HDM 12 Suite

I have followed this thread for some days; the reading is of great interest, but it gives rise to anxiety if an incomplete backup is the result of a Paragon process. As far as I have understood, the incompleteness is “limited” to the Windows Update history; that is a serious matter anyway. Apparently the behaviour is confirmed (?) by SIW2 (#110).

I am convinced that JosephB's findings are correct. I am running Win7 Pro x64; the file C:\Windows\WindowsUpdate.log tells that “C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution is used as base directory”. Due to the files time stamp, I am positive that the main database is c:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\DataStore\DataStore.edb with logs in the subfolder \Logs.

My Windows Update log covers the period from 16.12.2010 with the latest update 14.03.2012. Due to my own stupidity, I had to recover the C: partition at one occasion. At 18.02.2012 I used the Paragon Linux Recovery CD (created with Paragon Backup & Recovery Free) to restore a 3 days old backup. The backup was performed with Paragon Backup & Recovery 11 Home as a Windows session. (I am now running HDM12 Pro). My Windows Update history is complete.

However, I have now performed a test, trying to restore Windows\SoftwareDistribution\DataStore to another directory. All seemed to work well, but the log tells:

16.03.2012 13:55:09 - Directory "W:/MyOwnData/Backup/Paragon Backup/
Disk C/arc_140312213013259/arc_140312213013259.pfi" is open as restore source.
16.03.2012 13:55:11 - Log summary: directories 2; files 0; errors encountered 0.

Notice the files count, zero files! The restored folders are created, but there are no files!!! I examined the SoftwareDistribution folder in the backup archive. Most of the folders are empty, the Download folder, as an exeption, has files stored. I then tried to restore the image from 15.02.2012 which I recovered from with success. I told that I performed the backup from Windows, but my memory cannot serve me well. Look at the attached screen shot; the “Compaq” partition is labelled “E:” I must have run the backup from the Linux CD. In this archive, all the files exist! Yes, my own comment tells I performed a Linux boot, because my new HD needed USB 3.0 drivers to be visible in Windows.

I am not happy that I now have confirmed the story told by skbaltimore and Raza0007. Shame on you, Paragon.

skbaltimore, please tell us what the support department answers to your request.

PS: I am now going to run a backup from my WinPE CD. Cross the fingers. Is Linux a necessity?

 

Thanks for your post, JDG. At one point I did do a Linux-disk restore, but honestly, I can't remember if that did better than the WinPE-disk restore, or not. At some point I'll give it a shot, and report back. I'll also let you know what, if anything, Paragon support has to say. It just seems strange that the Linux restore disk could get it right, and the WinPE AND restoring from Windows, using the Paragon program itself, would not.

 

I've never done it but I'm going to say it does since it is not intended to understand and make use the file system structure and it is copying the entire partition.

How much longer it takes will depend on the size of the partition. If you have a 40GB partition with 30GB used then the difference both in time and space will only be to handle the un-used 10GB. The speed may be slightly less (perhaps) because one might assume it is just doing a sequential sector copy without any interpretation of locations. Now, if you have a 500 GB partition with 30GB used the time and space required for the 500GB will be vastly greater than the case where only the 30GB of in-use sectors are archived

 

Thanks. Mine is somewhere in between: 63GB size, 18GB used.

Do you happen to know if it works with compression, or does it only work uncompressed?

 

No, the backup is complete when I start the backup from the WinPE CD; standard settings.

@skbaltimore: It is not sufficient to boot from the CD (Linux or WinPE) when you are going to restore the image. You have to use the CD boot when you want to run the backup process! Otherwise, you will have an incomplete backup. The complete archive is visible in HDM when you run the program within Windows.

From this day off, I shall do a WinPE boot for all my backups. I am glad my computer is able to boot from an USB memory stick, the boot process is a bit faster.

I think I am going to open a support ticket like you, skbaltimore. I have already "tested" the support team; I have a good impression of their work. They even answered me whe I was running the free version (I had to wait for an answer, but that is in accordance with Paragon's support policy.)

 

Thanks for the clarification, JDG.

UPDATE: I just discovered something that might be the key to what's going on here. Whenever I've done a restore, and I get to the "What folders and files to restore" screen, I simply highlighted "C", then clicked "Next". I've never expanded it; just clicked/highlighted it, and gone to the next screen. After reading your last post, I went into HDM and when it came to that screen, I expanded the "C" drive. Nothing was actually checked (which makes me wonder how any restore ever took place to begin with). I checked the folder icon directly under "C", and then everything got checked, including Pagefile, etc. So now I'm totally confused. When doing a restore, should I expand "C", check the folder icon below it, then uncheck Pagefile, since I'd chosen to not back that up when the image was made? And do I want to have checked or unchecked: autoexec.bat, bootmgr, BOOTSECT.BAK, config.sys, IO.sys, Ms8r, and MSDOS.sys? I never had to make these kinds of decisions when I used IFW/IFD. I just did a full backup, and then a full restore. I thought I was doing that when I highlighted the entire "C" drive, but now I'm not sure.

 

That is true, if you just do a regular sector based image of your system partition and restore it, the data is not restored to the exact same sectors it was in before, but that still does not mean that some data should be missing and not restored. Pagefile and hybernation file are not included as they are session based files and are generated anew every session. There will be no point in backup them up unless you are going to run a forensic screening of the hard drive.

 

There are some other things I noticed last time I reported this problem. See the links on this post attached below that I posted in response to @skbaltimore, for more info.

In order to get the NIS virus definition error, you have to restore to a backup that was created at least 3 days ago.

Similarly Paragon fails to restore the outlook files on the C drive that contain hotmail email headers, so you have to re-download them again each time you start outlook after a restore with Paragon with VSS.

 

I think that option is for when you do not want to restore the entire C partition but only specific files or folders. You they are all unchecked by default, meaning the entire partition will be restored but if you check one of them then Paragon will restore the checked item only.

 

If I understand you correctly, you are saying that the error happens only when you backup from within windows. This is exactly what I discovered 3 years ago with HDM 2009. Also the error happens only when you do the backup with VSS. If you use Paragon hot processing (PHP) technology, you do not get these errors and everything is restored properly. The only problem is that apparently PHP does not work on Windows 7, you can test it on Vista as I used Paragon for about a year with PHP on Vista without encountering any missing files.

 

Thanks for the previous post (#134); I was pretty sure I only needed to highlight the "C" that first appeared, and not open up the "+" sign to then check all of the boxes.

I had quite a time using that Linux rescue disk when I used it to do an experimental restore, just to see if it worked, because some users reported that it did not work at all. But I might try making a backup using the Linux disk (if I can remember how I managed to negotiate the program -- it's totally different than the Windows disk, and it took me a while to figure it out because it required a bit more keyboard use, vs mouse, than I'm used to.) If I can generate a restore using the Linux disk, then I'll restore it, and see if the other problems go away. It's not a fix by any means for the problems resulting from using the WinPE or program inside Windows itself to make the backups, but at least it's an alternative, and it might help to pinpoint/troubleshoot the problems that you and I have noticed.

 

Well...so far, so good. I was able to play around with the Linux disk, and made a "Good" compression full image b/u, which took around 14 minutes. I learned a few things making it (like how to make a new folder for the arc files, and how/where to name the files that will end up in the arc folder), then deleted it and made a "Best" compression full image b/u that was a couple of GBs smaller (around 8GB vs around 10GB; Win 7 Pro 32 bit definitely allows for smaller backups than 64 bit, because there isn't the file redundancy), and took around 26 minutes. The next step is to do a restore using the Linux disk.

Once I figured out that you need to click "Enter" on that opening page to get into the program, I was fine. The first time I ran the Linux disk, I kept mouse clicking on the main page items, and nothing happened. So I thought the disk was junk. Once I got past that user error...



...it was much better. The one issue I found with the Linux disk is that is does not take the 4000 size splits. I typed it in, but it kept reverting back to 2000 size splits, but I can live with that.

Stay tuned...

 

I just tried backup and restore with the Linux media from HDM12 Pro.

Worked fine. Update history is intact.

It is slower, tho.

 

The problem is related to VSS, as was pointed out above. That is, it only occurs when the image is created from Windows.

 

1. We're trying to confirm that through empirical testing/troubleshooting.

2. A new twist...and the plot thickens...all I did today was make a back up using the Linux disk. I have not made any attempt to restore using that backed up image. And just to double check that everything was intact in Windows Update history since 3/13/12,, I went into Windows Update history...and lo and behold...all of the updates from 3/13/12...were gone. The only one that was there was today's MSE virus definitions update. So maybe there's more to this problem than just restoring Paragon image backups. It's a good thing I checked, because I would have sworn it was all related to Paragon. I checked the settings in CCleaner, and there does not appear to be anything in the settings that could be related to this problem (i.e. I don't have Windows Log Files selected, since I'd read that that can cause problems, and Paragon is not listed anywhere in the Applications tab, and nothing in the Advanced section is checked, etc.) So in all fairness, I can't say that this problem hadn't been happening all along and I only noticed it after a restore.

To be continued...

 

Yes, I know it was pointed out - just checking it for myself.

I haven't used any paragon linux boot media for quite a while - interesting to see the differences overall.

 

I'm completing the restore on my laptop (I'm typing this on my desktop) as we speak. Before I did the restore, I checked to see if it's possible to do a differential backup using the Linux disk. I checked all the wizards, and everything on the left side of the screen, and I did not find that option. And since I do a lot of diff b/u's, that would definitely preclude me from using the Linux disk on any regular basis. (It is kinda cool, though.)

UPDATE: OK. The restore is complete, and the one item showing in the History Update section prior to the restore is still there. So as far as I can tell, using the Linux disk to do a full system backup, then a full system restore, definitely has a different effect than doing the backup in Paragon in Windows. The next step would be for me to now do a full system backup in Paragon in Windows, then doing a restore -- either through Paragon in Windows, or using WinPE. (I can also attest to the fact that the list of error messages in Event Viewer that I posted after a restore was NOT present after the Linux restore. So that's 2 for Linux, 0 for Windows.)

 

The only problem when making an image with Paragon Linux bootdisk is that the image file is split into chunks of 2000 MBs. Paragon is using an ancient kernel of Linux in their boot media and that kernel has this 2 GB max file size limitation.

 

Did somebody mention it works ok from the winpe media?

 

I did mention that in my post.

But yes...that's definitely a limitation.

So, apparently, is the inability to do a differential b/u using the Linux disk.

 

No, the opposite -- using the WinPE to do the b/u yields the same results as backing up using the program in Windows.

 

I don't understand why you guys are running tests from the bootmedia as the problems only happen when VSS is used. Cold imaging does not use VSS, so there should be no problems when imaged from a bootmedia.

Are you sure about this?

 

Just to verify that the problem is squarely on the shoulders of the program when it's run in Windows or the WinPE. Troubleshooting/pinpointing the problem, is all. Trying to recreate the problem and rule out other variables.

Another poster said that the problem exists whether the b/u is made in Paragon in Windows, or using the WinPE. That's what I was basing it on.

Also, it's a bit O/T, but I remember years ago a lot of discussion over whether there were advantages of doing an image while Windows was running, or not. The disadvantages were always apparent (locked files, etc.) But I could swear that I remember at least one argument saying that images done when Windows was not running were not quite as accurate as when the image was made when it was running. But that was not the most popular opinion at the time, IIRC.

 

When I tested it. The problem did not occur while using winpe. It only happened during live imaging from within windows using VSS. Are you sure you are getting the same problem using winpe?

 

I haven't run that test yet. As I said, I was going by what another poster said, which was, it didn't matter if it was WinPE or Paragon backing up in Windows. But it's easy enough to verify. I'll work on that one tomorrow.