NSA has direct access to tech giants' systems for user data, secret files reveal

Critics question whether NSA data collection is effective.

http://www.cso.com.au/article/465878/critics_question_whether_nsa_data_collection_effective/

Putin: Edward Snowden in Moscow airport but will not be extradited.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/25/edward-snowden-moscow-vladimir-putin

 

Actually, the 2005 NYT article that blew open the Bush warrant-less wiretapping, was the work of leakers Thomas Tamm (DoJ) and Russell Tice (NSA). Drake was actually supplying UN-classified info to the 9/11 comission - *as he was ordered to*. They just assumed he was the leaker, and initiated a witch hunt. The government could prove nothing, and was forced to drop all charges...and they got screamed at by the judge. They tried to save face by asking Drake to plead to one measly charge that carried no penalty. He was so broke at that time, and fighting that last charge would have taken so much longer, that he agreed. He did nothing wrong, and was ruined for it.

PD

 

Wow. that's heavy stuff. I just finished the judge ruling transcript link

So a government employee was burned to the ground because it was necessary as some ritual sacrifice, it seems.

 

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...id-leakers-should-be-shot-then-he-became-one/

Interesting stuff.

 

Indeed.

I wonder if he was/is on Wilders

 

Interesting indeed. It doesn't change the fact that he did something helpful to everyone, but makes me wonder even more about his real reasons for leaking info from NSA...

 

I have my doubts, lol.

 

He shed light on practices enough of us already knew were going on, but it may turn out that he's made things worse. Is anyone really being fooled into thinking the FISC, NSA or any of them will be more "transparent" because they got a pie to the face? They're just going to lock down even tighter, which is what the NSA has said it's already working on. Leaks are still going to happen, don't get me wrong. But don't sit there and think U.S, U.K or any other citizen "showed them" or won anything.

 

Part of the current feed on the guy instead of the leaks.
But a colorful chat image. Some dirty colors though.

 

That's because the more that comes out on the guy, the less "white knight" he looks. The NSA and others need to be taken to the whipping post, no denying that. But, for one thing, they aren't going to change what they do. For another, again, Snowden's actions and reasoning are becoming more suspicious. Did he do the right thing? Perhaps. Did he do it for the right reasons? That's still being figured out.

 

Questions like those demonstrate that the government is succeeding in its attempts to make this about him and not what was revealed. All of that is a distraction from what should be the real issue.

 

Perhaps, but they are valid questions. They shouldn't get away with what they've done nor be ignored. But, neither should he be seen as a morals hero and go unquestioned if things don't look quite right. Both issues have more questions than answers.

 

They aren't valid questions at all. He could be Hitler for all I care, what matters is what he exposed.

noone_particular is correct, the media has a specific goal - to make you ask the wrong questions, and keep you reading articles about his girlfriends youtube videos, and other nonsense that's irrelevant.

It doesn't matter what Snowden has done in the past, present, or will do in the future. What matters is the NSA.

 

Of course the NSA matters, but so does he. Come on, you don't think it's a bit screwed up that a guy who once upon a time decided leakers should be shot, supposedly got his job for the express purpose of leaking? See, this is the problem with situations like this. One side decides screw the leaker, we should light the pyres for the NSA. Another side wants to focus solely on Snowden. Both should be focused on, and that's just that.

Personally I'm beginning to believe that Snowden will be in U.S hands soon. Assange and Wikileaks is just using his situation to keep Assange talking, Hong Kong couldn't wait to be rid of the guy, and Russia will throw him out just as soon as Putin gets done having fun with the U.S government (Putin is loving the situation, but wants the guy out of his hair). Ecuador can't give the guy asylum until he gets there, and he has to have permission from another country to start with, which he hasn't gotten (this is all assuming he's even still in Russia..no one knows but Snowden and Russia). If he is still there, you can rest assured that Russia is breathing down his neck to make a decision. Putin likes this little side entertainment, but eventually political deals and other aspects of being a world leader are going to have to be focused on. He's not going to risk too much for too long over one guy that doesn't even belong there.

But anyway, yeah, we can agree to disagree, but the guy's motives and what he's doing now is rather important. Although, I admit that we're hitting that "I'm over it" phase with the media and the populations, because the guy is slowly disappearing from the news..and NSA related stuff is picking back up. What are they saying about the NSA? The same crap I already said and many others knew, that it's business as usual for them and they don't intend to stop. Meanwhile the Army is blocked from The Guardian, and so on. The government wants their boy, but Mr. Troublemaker didn't stop them from doing jack.

Edit: Just wanted to add that I'm amazed this thread is going on this long while remaining, what I feel is at least, relevant. There's no point in discussing what tools we can use to hide, because we can't, and politics is at the very heart of this whole mess. It's not a "tech" or "security" issue whatsoever. It's a rights issue and the lack of them. I've mentioned it before, but Snowden is just a player in a very big game. A game that can't be properly discussed without going into "no no" territory.

 

Army restricts access to The Guardian in the wake of NSA leaks.

• http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...ess-to-the-guardian-in-the-wake-of-nsa-leaks/

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/27/big-brother-public-private-partnership-nsa

 

From 'The Guardian'; "NSA collected US email records in bulk for more than two years under Obama" link

"NSA inspector general report on email and internet data collection under Stellar Wind – full document" The Guardian link

 

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/...c-issued-from-london-embassy-has-no-validity/

"Ecuador: Snowden travel doc issued from London embassy “has no validity”

So now he can't even seek asylum there.

In keeping with NSA-related talk, a bit of a history lesson:

http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/06/ibm-stretch-nsa/

"Today, the NSA has PRISM. In the 1960s, it had STRETCH."

 

IMO, we can't afford to just "hide" or settle for trying to hide some communications or activities. If we fail to oppose this as a people, we for all purposes are approving it. The only rights we'll retain are those we actively stand up for.

 

That's exactly right. It will keep happening if we get angry about it for a few weeks/months while it's in the news, and then we go about our business. The problem is, that's exactly what the American public as a whole tends to do. Once it's out of the newspapers and off the nightly news, we stop caring. Of course the way things have been heading here, actively standing against something gives us labels we wouldn't have had 20+ years ago. Back then we would have been annoying little buggers. Now we're domestic terrorists and other BS things.

 

http://www.dw.de/report-nsa-spied-on-eu-institutions/a-16915813

 

http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/29/4477646/nsa-reportedly-bugged-european-union-offices

 

Revealed: secret European deals to hand over private data to America

 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-national-security-agency-a-global-superpower/5338989

 

@Dermot: No shock there, that's pretty much standard for these agencies. Trust me, Washington offices of American offices have the same bugs. Everyone bugs and spies on each other, it's just the way that world operates.

@0stradamus: That's politics 101 I'm finding the whole thing rather entertaining. The pet projects of everyone are getting outed, and they are doing everything they can to make sure the NSA looks worse than GCHQ and vice versa, Russia, who has one of the worst spying operations against its citizens in the world, is laughing their butts off, Germany is fidgeting while pointing their finger at the U.S, hoping that the BfV and BND's own programs don't get a spotlight shone on them. Meanwhile barely a whisper is being utter about the programs being prepared in India, that will make the NSA salivate. None of this stuff is "just one of those things" in history, there is much more to come and even bigger plans.