Kav 5.0.383---NEVER AGAIN

The main problem is when I looked at the backup Kav makes It shut the comp down just as I looked up at it and I couldn't see what it was. But when I went to restore the comp with the restore disc's it wouldn't do a non destructive restore it stated that the operating system could not be restarted because four system files were missing but it didn't say which ones so I ended up doing a full reformat and restore. So I know it did delete those files but I don't know which ones. So all I can relay is what the end results were and what the cause was but not the flies that were removed. So unless it happens to someone else we will never know what happened because I will never have Kav on another of my computers. I really wish I could have given the file names to Kav labs, they would probably have liked to have them. Well thats it i am outa here, the thread is all yours now. I have done what i could, I posted that it is a possible problem to watch out for.
surf safe
bigc

 

Hi Bigc,

Something certainly did happen on your machine. The question is what? If it was simply that KAV was deleting system files, then it must have happened on all of the XPSP2 machines that were updated with the latest version of KAV. However, it apparently did not happen (as far as I can tell from the forum discussions). What did happen? Well, we probably will never know, since it appears to be a unique occurrence on your system. However, I will be definitely be on the lookout on all of the KAV and related forums, since this is a serious problem if it is ever replicated on any other XPS2 machine. Thanks for the heads up.

Rich

 

Sorry to your problem BigC, I have been running the new version for two days now and have done 3 system scans set to max with no problem on XPHSP2.
I am set to prompt but have not got the first prompt yet.
Hope you get to the bottom of it though, I do not want to have the same experience.

 

Hi biggc

Do you think that your problems are only concerned with Kav v. 5?

I use Kav v. 4.5 for scanning on demand my system (with SP2) and I've never had the same problems?

Do you think that any problem may depend on viruses definition quality?

 

I also try different antivirus all the time and had another problem.
I have installed kav many times,but a couple of weeks ago i installed the latest version then.The computer just went into rebooting itself,tried to start,and then went into a rebooting again.I used an image to restore.I will wait till version 6 then try it again

 

Welcome to the club.. I'll never install a KAV on my system ever again.. There is some bad programming in that thing, not to mention mad amounts of junk signatures.

VBA32 or Dr.Web are the only ones I trust anymore.

 

I fully support The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 19 “Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.”

But, bigc73542; especially since

* you are a Global Moderator
* you are NOT a newbie to AVs
* you can’t exactly tell what happened

I’m a bit shocked of your postings.

I have run KAV Personal Pro 5.0.20-5.0.372-5.0.383 for the last three months: and I’m running XP SP2! I have not experienced what you describe.

I have NOT experienced that KAV “comes up with false positives once in a while.
...crap signatures.... I had a FP for 1 or two days (should be a Trojan Horse), but as you know KAV has an awesome update frequency. The mentioned file was caught by a specialized anti-Trojan SW to be a Trojan. I had to fight for several weeks before the changed the db signature.

On the other hand KAV notified me about a real Trojan that was ignored by the specialized app.

Quote: “There are several antivirus programs available that detect almost as well as Kav”. I’m sure you know that other people and other organisations have a deviating opinion..

Richrf has a good point; “then it must have happened on all of the XPSP2 machines”.

I don’t know this forum very well; at least bigc73542 has managed to warn me. “Don’t believe everything you read on Wilders Security Forums.

My personal advice; be a bit more humble.

BTW, during the last 20 years I have used several AVs but I’m not declaring I’m an expert.

 

Hmm... i installed the new KAV 5.0.383 (Personal Pro) on my Win XP SP2 system, hasnt detected a thing. Installed since yesterday morning. Computer's been on all night (GMT).

 

Bigc - is this reproducible?

I have installed KAV 5.0.383 on a clean WinXP sp2 install and can't replicate your problem

Ned

 

What happened to bigC doesn't need to be general for all XPSP2 computers with KAV 5.0.383 installed.
Computer programs contain numerous combinations of "if" statements and nested "if" statements.
Each time a combination is true, the program will execute certain instructions for that specific combination.
However when a combination occurs SELDOM and the programmer made a mistake there during the programming, the program will execute the wrong instructions for that specific rare combination.
A program can run well for years until it meets a rare combination with a bad programming.
After all computer programs are written by people and people make mistakes, even programmers.

 

ErikAlbert, you are dead right... Every single computer has different environment...

 

fosius,
Thanks, that's what I was trying to tell with my poor English.
As an analyst, I have the advantage to live in both worlds : the user world and the computer world and programmers make as many mistakes as users, who do a different job.
I'm not an expert in anything, but I have a general knowledge.
Besides that, I have been a programmer during 10 years and ONE mistake in a complicated "if...else/nested if...else statement" in a program, can have serious consequences.

 

Hi.
Sorry to hear that.
I always wish to set them that I can decide what I need to do with infected files.
Unfortunately sometimes there are no such options for some anti-virus programs. Take McAfee as an example, I have tried this porduct and I cannot find such simliar options exist. And it seems it will delete files immediately if it thinks the file is dangeorus.

Urrrgh...

 

I agree. For example, BigC's machine could have been infected with viruses which KAV finally caught. If handled manually (as the default KAV environment suggests), KAV may have been able to clean the machine without causing the major issue (at least the user would know which files were infected. This is conjecture, but I don't think we will ever know. It could be that the ability to automatically remove files during a cleaning should be suppressed, for this reason, but I am sure other users have their reasons for wanting automatic removal.

However, given the circumstances, it is doubtful, that it was simply the fact that the database had bad system file definitions. If this is true, then the same "false positive" would have been indicated for all XPS2 machines. I think the experts on this forum would concur. Such a basic error, such as a bad signature, normally shows up very quickly on several machines. Happens all the time of products like Spybot, Ad-aware, and even Ewido. We'll see if more comes to light on this particular problem.

Rich

 

i have had problem like this twice once with norton antivirus that deleted one of my win32 files and had to format coz i could not us ethe computer and the same happend with pest patrol and had to format for the second time.

But i have never had thghis problem again and never had the proble with kav.

 

BigC, you are already familiar with my story, horror story, when I purchased KAV, but others may not be.

I purchased KAV in February, version 5.??, and immediately had my system hosed by their #&%& Alternate Data Streams. The ADS remover that KAV has on their site did not work. It took three weeks to recover my system and it was you, BigC, who came to the rescue by emailing me another ADS remover product.

Yes, being a full licsensed owner, I emailed KAV tech support about this, never heard from them. Until KAV makes an easier to use, safer product, AND OFFERS BETTER TECH SUPPORT FOR US PAID CUSTOMERS, KAV shall never touch my system again, I don't care how good it is WHEN it is working.

Acadia

 

BigC

Sorry to know about what happened with your computer.
I have been using last version of KAV 5 Personal Pro with XPSP2 installed, fully patched, and had no problems at all. I am using the redudndant databases. Of course some FPs are flagged as riskware. However, I have KAV configured to prompt me on action, so deleting files is never an automatic option.

Maybe you shoud have done the same. Of course it is too late now.

On the other hand, and without knowing if it is KAV's fault, a know of a friend who, after deleting automatically some files flagged by KAV, was unable to start the computer again next morning. When booting, he gets the message that a system file is missing (ntoskrnl.exe). I do not believe that KAV would flag and remove this file. On the other hand, he is running a pirated version of XP Pro, and I do not even know if he has SP1 installed.

This friend of mine is on holidays now, and I am waiting for him to return, as I offered him my help to solve the problem. The worst of the hipothesis is a reformat. Hope it is sufficient to replace the damaged ntoskrnl.exe.

Last, but not the least, I just would like to remember that in such a case like yours, it is only natural that we put the blame on the last application we have run. This according to my experience is not always the case. It is a pity that after reformatting, the information provided by the Event Viewer won't, of course, give you no hint about what happened.

Were you unable to boot even in safe mode?

Regards

Rui

 

Any security software is supposed to protect any kind of users, from newbies upto security experts.
If scanning without prompting isn't safe, remove the setting from the software.
If heuristic scannings report false/positives, it means they aren't safe because the majority of the users, will delete false positives as well and damage their own computer without even knowing it.
Is that the basic idea of security : causing more trouble for users ?

Isn't that ridiculous : a security software, in this case KAV 5.0.383, that damages a computer seriously.
Malwares are supposed to do that, NOT security softwares. No way to whitewash this.

 

Sorry to hear about that bad experience. I had never tried KAV myself and don't think I will now. I have been running Avast! for a short time and so far I am satisfied with it.

 

Rich,

Not necessarily. Only the basic end result is known in this case. The files in question could as likely been software or hardware specific drivers or services local to bigC's configuration as, for example, native OS files. The lack of widespread reproduction of the symptoms only suggests that they were not native MS OS files. No more, no less.

Blue

 

I guess I have installed (& uninstalled) 12-15 different AV's over the past year- all I do is run scans, play with configuratons and see what others' opinions are - primarily on WSF. I definitely don't understand any technical aspects. Occasionally I run into minor problems and glithches in the process, but nothing of the magnitude BigC experionced. I have been running a trial of KAV 5.0.372 for several days with default settings without stubbing my toe - yet.....

I do appreciate the head up of these posts and do image & backup regularly in case anything really bad happens (as well as cross my fingers!).

Rob

 

Hey BigC (and everyone else, too ),

I was about to buy KAV Personal Pro V5.x to replace an expired KAV BO for Windows Workstations when I thought I'd give the KAV 6.0 Beta a try.

Wow . . . no way did I like this program. Felt bloated, slow, and too much like MSoft's One-Care Beta (which I tried and deleted after 2 hours on a different computer).

When I read that KAV v5 programs will be "merged" into the KAV v6 interface, I went out and bought McAfee Viruscan 2006 (v10) instead.

Glad I did.

Jim

PS: Win XP Pro SP2 fully updated on a P4 3.0 H/T w/1G RAM, no other A/V program installed

 

If you disable real time protection against Network attacks, when you install, this problem will not happen.

It is due to a conflict with your FW - you are not supposed to run KAV's Network protection if you have a software FW.

 

hi BigC,

So sorry to hear about the problems you experienced
upgrading Kav, I consider you to be a far more advanced
and knowledgable computer professional than myself, and
I guess bottom line is computer configurations can vary,
and doesnt matter how much experience you have problems
can happen, glad to see you back online.

Regards,

Wake