I guess for the gazillionth time, W8 or not? Specifically...

Discussion in 'other software & services' started by ratchet, Oct 3, 2012.

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  1. pandorax

    pandorax Registered Member

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    Not. It simply sucks. Besides, you don't even have to install it to conclude. Just look at it, watch youtube video to see its mechanism and stupidity. Customers should punish them by rejecting their stupid product.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2012
  2. Victek

    Victek Registered Member

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    A Youtube video might suffice. It's worth checking Windows 8 out one way or another since I believe it will be possible to buy new computers with a "downgrade" to Windows 7 (at least from online OEMs such as Dell) after "8" is released. I don't know if that's an option if you buy a PC with "8" pre-installed and discover you don't want it.
     
  3. Robin A.

    Robin A. Registered Member

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    How is a "downgrade" supposed to work? If 8 comes pre-installed and one wants to change to 7, is it necessary to install it? Or do the two versions come pre-installed and is it possible to switch between them without reinstalling?
     
  4. Victek

    Victek Registered Member

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  5. wat0114

    wat0114 Registered Member

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    If Enhanced Protected Mode (EPM) is going to work as described here:

    -http://www.julien-manici.com/blog/ie10-new-sandbox-enhanced-protected-mode-windows-8/-

    then it will be necessary to fallback to classic protected mode to run Flash or Java content or any plug-in for that matter :thumbd:
     
  6. Hungry Man

    Hungry Man Registered Member

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    Enhanced Protection Mode sounds really overbearing.
     
  7. If true, that will make EPM fairly useless for end users. What will happen when a not particularly computer-savvy person visits a hostile website?

    "Hmm. This website has a Flash video. Come on, show me the video."

    Click. Click. Infect!
     
  8. wat0114

    wat0114 Registered Member

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    Yeah, that pretty much sums it up perfectly. What is the point of EPM if it can only protect against non-active web content? Flash and Java, especially Java nowadays, are the two biggest attack vectors through browsers. Undeniably, the typical end user is going to allow the active content to run in classic protected mode.
     
  9. It doesn't even work as an enhanced version of click-to-play. And click-to-play is a poor defense for less experienced users anyway.

    What I don't understand is why they couldn't limit read access to the filesystem instead of blocking it entirely. Windows, like UNIX, can tell what libraries an executable is linked against... Just find out what libraries the Java and Flash plugins need, and give them read access to those libraries only, and no other files.
     
  10. wat0114

    wat0114 Registered Member

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    Apparmor restricts the application to only what it requires in a path based profile. There are some executable rights it needs as well, certainly memory mapped ones, but at least the profile can restrict to only exactly what it requires and nothing more.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2012
  11. elapsed

    elapsed Registered Member

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    How quickly people forget on the internet..?

    Reminder: Windows 8 comes with it's own built in version of flash. It is far more efficient than the normal version of flash, it is already compatible with EPM/64bit, and it is automatically updated meaning the user never need worry about it again.

    It is correct however that Java has not been updated to work with EPM (will that ever happen?) but EPM flexible, you can have a whitelist of websites where EPM is automatically disabled without even relaunching the browser.

    So if you really really really need Java (which should be avoided) you can have it ONLY enable on that 1 specific site you need it on without ANY hassle from you. Perfect.
     
  12. SirDrexl

    SirDrexl Registered Member

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    Does the included Flash work with any browser?
     
  13. Hungry Man

    Hungry Man Registered Member

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    Right I figured this would be the case with the built in Flash.

    Hopefully someone comes out with a comparison as detailed as Accuvants for the Chrome/IE sandboxes in Windows 8.
     
  14. elapsed

    elapsed Registered Member

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    The included flash is an ActiveX control, it will work with browsers that support ActiveX (IE & derivatives)
     
  15. wat0114

    wat0114 Registered Member

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    It's own flash or compiled binaries courtesy of Adobe?

    The burning question which I've yet to find an answer to: Will EPM support sites with Flash content, even using the built-in Flash in IE10?
     
  16. elapsed

    elapsed Registered Member

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    It's CODED by Microsoft courtesy of Adobe providing the source code, so yes, Microsoft also compiles and signs it. The desktop version of IE10 will run this version of flash on ALL sites.
     
  17. wat0114

    wat0114 Registered Member

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    Right, but even with EPM enabled? I haven't been able to find anything that clarifies this. Thanks!
     
  18. If it's compatible with EPM, then Flash content should play without disabling EPM.

    OTOH, wat0114's link shows IE 10 requesting exit from EPM to allow "Adobe Flash Player." I assume the ActiveX-based plugin from Adobe is different from the one bundled with Windows? And even if it is, why wouldn't it run under EPM? It's still an ActiveX object, right?
     
  19. elapsed

    elapsed Registered Member

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    Yes, it would be a bit dumb for MS not to design it to be compatible with EPM haha :p

    Pre-Release Preview version of Windows 8, when flash wasn't bundled. You cannot install the plugin from Adobe on Windows 8, it won't let you.
     
  20. wat0114

    wat0114 Registered Member

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    Yes, I agree it would be dumb of them, but the link I posted earlier implies Flash sites won't work under EPM, requiring a fallback to classic pm to work, and also couldn't find anything that unequivocally states that their own Flash built-in will work for Flash sites with epm enabled. Anyway, I'm anxious to try out IE10 in Win7 when it releases :)
     
  21. elapsed

    elapsed Registered Member

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    Note the 2nd half of my post.
     
  22. Trooper

    Trooper Registered Member

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    I would not touch it. Ran it at work for awhile to test it out, found it to be very cumbersome. I work in IT for a living but the people I have to support are not tech savvy at all. I could not even imagine rolling this out where I work.

    I saw nothing aside from a bit of beefed up security (for someone like me) to want to use it. That said, will not be using it at home or work. I see no reason to upgrade at all.

    I agree with Jack and Mrkvonic thoughts about it.

    Nothing to see here, move along and let the MS fanboys have at it and beta test for everyone else. Hopefully they provided MS with some feedback that they will use to improve upon the next version of Windows.
     
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