[Microsoft]New Antimalware Engine is planned for release on 18 May 2011

Thanks for clarifying. Now I better understand what you (and others) were getting at, and I have no dispute or issue whatsoever with what you are reporting.

I agree that the "latest" updates are not immediately available and even via the "manual" method there is normally a lag of several hours from the time of the "update" before it is available.

That said, in our case we have both found MSE to be a satisfactory alternative (for us) to Avira and Avast, the AV's we switched over from a year or two back.

Thanks for taking the time to clarify the info above. Much appreciated.

 

This is false. MSE will update once a day regardless of your Windows Update setting granted you have the WU, BITS services enabled and running. I have already suggested to Microsoft that they have a fix option in the MSE UI if it detects WU, BITS services set to manual or disabled. Hopefully...

The way I see it, it's only an optional update since MSE downloads it daily on it own. So if you invoke WU you have an option to install the latest one if you want. I don't know if that will reset MSE's 24 hrs update cycle though.

True. But you have to consider that MSE is free and with that, servers might get clogged up when updates are distributed several times a day. Other Free AVs also have update restrictions for the exact same reason. Besides, Microsoft has other in-built layers of security up its sleeves like UAC, Smartscreen, DSS, etc as compromises.

It's actually nice of Microsoft to allow these update hacks (registry, scheduler) like Avira (creating several update jobs in Free). Actually only savvy users will know and do this. Ordinary users don't care. I think they don't even open the MSE UI. But of course let's not abuse this.

This is like disabling Liveupdate of Symantec. lol. Let's just say WU is part of MSE. Microsoft wants to keep it simple rather than creating another update process for MSE and purchasing and setting up update servers just for it. Maybe for premium users. But since MSE is free let's keep it simple and not redundant. Less is more, in benefits I mean. A lot (of problems and confusion) arise from complexity.

Maybe WU should have an option to transfer that to Important updates or remember and auto-install some Optional updates like that way you hide updates? Hey I think Microsoft stalks and listens. But that would be redundant and might conflict with MSE's own updating. I don't even know if they fixed the conflict when you go to WU and install updates then MSE suddenly updates. They both use windows installer hence the conflict at that time!

Now, I did experience MSE not sticking to its 24 hrs update cycle and I didn't install the optional update or manually invoke update through its UI. So I guess that was a glitch. It works properly the next cycle (day) though. I haven't experienced that after the recent engine update though. The engine update seems to have fixed the MSE systray icon not being green immediately on startup. And yes the engine update was bigger than previous ones. I think the database was optimised and redownloaded? Maybe thats the reason for the system and MSE being snappier? Although I have to admit that there are other AVs that have an edge against MSE on system responsiveness.

 

No, it is not false. Microsoft Security Essentials will check and automatically install updates each 24 hours. I never said it won't automaticaly update. It just won't automatically update as soon as the definitions updates are available. That's totally different.

So, if Windows Update downloads MSE definitions, considering they come labelled as Optional, then Windows Update won't automatically apply them.

Where is the false statement?

Again, MSE will automatically update malware definitions each 24 hours. Any malware definitions arriving via Windows Update will need to be manually installed by the user. Optional updates aren't automatically applied, hence they are Optional.

Yes, it's nice... if you're aware of them.

And, you're right, and it was something I already mentioned: Only technical users would know about such hacks.

All the others would be running an antimalware app incapable of struggling with malware. It's already a hard fight... I can't imagine with 1 update each 24 hours. Just me saying...

Unfortunately, Microsoft also removes from the basic Windows versions features like SRP and AppLocker. I know that average users wouldn't know how to set them, but users like us could do it for them... and then explain how it protects them... But, no... Bummer...

Most also disable UAC, because they consider it annoying. Or, they just click Yes/Allow to everything. You know, for how greater security improvements Microsoft introduces... nothing of that matters... if the users cannot understand them. That's the big failure.

The thing is... MSE updates should never be labelled Optional. Why would be malware definitions updates be labelled as optional? It doesn't make any sense to me, but OK. It's what it is.

Well... they created the mess... Let them solve it.

 

Okay, my bad maybe i misunderstood. But you said "have Windows Update either set to manually check for updates or download them, but not apply them" then updates won't be applied regardless of what kind. Hence, I thought you were talking about how your WU setting affects MSE's utilisation of WU update servers (tunnel)...

Again also, I think it's labeled as Optional since you have MSE to get those updates once a day on its own. You don't need to go to WU in order to get the update. In a gist: It's up to you if you want to get the update that you don't have to hence Optional.

Well MSE doesn't only depend on signatures so... You're forgetting that it's not only a scanner.

Yes the user is the weakest link. The sad thing is they don't read the prompts and just click. I guess even if Microsoft includes a security pamphlet of some sort, the user won't read it. But I think, Microsoft is doing what it can to protect its users as painless as possible. Painless for the users that is.

You can spam them here: https://feedback.microsoftsecurityessentials.com/

 

Any changelog?

 

My point is that, regardless of the 24 hours update period, if the user has Windows Update set either to download but not apply updates or set to download and apply them, Microsoft Security Essentials malware definitions, which Windows Update does grab them from Microsoft servers, won't be automatically applied, when they should.

The question is: If they arrive via Windows Update, when WU checks for updates, they should arrive as Important, which would make WU automatically apply them. Not arrive as Optional.

This would, IMO, make MSE malware definitions more "up-to-date". I say this, because I believe WU does check for updates on a daily basis, and everytime the user reconnects to the Internet. At least, this was what I experienced by monitoring Wireshark the other day, when looking for something else.

Why should they read some alert they don't understand how it works, what it is for? Do you really think that when an UAC alert appears that most users know it means something is requiring administrative rights, and that means messing up with the entire system? No, they don't.

Microsoft did reduce the UAC's protection scope in Windows 7, after many started to criticize Windows Vista's UAC.

The problem is not UAC, don't take me wrong. The problem is most users do not understand it. Most do not understand the concepts Administrator account and Standard User account. For them, an account is an account. They just want something to use, and want to be able to do whatever they want to do, without restrictions and annoyances. If they could understand the real purpose behind standard user accounts and UAC, something could change, but until then... I just don't see how.

One way Microsoft found to also help protect its users was MSE. But, the way it updates it's freakish, IMHO. You have your opinion, which I totally respect... But, I have mine...

Nah, I won't spam Microsoft.... I don't want to be sued...


Cheers

 

No, there isn't one usually. And as the new engine has been released, closing this thread.