Old, out-dated, no longer maintained -- BUT I like it!

Discussion in 'other firewalls' started by bellgamin, May 26, 2015.

  1. bellgamin

    bellgamin Very Frequent Poster

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    I run Win XP SP3. (I also drive a 15-year-old car & watch old John Wayne movies with a Beta Max).

    Ergo, my favorite firewalls are as described by the title to this topic -- old, out-dated, etc. They are Kerio 2.1.5 & Sygate 5.6.2808.

    Granted - neither of these oldies is the equal of modern-day FWs BUT if you were somehow *compelled* to use one or the other, WHICH of the two (Kerio or Sygate) would be YOUR choice -- and why?
     
  2. EASTER

    EASTER Registered Member

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    You're not the only one who has the corner on old favorites :p

    I have a collection of only XP Pro SP2 hard drives (stored in closet right now) just waiting for a new box to put them right back to use again.

    Did i forget to mention that i also use Windows 98 FileChange Alarm app on Windows 8 (flawless! w/beep!)

    I watch a few John Wayne shows (Red River etc.) and also Jimmy Stewart :)
     
  3. MisterB

    MisterB Registered Member

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    I'm using Sygate pro on all my Xp systems, real or VM. It runs fine on top of the built in Windows firewall and adds great outbound connection control.
     
  4. WildByDesign

    WildByDesign Registered Member

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    Without hesitation, I would go with Sygate. But that is only because in those days Sygate is what I had the majority of my experience with and didn't use Kerio for very long. I know that there was a lot of passion for both Sygate and Kerio though. I miss those good old days.
     
  5. act8192

    act8192 Registered Member

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    Kerio because you can control which applications have rights to localhost. Sygate doesn't have that feature.
     
  6. zapjb

    zapjb Registered Member

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    Back it the day Sygate all the way. Because it was so easy to control & see what it was doing.
     
  7. Behold Eck

    Behold Eck Registered Member

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    Would have to go with Sygate.Great app with good features and an attractive GUI .......ah those far off halcyon days.:rolleyes:

    Never used Kerio but then again never heard anything bad about it either.

    Running PrivateFirewall,ST(v2)HIPS and HMP on my XP SP3 systems due to info gleaned from someone on this forum not a million miles away.:thumb:

    Regards Eck:)
     
  8. Kerodo

    Kerodo Registered Member

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    Sygate might be the better choice, since Kerio 2.1.5 had and still has a fragmented packet hole/issue, which we all discussed quite a bit back in the old days, both here, and on another forum (DSLR). I think someone in a newsgroup somewhere confirmed the hole in Kerio 2.1.5 by actually firing fragmented packets at it, which passed thru. Anyway, here is an old thread on the subject from this forum, and Googling something like "Kerio 2.1.5 fragmented packet" should get you more information also.

    https://www.wilderssecurity.com/thre...-5-weaknesses-fragmented-packets-bsod.100040/

    Kerio does give you more control with the rules, but Sygate is probably a better choice due to the above Kerio issues....
     
  9. Dermot7

    Dermot7 Registered Member

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    @bellgamin In case you haven't got it, there is still a guide available for Sygate Personal Firewall: http://www.saunalahti.fi/~jarmos3/SPF_eng/SPFGuide.html

    Not sure if it's still possible to obtain the full (approx 140 page) guide mentioned here though:
    http://www.techsupportalert.com/freeware-forum/security/218-sygate-update-too-old-too-late.html
    Just thought this might be a help for you :) but unfortunately I only had a short look at Sygate a few years back, and don't run XP here now.
     
  10. zapjb

    zapjb Registered Member

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  11. Nebulus

    Nebulus Registered Member

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    I'd take Kerio over Sygate any day. I think it has the most logical rules interface I've seen in any firewall. :)
     
  12. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

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    I still use Kerio 2.1.5 and will continue to until I'm forced to IPv6. I'd choose it over Sygate because of its ability to control localhost traffic. If you use filtering proxies or Tor, that control prevents bypassing and a lot of leaks. Regarding the fragmented packet issue, I've yet to hear of any way to assemble these fragmented packets into anything useful. If you're behind a router, you'd never see them.
     
  13. ichito

    ichito Registered Member

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    Hi Bellgamin...
    as regard to quoted above your question from that thread
    https://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/which-security-pair-is-better.376530/#post-2494202
    I had to find light, silent and efficient solution to protect XP on very weak machine at this time (only ca 0,9 GB of RAM) It's my wife's laptop who is...I hope he won't read such text :)...the user "even less than untrained". I've tested few free firewalls without proactive modules (e.g. NetVeda, Filseclab...this one I like very much) and finally I decided to leave Kerio. It's very light, don't makes unnecesary "noise" for user and give me...as I've read...enough protection at home.
    One year ago after ending of support of XP I added only Seconfig XP to make system more "hermetic".
     
  14. StillBorn

    StillBorn Registered Member

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    Defensewall may as well qualify as that 1969 Boss 429 Mustang (or a Mercury Cougar Eliminator, anyone) that blows both of the aforementioned firewalls out of the water. Sure, the OP's question stipulates two and only two firewalls. But when an alternative has been tested to be at least vastly on par with the modern day stuff and still relevant; while perhaps off topic, one would be remiss in not mentioning a clearly superior product. Defensewall for 32-bit OS can harmonize like the Beatles and fill in for Porcupine Tree as the second act. Ease of operation, indisputable security... rock on Defensewall! Slap on Shadow Defender and the best freebie AV/A-Malware that money doesn't have to buy and that's about as good as it gets. Moreover; in my irrelevant, insignificant, and inconsequential opinion-- Defensewall would rule out any further consideration for an anti-executable and Appguard as posed in the (OP) venerable bellgamin's "Which security pair is better?" thread.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2015
  15. Behold Eck

    Behold Eck Registered Member

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    Ghostwall was very light and set and forget but I just wonder did it really have any great proven advantage over windows own ?

    Regards Eck:)
     
  16. zapjb

    zapjb Registered Member

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    I used it on XP only.
     
  17. bellgamin

    bellgamin Very Frequent Poster

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    @ StillBorn - I used DefWall for quite a while but never took the time to become adept in its use. I now run a couple of security programs (one is AppGuard) that I DO understand fairly well, & they shield me from pretty much the same types of threats as did DefWall, PLUS I feel much more comfortable in using them. So... all I need is a basic outgoing Firewall.

    @ All - based on comments here & other research I have done, I think my choice will be Sunbelt FW 4.6.1861.0 dated c. 2004. I found that Sunbelt took over the old Kerio FW, & the Sunbelt FW became the updated version of what used to be my beloved Kerio. I said "updated" -- which (I realize) does NOT mean "state of the art." BUT, I suppose it's a newer Kerio so that it's a bit more up-to-date than 2.1.5. At least I hope so.

    So far the Sunbelt FW is as light as Kerio, & its basic configurations are 99.9% the same as Kerio 2.1.5.

    In addition to the FW, the Sunbelt FW also has Network Intrusion Prevention (NIPS), and HIPS, and Application Behavior Blocking. I have disabled these because, as I have read elsewhere, these "Pro" capabilities are turned-off after 30 days, & it becomes simply a Firewall.

    IN THE MARKET - If I could find someplace to buy a license for Sunbelt FW, I would do so. I like to keep the HIPS/NIPS/BLOCKER capabilites -- they are fun to tinker with. If anyone has a license that they no longer use, & they would like to sell it, PLEASE PM ME. I would love to buy it.

    OR -- if anyone has a source for downloading a copy of 4.7 beta of Sunbelt's FW, I would very much appreciate a PM.
     
  18. aigle

    aigle Registered Member

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    Hmmm.... as I remember Sunbelt Keio was a source of constant BSODs.
     
  19. bcsman

    bcsman Registered Member

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    @bellgamin...I have a copy of Sunbelt firewall 4.7.5.0 I'm not sure if this is the beta or not, think I have it installed on an old hard drive somewhere. Not sure how to get a copy to you, it's 5.7 MB but maybe we can figure it out.....maybe send as an attachment to an e-mail??
     
  20. act8192

    act8192 Registered Member

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    You don't need a licence. They've gone free long ago. Anyway, see PM.
    Enjoy!
    Did you notice that you can make IP groups and that you can edit Log & Alert flags right on the main screen? These are conveniences I like. And yes, it's just like Kerio.
     
  21. bellgamin

    bellgamin Very Frequent Poster

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    @ aigle -- Hallo! Long time no see. I have been running Sunbelt for a few days -- steady as a rock so far. We shall see what we shall see, wot?

    @ bcsman -- I got a PM from another kind soul whereby I just downloaded & installed 4.7.4 beta. I wonder if the 4.7.5 contains any significant changes? If you would please be so kind, send it as an email attachment to: william at tisdale.us.

    @ act8192 -- AFAIK the free version was actually a 30-day trial version of their NON-free version. After the 30 day trial ended, the NIPS/HIPS/Behavior blocker capabilities ceased to function. After that, it was a "free version" -- but with reduced capabilities. That is one of the reasons why I wanted the latest beta -- those capabilities do NOT cease after 30 days.

    @ All -- so far the Sunbelt version of Kerio is running smooth. Very familiar controls for a Kerio user. Process Explorer reveals negible CPU usage. It's playing nicely with my other running security apps (AppGuard, ERP, MB Anti-exploit).

    Man, it's sooo much fun playing with FW software (because I always do an image beforehand). THANKS TO ALL for coming out to play with me. (^_^)
     
  22. MrBrian

    MrBrian Registered Member

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  23. bellgamin

    bellgamin Very Frequent Poster

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    @ MrBrian -- VERY helpful review. Thanks! I had the 4.6.1861 but replaced it with 4.7.4 beta. Hopefully, the HIPS will continue working after 30 days.

    @ All -- Sunbelt became Vipre. The Vipre FW *might* be yet a later version of what used to be Kerio. Unfortunately, Vipre does not sell the FW separately from their security suite. That suite includes an antivirus & other stuff that I don't want.

    QUESTIONS for anyone now using Vipre -- (1) Does the FW seem roughly similar to the Sunbelt/Kerio FW? (2) Can everything be turned OFF -- except the FW?
     
  24. act8192

    act8192 Registered Member

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    4.7.4 still has in warning.log a message about update, with no effect on the functioning. 4.7.5 corrects it. I believe it's the only change. (Few months back I had to reimage, and it brought back 4.7.4 and too lazy to change at this moment)

    It's a totally solid firewall, and nothing will get disabled, don't worry.
     
  25. act8192

    act8192 Registered Member

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    I recall many complaints from users on the now-gone sunbelt forum that VIPRE ruined the firewall. They stripped all the good stuff that people could do in the Sunbelt firewall.
     
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