Judge cites use of secure email Riseup as a potential terrorist indicator

Discussion in 'privacy problems' started by Minimalist, Jan 11, 2015.

  1. Minimalist

    Minimalist Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2014
    Posts:
    5,060
  2. Minimalist

    Minimalist Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2014
    Posts:
    5,060
    http://motherboard.vice.com/read/were-11-spanish-anarchists-arrested-for-using-secure-email
     
  3. Veeshush

    Veeshush Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2014
    Posts:
    643
    This doesn't help my theory that half of Wilders are being profiled as terrorist.
     
  4. Palancar

    Palancar Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Posts:
    1,592
    While these were nice reads, the implications are very frustrating for a fellow activist of sorts! It actually makes me think along the same lines of "nervousness" while using TOR. Its a big reason for why I go to a vpn chain before TOR.

    I just hate the notion that you would only want to be "encrypted" if you are hiding criminal activity. All I can say is that if they take all the time needed to "get to me" somehow, they are really going to be disappointed with what they find. I just want to be left alone and remain private. Is that really so much to asko_O
     
  5. marzametal

    marzametal Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Posts:
    731
  6. Carver

    Carver Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2006
    Posts:
    1,827
    Location:
    USA
    He seems to be saying to encrypt email means you have something to hide, IMHO not worthy of someone who has so much education.
     
  7. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    It's a very practical concern. Nobody must have tools for resisting state power :(
     
  8. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    3,798
    This is worrisome. I have to wonder about this as well.
    Having a book is illegal? The quoted part of the statement could mean anything. It described most factories, businesses, etc. Being internally organized is criminal? Unless Spain has some law that expressly bans these things, this looks to be all insinuation and innuendo.
     
  9. hawki

    hawki Registered Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2008
    Posts:
    1,955
    Location:
    DC Metro Area
    Who said anything of having so much education?


    Born in the town of Alora Malaga 3 agostro 1962, Gómez Bermúdez became a judge, as some members of his family did , while only 24, and in 1989 he was appointed magistrate.
    But there are also occasional shadows, since his appointment as Presdiente of the Criminal Division of the National Court which was in check for years in his career. Furthermore, his second wife, Elisa Beni, was dismissed from her post as Director of Communications of the Court of Madrid after writing "Loneliness of the Judge", a book that raised a stir.


    "http://translate.google.com/transla...rsonaje/javier-gomez-bermudez/372&prev=search
     
  10. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    3,798
    This is starting to sound like a scene from a soap opera.
     
  11. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    No one expects the Spanish Inquisition ;)
    ~ Removed off Topic Link ~
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2015
  12. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    3,798
    That's almost an incentive to open an account with them. If for no other reason, just make it clear what I think of their power and their abuse of it.
     
  13. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    This is all so silly. I'm sure that Riseup runs very-well-secured email services. But by no means does it provide "secure" email services like CounterMail or ProtonMail (or those promised by the Dark Mail Alliance). Riseup does run Tor relays and a Mixmaster remailer, but that's totally separate from their old-school email services.
     
  14. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    3,798
    I find it hard to believe that using a "secure" e-mail is a crime. If that's a crime, where does hosting your own stand?
     
  15. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    I suppose that it depends on where you host it. If it's easy to find, snoop and take down, no problem. If it takes some work to compromise, you're obviously a terrorist :rolleyes:
     
  16. driekus

    driekus Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2014
    Posts:
    489
    Lol, based on this I would definitely be profiled as a terrorist or criminal.
    They will be so disappointed when they spend all that money trying to unravel the web ive made. My secret spaghetti recipe needs to be protected. :)

    Waiting for the US to go down similar lines; if you encrypt and protect data then warrantless searches become legal.
     
  17. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    3,798
    If using encryption and secure e-mail makes you a terrorist or a criminal, I can only imagine what using and modifying an OS so that it doesn't store usage tracks would make you. Push it far enough and they could label you the Anti-Christ, except that they've already taken that role.
     
  18. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    Spanish law is based on the Napoleonic Code. There is a presumption of guilt, not of innocence. That is, defendants must prove beyond reasonable doubt that they are innocent. Even US law seems to be moving that way.
     
  19. noone_particular

    noone_particular Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    3,798
    Maybe. In the US, I see it different. What is legitimate or allowed depends on your net worth. What's criminal for you or me is allowed for the rich. In the US "justice" is a commodity, a purchased product. Forensics has become evidence for sale. It's all about the money, how much can you give the state. If you can't afford it, there's no justice. I'd wager that in Spain, corporations can use "secure" e-mail and strong without being labelled as criminal.
     
  20. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    Yes, no doubt.

    I just wrote about this issue on the cypherpunks list, in reference to
    https://stallman.org/articles/why-we-need-a-state.html

    Stallman opines therein:

    | Above all, we need a state in order to have democracy, which
    | is the system by which the many non-rich [aka beta, weak,
    | clueless, stupid, etc] join together to overcome the power
    | of the rich [aka alpha, powerful, skilled, smart, etc] and
    | thus deny them control over society.

    I agree, but only provisionally, and only if the alphas don't control the state. However, alphas typically do end up controlling the state, and that's the fatal defect. What's needed long term is conversion of betas into gammas. With enough gammas, the state will arguably wither away. But I'll be dead long before then, so I focus on the process.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Psychological_Inventory
     
  21. Chuck57

    Chuck57 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2002
    Posts:
    1,422
    Location:
    New Mexico, USA
    I think using secure or encrypted email, encrypting your OS or sensitive files etc from outside snooping (in my case the NSA here in America), maybe people all over the world are beginning to be fed up with their governments snooping on them. They're only elected officials, not rulers.
     
  22. Minimalist

    Minimalist Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2014
    Posts:
    5,060
    David Cameron pledges to target encrypted messaging after Paris attacks
    http://www.cnet.com/uk/news/david-cameron-pledges-to-target-encrypted-messaging-after-paris-attacks/
     
  23. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Posts:
    6,029
    Right. There is clearly no right to privacy in the UK.
     
  24. Minimalist

    Minimalist Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2014
    Posts:
    5,060
    This is probably just showing in which direction Obama - Cameron discussion on Thursday will go. Prohibiting encryption for common people so government can control us. "Safety" before liberty...
     
  25. Palancar

    Palancar Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2011
    Posts:
    1,592
    Although the USA is headed that way, its going to take quite awhile before that would have much chance of passing in the states. The newly seated congress is not going to put that on the desk of POTUS anytime soon. The large corporations will not easily allow for "security services" to be able to view their journals. I would be surprised that France's companies might consider it. Just can't see it happening.

    In Gov't controlled schemes the "abuse" becomes reality because eventually someone that can "push a button" (eavesdropping where they shouldn't) will do so. Its human nature and frankly we all know it to be true. Why deny it?