Outpost fans: what other firewall would you choose?

Discussion in 'other firewalls' started by Caratacus, Mar 15, 2005.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Caratacus

    Caratacus Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2003
    Posts:
    164
    Location:
    Australia
    I own a (Xmas special) licence to Outpost Pro and I really like the firewall. But unfortunately my machine is one of the unlucky few that Outpost BSODs on - despite all efforts to remedy. This on a computer that has never otherwise BSODed.

    I have trialled LnS (very impressed) and Kerio 4 (I like it a lot). Both have performed flawlessly.

    I keep hoping that Agnitum will fix the problem, but in the meantime I need a new fw, and so my question is addressed to Outpost fans:

    If you couldn't use Outpost, what alternative firewall would you choose, and why?
     
  2. I was trialing Outpost and liked it a lot....but I found out with Nod32 set up
    to Blackspear's settings it sometimes slowed my surfing to a crawl...I am now
    trying Netveda and like it alot..I wrote some basic settings in Netveda link.
    It took me far longer to write then set up....Once you're familiar with the
    lay-out ....it shouldn't take you more than a few minutes to set up.
    What I did't like about Outpost...dnstester and a few other leak tests...poked
    right thru it....Out of the box it blocks most of them....it runs good with
    process guard, nod and regdefender and all the diff. apps I have
     
  3. escobar

    escobar Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2005
    Posts:
    3
    If I count Outpost out then the choice of alternative is quite obvious.
    I´m using Kerio 4.12... it performs great and it always has, on my system.

    The way I see it ... Outpost pro and Kerio 4.12 are probably the two best solutions for normal home users... The choice is merely a matter of "taste"

    Kerio´s free version seems more attractive than Outpost´s though! I haven´t tried the Free Outpost FW. Has anyone compared the two?
    I find such a comparison interesting, as many home users should be pretty well protected with a well chosen FREE FW solution. Or wutt?

    Escobar :D
    "always keep a smile on that face"
     
  4. Diver

    Diver Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2005
    Posts:
    1,444
    Location:
    Deep Underwater
    The free Kerio 2.15 just happens to be a classic. Years ago I used one of its ancestors and then got behind a NAT and forgot about software firewalls until recently when this explosion of for profit malware got going.

    There is an excellent support forum over at DSLR. One of the Gurus, BlitzenZeus shows up around here on a regular basis. He is the author of a very effective base rule set.

    What I like about Kerio 2.15 is high performance and just enough app control to stop likely problems without the constant user intervention required by something like Tiny 6.x or some of the other firewalls with advanced application control.

    It is free, so you do not loose anything by trying it. I have enoug faith in it that around here I have set my NAT to DMZ my machine just to see if everything was as tight as it should be.
     
  5. Paranoid2000

    Paranoid2000 Registered Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2004
    Posts:
    2,839
    Location:
    North West, United Kingdom
    You need to exclude Outpost's logfiles from scanning - see Resolving High CPU Utilisation Issues with Outpost and Agnitum KnowledgeBase 1000030 - My system slows down while running an antivirus app and Outpost for more information.
    DNSTester is a tough one, but Outpost can be configured to block it using the "Application DNS" option detailed in section D1(b) of A Guide to Producing a Secure Configuration for Outpost.
     
  6. tahoma

    tahoma Registered Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2003
    Posts:
    228
    if i for some reason couldnt use outpost again id unplug the cable
     
  7. hayc59

    hayc59 Guest

    ain't that the truth!!
    but Sygate if I had to??
     
  8. hollywoodpc

    hollywoodpc Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Posts:
    1,325
    Tahoma . Too funny ! lol . Oh boy . If the latest Kerio runs well , that is a good choice . In my opinion , if money was not an issue , Tiny . Difficult learning curve but , excellent firewall . Kerio is good . Protection still leaves a little to be desired though . Configurability not as nice as Outpost but , that is beside the point . For the best protection outside of Outpost , Tiny is where I would go .
    BTW , LnS is ok . Honestly , I think their protection is very good , it is light , but not enough bells and whistles for me . Hope I did not confuse this issue . Good luck
     
  9. tahoma

    tahoma Registered Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2003
    Posts:
    228
    seriously, ive tried every firewall there is, and then some and in 2000 or 2001 i stumbled upon this unfinished alpha/beta of a firewall called outpost. decided to try it and loved it right away, despite its flaws and unfinishedness. this was just what i had been looking for. but it wasnt even beta (or maybe it was, long time ago) and caused probably hundreds of BSODs, but i stuck with it, signed up as a beta tester, sent hundreds or bug reports, lived through a year or more of beta testing, crashes everything. finally outpost 1 was released and i as lucky enough to be rewarded with a lifetime key for all my trouble( as did other wilders members im sure). and look at outpost now.

    anyway, back to the issue. i dont like sygate. it just feels too 'heavy' for me somehow, i dont know what it is, id rather use ZA. i think look n stop looks interesting but complicated, and the tiny/keiro ones have some useful features. id prolly go for one of those if i had to. problem is, afaik, outpost is the only product that can block activex and other content on a per site basis (feel free to correct me on this one) and thats a really important feature for me. i also like kaspersky anti-hacker i must add. sure its lacking seriously compared to other firewalls but it feels kinda good to use. maybe its the rule creating wizard that is similar to outposts that makes me like kah. but they have got some serious work to do if its gonna be a top firewall one day. but im keeping a close eye on it with me already being a kav guy

    oh and i just tried r-firewall yesterday. looks like somethimg made by a kid to me. but luckily that kid seems to have decided that he wants his firewall to be like outpost. and it wasnt too bad really. with some ( a lot of) work r-firewall could become really good, has nice features (yeah the same features as the outpost plugins actually)
    also yesterday tried the netveda thing discussed a couple of threads down. seemed awfully geeky. but if ur a real geek that havent found a firewall u like yet id give it a try
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2005
  10. hollywoodpc

    hollywoodpc Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Posts:
    1,325
    Outpost also has a little something called open process control . Something overlooked by many . That tool alone is almost worth the price . Sorry my friend . The issue is if you HAD to switch . I humbly disagree with Tahoma . LnS is not really difficult . Just not as simple as download and go like some LnS fans want you to believe . Tiny is very difficult to learn but , it is exceptional on all levels . Kerio is not as difficult but , not as good at protection . Boy . You are having a hard time now I bet . Good luck to you though . Tough decision . No Outpost and No Tiny ? Time to unplug for me too
     
  11. INTOXSICKATED

    INTOXSICKATED Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2005
    Posts:
    485
    Location:
    Suburbia Hell
    if there was no outpost pro 2.5, i would have to use zone alarm pro 5.5.

    j/k i didn't drink that much! ;)

    maybe sygate pro 5.5 cuz i still have a license for them, but i'm still waiting for the newer version of the pro 5.6 edition to come out. 5.5 seemed to slow my computer down a bit. so i would seriously have to give the new tiny 2005 release a closer look and i think tiny is what i'd probably end up with.

    good thing i don't have to make this decision tho, i'm very happy with outpost!
     
  12. se7engreen

    se7engreen Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2004
    Posts:
    369
    Location:
    USA
    My three favorite firewalls (at the moment) are Outpost, Visnetic, & Tiny. I have licenses for two of them and really considering getting one for the latest version of Tiny. I thought Tiny dropped the ball with early version 6 but I really like what I see with this latest build.
    So I guess without Outpost (or Visnetic + sandbox) it'd have to be Tiny.
     
  13. no13

    no13 Retired Major Resident Nutcase

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2004
    Posts:
    1,327
    Location:
    Wouldn't YOU like to know?
    hmm...
    choices...
    Jetico - free
    Zone Alarm Pro 4.5 [only if you have the license... will the license for 5.5 work in 4.5?]
    Kerio 4.1.2 - Free... no need to pay, unless you like adblocking [which is VERY good in Kerio IMO]
    Kerio 2.1.5 - Free [not for Serious App control]
    LnS - paid [phant0m's rules are very good]
    WinSonar - Free [backup only]
    Netveda Safety.net - Free for home use. Very decent.
    ---
    I used to have Outpost when it was just released v2... a couple of BSODs, then the next build was stable but indecipherable [noob back then ;)]
     
  14. Diver

    Diver Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2005
    Posts:
    1,444
    Location:
    Deep Underwater
    P2K-

    I missed that post about the problem with firewall logging and and excluding the log file from the AV realtime scan, so now I understand your comments about wanting to be able to exclude files and that being a disadvantage of f-prot.

    However, I consider that to be an Outpost issue more than an AV issue. I have never had that anything like that problem, and I have tried several firewalls here long enough to find something like that.
     
  15. no13

    no13 Retired Major Resident Nutcase

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2004
    Posts:
    1,327
    Location:
    Wouldn't YOU like to know?
  16. It's funny how FWs are easy for one person to figure out...and a bear for the
    next person...I noticed how above... one person said Netveda was geeky.
    I am far far from a FW geek...but that's the only FW I have used, that
    I've been half way able to figure out.....and have it do what I want.
    So just goes to show......Whats one mans trash...is another mans treasure.
     
  17. hollywoodpc

    hollywoodpc Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Posts:
    1,325
    You are correct sir ! And glad you found one you can use . That is the hard part . Being able to figure out how to use it . Good luck . And let us know how it is working for you if you have the time . Thanks .
     
  18. lynchknot

    lynchknot Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2004
    Posts:
    904
    Location:
    SW WA
    Boils down to priority. Does Outpost cause the blue screen conflicting with another app's driver, or is the other app conflicting with Outpost?
    I'd keep Outpost and find an alternative to whatever conflicts.
     
  19. Thanks Hollywood....Needed those kind words.
    So far I've had very good luck with the program. After poking around and
    getting familiar with it...I managed a rule-set ...that on my PC passes 21
    of the 24 leak tests.....3 of them dont work on my machine.
    mbtester.....outbound and firehole I think.
    It has great logging...and filters...installs and uninstalls No problem.
    Gets along well with all my apps.
    I posted my rule-set on the other thread..it should only take a few minutes
    to do..For a free FW....it offers a lot of features.
    The only minor complaint....it seems redundant...seems like you can do the
    same thing...many different ways.
    What I would like....is for one of the many firewall gurus, with far much more knowledge then I have ... to give it a fair trial, put it thru all the loops.
    Then explain to us non-tech types...how good or bad it is.
    Whooooooooo knows....it may be the "Holy Grail" of free FWs.
    For certain......Only the Shadow knows
    Boy did I date myself there..
     
  20. hollywoodpc

    hollywoodpc Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Posts:
    1,325
    We need more posts like yours . Well thought out and you are right again . You never know how good something is until is is tried .
     
  21. The price is sure right.....that and a little effort to learn..should get a person
    a fine FW capable of doing many things for many different type of users.
    People with families...Solo users...small home lans...up to corporate level..
    but thats the paid version....as far as I know....it is the same thing.

    What a lot of people don't seem to understand...what seems easy to them
    may be a real struggle for the next guy....and vice versa...I'm not a dumb man
    but sometimes if feel like the worlds biggest "maroon" struggling with all the
    terms....icmp packets....http..udp...stp....atms....etc. Makes learning DOS
    seem easy now.

    So very much depends on what ones budget and comfort level ..what is..or
    isn't important ...using freebies...set and forget....or spending hundreds of
    dollars, and hundreds of hours making their PC into a virtual fortress.

    Some seem almost slaves to their machines....only used for solitare...and posting on security forums.... used for nothing else...but it is a tank.

    Some people seem to get by...using windows fw....and a wing and a prayer
    and somehow manage to along okay..There is no perfect setup...program/
    programs that will give total protection...but some will always be chasing
    the rainbow...looking for the newest, bestest most expensive thingy that
    rows down the pike....Sorry to break it to you....But there is no Santa Claus.

    If man can make it.....man can also figure away around it.

    When someone asks a question in a forum....you should try the 3 W's

    What is his/her budget level.
    what is his/her comfort zone ie: knowledge
    what is he/her trying to get done

    Jamming ones views, opinions....or favorite app. down ones throat
    doesnt really help.

    Before I get off my soap box....Let me just state..
    I prefer to think I'm the master of my PC...not it, the Master of me.
     
  22. Caratacus

    Caratacus Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2003
    Posts:
    164
    Location:
    Australia
    Thanks, colleagues, for your thoughtful responses. I can see I have some trialling in front of me: Tiny, Visnetic, Sygate, Kerio 2.15, maybe Jetico and Securepoint (I've run Norton and Zap Pro and don't want to go back to them). Anyway that should keep me off the streetsand out of trouble for a few months! And maybe in the meantime Outpost Pro will run ok on my machine.

    Cheers!

    Caratacus
     
  23. lynchknot

    lynchknot Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2004
    Posts:
    904
    Location:
    SW WA
    Yeah, get off your soapbox because you seem narrow-minded. Some of us like to "chase the rainbow" because it's fun.

    I come here to learn what is best and how to use it. This is a security forum not "dave's discount apps" it's about the best software not about "Some people" this "some people" that. I don't care, I'm here to learn. Whether expensive or free does not matter to me. I want to know if it works. Stuff on my computer is that important.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2005
  24. Diver

    Diver Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2005
    Posts:
    1,444
    Location:
    Deep Underwater
    Caratacus-

    Visnetic is nice, I have tried it under the 8signs name. Not application aware, but there are a few tricks you can do with it. Does not work well with eMule, in the sense that a wide range of UDP ports must be open for eMule to work right, and other things might be listening on that range. However, I do not know of any other application that is as poorly behaved as eMule in that regard. If you are willing to go the non application aware route, try CHX-1. Free for personal use. There is a learning curve as it is very different from every other firewall in its rule structure. However, once you understand it, it is a real sports car of a FW.
     
  25. hollywoodpc

    hollywoodpc Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Posts:
    1,325
    So very much depends on what ones budget and comfort level ..what is..or
    isn't important ...using freebies...set and forget....or spending hundreds of
    dollars, and hundreds of hours making their PC into a virtual fortress.

    Well put my friend and GOOD LUCK Caratacus
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.