system administrators of the college with too many separate requests.

    [Update: I sent Paragon the question 5 days ago. So far the only communication was a request to prove that I had bought the product (which I did). You'd think they would know what processes run during a backup. Unfortunately, you can't even force a crash dump with this program to find out where it stalled.]
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2012
  7. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    Still nothing from Paragon tech support.

    Others struggling with the combination of Paragon Backup and McAfee VirusScan Enterprise might be interested in the following articles. They indicate that the slowdown could perhaps be corrected by adding Paragon executables to the McAfee low-risk or exclusion lists, if Paragon would cooperate in establishing the correct list as Symantec apparently has done (see 2nd article below).

    They also suggest that replacing Paragon with Symantec might be a road to backup and recovery.

    VirusScan Enterprise exclusions (Master Article)
    McAfee Corporate KnowledgeBase ID: KB66909
    Last Modified: February 02, 2012

    VirusScan Enterprise exclusions for Symantec Backup Exec
    McAfee Corporate KnowledgeBase ID: KB68701
    Last Modified: April 09, 2010
     
  8. JosephB

    JosephB Registered Member

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    Beleaguered,

    1. So, did you try adding backup.exe to the list of requested processes, as suggested by Mech_an (who works for paragon) ?

    2. Have you tried running the SysInternal - Process Explorer (and maybe Process Monitor) Tools to see all the processes running when executing the Paragon Backup ?

    3. Are you running the differential backup as a Scheduled Job ? If yes, try also adding the Paragon Pgm "scripts.exe" to the McAfee Exception List.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2012
  9. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    Thanks for your suggestion, JosephB.

    Yes, we have looked at the process lists in Process Explorer and Task Manager. I'll make a note of scripts.exe as a potential problem, but we get the same symptoms whether we launch through the scheduler or manually.

    Before contacting Paragon, we were able to identify processes called "launcher.exe" and "plauncher_s.exe", and the system administrators did add them to the list of processes trusted by McAfee VirusScan Enterprise, but that didn't solve the problem.

    The processes we can find have names like "launcher", and they have blank company name and description fields, so they aren't that easy to identify. Also, we can't be sure that processes running at one instant are the only ones that run during the whole backup process. One suspects that a process called "launcher" starts other processes, but who knows? Moreover, it might not be a simple matter of identifying processes if Paragon inserts layers in the device driver stack, or interacts with a running Windows "service", etc.

    Finally, we can't just create a dump file or attach a debugger to the stalled process, because it is protected against that, so we have no recourse to a stack trace to track down the exact location of the problem.

    So you're right, we probably can come up with a comprehensive list through investigation eventually, but we still hope for help from the company, and we are grateful for your ideas as well.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2012
  10. SIW2

    SIW2 Registered Member

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    I think you have that the wrong way round.

    Since it is McAfee that is at fault - incorrectly identifying Paragon a some kind of problem ( or at least severely holding it up )- then it is McAfee who should fix the error in their program .

    If they can't do that ( and it appears they can't ) - they should then help their own users to find a way around the McAfee error.


    It is not up to a 3rd party ( in this case Paragon ) to try analyze what McAfee is up to - a long and difficult task - especially as McAfee will keep changing their definitions and updating their program.

    Nevertheless, one would expect that Paragon would supply McAfee with details to help them sort it out.
     
  11. JosephB

    JosephB Registered Member

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    Beleaguered,

    I agree with SIW2, it sounds like the problem is on the McAfee end and that McAfee support should be talking directly with Paragon support to sort out the conflict.
    .... Of course, your assuming that the conflict is between the two products. Based on re-reading your initial thread, it sounds like you have *not* tried running Paragon Backup in Normal Windows Mode with McAfee totally Disabled on your pc. Am I correct ? If yes, I would say that you need to do this, in order to ensure your conflict is not related to some other software on your pc conflicting with Paragon. ... I would suggest that your domain administrator/IT dept should coordinate and disconnect your pc from the Network and Fully Disable McAfee on your pc and let you test the Paragon Backup. If you still have a stall problem then you would know that the problem is a conflict other than McAfee, but if stall goes away then it really is a McAfee conflict with Paragon.

    P.S. One other thought.... does McAfee pgm provide Proactive "HIPS" like Real-Time Guard protection on your pc, besides just Real-Time Guard Scanning ? ... If so, you may need to add the Paragon Processes to hopefully a mcAfee Exclusion list for Proactive HIPS Protection ?
    ... Also, are you running any other Security software on your pc that might be imposing additional HIPS prtection and conflicting, like a FireWall Pgm with HIPS protection on your PC o_O
    ....Also, do you have another vendor's Imaging pgm installed on the pc ? ... Multiple imaging pgms installed on the same pc can conflict with each other.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2012
  12. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    That is true, we cannot remove McAfee VirusScan until at least the end of the academic year. We have disabled every service that can be disabled, and eliminated all start-at-boot programs and obtained the same results in normal Windows 7 operating mode. That is more or less the same as safe mode, except for the presence of McAfee, so we don't have proof, but we do have reason to suspect that there is a conflict between Paragon and McAfee.

    We do not run any other security software, nor do we use encrypted file systems.

    At this point, all we are asking of Paragon is information about their product, or an account their users' experience in the McAfee VirusScan Enterprise environment so we can make it function.
     
  13. Beleaguered

    Beleaguered Registered Member

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    Paragon has replied (!) with the following list of programs for the McAfee VirusScan Enterprise trusted programs list. It might take a while to test, but I'll follow up if this works out.

    Please find program's installation folder (usually "C:\Program Files\Paragon Software\Paragon Hard Disk Manager 11 Suite (English)\Program") and add the next files (all backup modules) to the trusted programs list:
    • launcher.exe
    • complexbackup.exe
    • fbackup.exe
    • ibackup.exe
     
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