Is it possible to stream youtube videos anonymously?

Discussion in 'privacy technology' started by DesuMaiden, Apr 7, 2013.

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  1. DesuMaiden

    DesuMaiden Registered Member

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    It is way too unanonymous to stream youtube videos with any browser which isn't routed through a strong proxy like Tor or JonDo. I don't even think a vpn is enough to prevent google from building a profile on me.
     
  2. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

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    Unless you're leaking through DNS or cookies, I doubt that Google can profile you when you're using a VPN. They can profile your taste in videos, however, and maybe correlate that with prior streaming ;)

    Chaining two VPNs, or using a fast two-hop VPN like iVPN, will give you better streaming than Tor or JonDo :) And anyway, if it's on YouTube, I can't imagine why it matters very much ;)
     
  3. Mman79

    Mman79 Registered Member

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    There's pretty much nothing on Youtube to watch that requires you to hide. Plus, yeah, don't go watching stuff through TOR. You're either going to have to enable Flash, which kills the point of using TOR to hide your IP and such, or use HTML 5 viewing, which admittedly I don't know enough about to say whether it would cause anonymity issues (my guess, yes it would).
     
  4. Taliscicero

    Taliscicero Registered Member

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    VPN, No YouTube account, SSL Version of YouTube "HTTPS EVERYWHERE", NoScript with default settings for YouTube. Flash Cookie Cleaner on FireFox/Chrome close.
     
  5. DesuMaiden

    DesuMaiden Registered Member

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    How would I prevent DNS leaks or cookies from leaking?
     
  6. Taliscicero

    Taliscicero Registered Member

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    You have to go to your Adapter settings, and change the DNS manually.
     
  7. DesuMaiden

    DesuMaiden Registered Member

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    Instructions please.
     
  8. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

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    What OS are you using?

    Do you want to learn how to use VMs?
     
  9. DesuMaiden

    DesuMaiden Registered Member

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    How does this help?
     
  10. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

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    Maybe I misunderstood your question. You say that you want "to prevent google from building a profile on me." The answer depends on what you mean by "me". If you used a VPN chain with a fresh VM, Google could at most (if it managed to tag your VM) build a profile on your new pseudonymous identity. But connecting that with your true identity would require gaining cooperation of VPN providers.

    However, if you actually want "to prevent google from building a profile on" even a pseudonymous VM, you'll need to use Tor (or maybe JonDo, which I don't know). That way, you'll look the same as every other user, so there's nothing to tie a profile to. To be sure, you'd want to use Tails, and reboot before watching each video. That way, you could be totally confident that Google had not managed to tag the system.
     
  11. qwax

    qwax Registered Member

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    You might have a look at this setup, two vpnś host and vm.
    If you use just a vpn in the host , make sure at least to use a fresh browser.
     
  12. PaulyDefran

    PaulyDefran Registered Member

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    DNS Leaks have been covered, a search should find the info. You basically go into your ethernet/wifi adapter's ipv4 settings and set: 1. A staic IP, and 2. actual DNS addresses like the German or Swiss Privacy Foundation, or Chaos Computer Club, etc... Then visit dnsleaktestDOTcom.

    PD
     
  13. DesuMaiden

    DesuMaiden Registered Member

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    Why a fresh browser?
     
  14. Mman79

    Mman79 Registered Member

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    If I understood the comment right, you need a fresh browser to keep past cookies/website data from being read.
     
  15. qwax

    qwax Registered Member

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    I meant a fresh install with a new profile if firefox, i personally would not rely on deleting coockies, i suspect google has perhaps several methods to "recognize"a user.
    also make sure geolocation is off.
     
  16. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

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    I wouldn't use the same machine for both pseudonymous and true-identity work. We can't be certain that even Tor-hardened Firefox can wipe all tagging methods.

    At a minimum, do your private stuff in a VM, and use two VPNs, one on the host and another in the VM. Alternatively, use a Tails VM, with a VPN on the host, so you connect to Tor through the VPN. If you want to visit sites that block Tor exits, use Whonix and run a VPN on the workstation that connects through Tor. Alternatively, use the approach that I've posted on Wilders with pfSense VPN router VMs and ra's Tor gateway. I worked with happyyarou666 in https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=339051
     
  17. qwax

    qwax Registered Member

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    The op wants to stream youtube ; Tor is not all that suitable for this, too slow and you have to install flash ,which can be a privacy threat, as you say, two vpnś would work.
     
  18. adrelanos

    adrelanos Registered Member

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    In general, Tor is currently the most anonymous network. All other networks are less secure. At least that's the consensus from the anonymity research community. [1] You need a very specific or weaker threat model to justify the other anonymity networks.

    The disadvantage of the Tor Browser Bundle (TBB) is, Flash will leak your IP. To solve this (and many other issues), Whonix has been developed by me. [2] It's currently your best bet to use Flash anonymously (or pseudonymously). Pretty much all aspects how to use Flash anonymously over Tor without any leaks have been documented. [3]

    Speed will indeed be an issue. I recommend to start the Video and press pause. Wait some time until the buffer filled and press play. (Or even better, not using Flash at all. Use html5 where it goes and download the other videos to view them, but that wasn't the question here.)

    You can still trade off anonymity for speed. Suggestions have been already given in this thread. Using a VM behind one or multiple VPN-Gateways is certainly more anonymous than no protection at all and may be sufficient for at least some people.

    [1] http://freehaven.net/anonbib/
    [2] https://sourceforge.net/p/whonix/wiki/Home/
    [3] https://sourceforge.net/p/whonix/wiki/BrowserPlugins/
     
  19. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

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    Indeed!

    Yes, avoid TBB if you want Flash.

    Whonix is very east to install and use, and seems very secure. However, I still wouldn't trust Firefox (even hardened by the Tor Project) to prevent all potential tagging/tracking. However, upon reflectiuon, using Whonix and rebooting the workstation VM between sessions (defined according to your risk model) would be just as secure as using the Tails LiveCD as a VM and rebooting between sessions.

    In either case, you'd use a VPN on the host if you want to hide Tor use from your ISP etc.

    I've watched videos via Tor. It worked OK, but with occasional stalls.

    Another possibility is tweaking the Tor setup to use only fast relays. I suspect that would still be more anonymous than multiple VPN, but perhaps adrelanos has a more reliable opinion ;)

     
  20. adrelanos

    adrelanos Registered Member

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    No, I don't think I have a more reliable opinion. It's recommend against by the Tor developers. My crystal ball tells me, that it's safer than VPNs, but don't rely on that.
     
  21. mirimir

    mirimir Registered Member

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    Fair enough ;)

    Tor developers recommend against VPNs too, I think.

    As I understand it, limiting Tor to fast relays increases vulnerability to adversaries who can run many fast relays. You're hosed if an adversary controls all of your relays :(

    The same might be true for VPNs, of course ;) And VPN paths are much easier to trace than Tor paths, I think.
     
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