FBI must cough up Carnivore info

VF probably would find it suitably insulting, for he mentions the episode still to this day, he feels hurt..that is not important to most... but since Paul again has jumped into this thread asking everyone to behave it appears the rules only apply to da members.


On the conspiracy theory..I am not an Irish Science Fiction Writer nor am I a Radical times two Guy from Chantilly, VA and "here" happen to be in Myrtle Beach among people who know how to have a rational debate on the subject of privacy and security. I have not seen that happen in this forum to date.

You guys are like vultures looking for a victim. You are not interested in fixing the system or protecting peoples rights..you have an agenda. I respect your rights..but you are using the same "tactics" you are so deathly afraid that a government entity is going to use in it's pursuit to try an protect its people.

That analogy carries right down to this Yet another B. Board where many are doing their best to "make it secure" for everyone..but not one of you really knows what modifications have been installed no matter how hard Corey and so many others are trying to work and test to make it a better product. That is a technical solution they are looking for...not an emotional one.

Are you 1.1..who is up on the the daily security issues.
Just because they are availabe are they working..are they installed It never ends.

You know guys..words and symbols are very powerful things as we all know. The symbols that you have linked to in this forum speaks volumes of not only who you are but also where you stand. There is nothing wrong with that... for you want to be heard and not stifled. But the very presence of those symbols drives YABB crazy..trying to link with cluster.icq.com, gofree.indigo.ie,web.2rad.net and so many more.
Schakenklein knows that and so do all of you.

You scare the pants off most people by your  verbal intimidation. Those that are really paranoid that come here are frighten off by what they see in their technical logs even before they post. They have no idea what it all means.

And here you all are, urging Response to register. Not so you can have a productive dialog..but rather to prove to yourself if a domain solution can really be found.

You are even now considering cutting yourself off even further to Anon. posters as you "guard" this place on the Internet.

When this board transitioned to freedom2 server 0028,51 everyone I know had hopes that the rules and regs. Zhen had helped setup would be a welcomed change from other boards and make it unique.

Free Speech..behave yourself..and lets all help each other even if the other guy is having a bad day..or even if "sometimes the keyboard just begins to type away on its own."

That happens to everyone.

I do not know what kind of writing style you are looking to analyze...or what spelling mistakes you would like to attribute to another person... you would be chasing ghosts.

Paul, I wish you well. It is a tough call.

 

It saddens me that VF/Spy/"Response" is an intelligent, and intellectual, potential contributor.  Whereas the real response is far more than that - a proactive defender of our rights.  Somehow this guy got twisted through 180 degrees.  That's a damned shame, as he'd be a valuable asset against common foes.

How about it, VF?  Would you consider registering, and contributing your skills positively instead of negatively?

 

I vote to ban Response.


Ok guys, it is time to do a 360. Paul and Paul face the same problem here at this  board that we all face in the real world.

The identification, control, and elimination of a threat. In that process many of you good people had been affected. To a varying degree many of you understood why he took the action to ban someone. Some of you even were aware of technical ways he "could" and even other of "us" know of ways he could have gone even further to isolate, identify and protect you all from an individual.

But he did not. To be more precise...he could not within the framework of the Internet or the board. The issue was not life threatening to any of you. What if it was? How would you even know?

In the process of working the problem, some toes where trampled but not many cried out in this thread.

Banned Users Problem
http://www.security-pro.co.uk/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=gen;action=display;num=1017922315

But others then, were made aware of another problem even for members.
The ability of anyone to use a proxy for multiple identities. The same way some of you use that feature to protect your privacy.


Will Paul ever have to take other steps in the future?

Would he? And in the process would it be  "elimination of suspects" or do you really think the tool(s) are sophisticated enough to pin it down and never affect any of you?


http://www.security-pro.co.uk/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=osif;action=display;num=1018124395;start=4
I could - but I will not do so




These are the same issues that are faced, will be questioned, subject to abused in regards to the FBI or anyone who ventures to protect the well being of a people.

My focus in life remains on the "solutions". Not only for the Internet but rather the real world.
We hold that in common .. if we do not...then what?

 

There's another point of view and another way to tackling the spoofing problem.

In all free societies, we enjoy our freedom at the expense of a minority who abuse.  We cannot deny the abusers without relinquishing our freedom.

The answer is:  tolerance.  I propose we exercise the same here; don't ban, just recognise the tone and direction of the imflammatory material, and give them all the attention they deserve:  none.

Get in touch with YaBB and see if guests can be limited to no more than, say, five posts per day.  Delete without notice or explanation posts which fall into this category.

Anyone want change from this $0.02?

 

         If I may be allowed a comment on the registration issue it would be appreciated.

        naturally...clearly I am an un-registered poster.
there are members of this BB that have known me for no less than a couple of years.....Paul W is well awear of me from sharing many threads together........an a few members here know I have a reason for not registering.......an certainly I am not opposed to registering in general........in time I hope to be able to do so...........but that at the moment.

       most..if not everyone here is well awear that if a person really wants to do so...he can obtain several "new" addresses without all that much effort......jumpimg through the hoops is not unknown..if a person wants to do so.

      furthermore...most if not everyone here knows how to block urls and entire sub-ranges......even a person jumping through the hoops can eventual be blocked or worn down.......without all that much energy being spent.

     Checkout made imo a valid point in being tolarant of the outright idiots who just refuse to show respect to others......an Paul and the mods can then do what they feel is best in handling the hostle person.

     name spoofing is no issue whatsoever IMO....each poster has their own posting style....an say if someone wants to pretend to be me.....people will quickly notice.....there are no dummies at this BB.....you folks are highly awear and alert...........an you can bet it would not that long for me to tell the imposter to....well I wont say what I would tell the imposter.....LOL

     this BB belongs to its members..an I don't know of any member here who can't hold his/her own in a debate.....an I certainly don't believe that any member of this BB is going to run away from any issue by locking down the entire forum.    You folks are better than that.

     recently I had a first hand experince of being locked of a forum because of not being a registered member....although I had posted at the forum for a long time...never cause any problems.....had friends there...an in turn was locked out like a stray dog.....an of course the BB "had its reasons"

     should Paul or any moderator at this BB advise me to correct my attitude if its out of line.....if I have any self-respect I'll respect that..........an abide by the request.   that doesn't mean I wont hold my own if being flamed by a poster......any poster.   What it does mean is that I will respect the entire BB.....because its the right thing to do........not because of being registered or un-registered.....simply because its the right thing to do.

       registration wont make a person be polite and respectful......thats either in the person or it isn't.

       an definitely there will always be some idiot coming along looking for trouble......personally I cherish my peace of mind far to much to allow some petty fool to cause me to lose it that easily.    there are no strings on my back for anyone to pull as if I were some puppet.....an the fools can just take a hike down the pike cause they wont disturb me.....I may not be all that smart but nither am I all that dumb and weak as to give up my peace of mind to a fool.

      very honestly I enjoy this BB and its members...an perhaps someday Paul will see fit to ask that everyone register......but let that decision be made for the right reasons......an not a decision "forced" to be made by some un-rulely poster......

     thank you each and all for allowing me to express this

 

Hi Checkout, Snowman, and others,

Thanks for expressing your feelings and thoughts on the subject!!!

I really hope you don't mind, but maybe it's better that I leave it to Paul to answer.
But be assured that I too would like the board be a very friendly one, without anybody causing headaches!

 

I applaud your decision.  Vigilence is the key.
Thank you.

 

The last few posts have been excellent. It also shows this forum for what it is: A THINKING GROUP OF PEOPLE!

I agree with the decision totally.

John

 

(Smile)  You're a good man, Charlie Brown!  

 

        Paul

        its truely refreshing seeing the open-mindness and courage you have expressed in your decision.  you have always shown yourself to be a head above the crowd an have done so once again.   This is also imo an expression of the fine members here at this BB......my sincere respect is herewith extended to everyone.



        Carnivore:     which was the topic this thread began on.........a subject that I have shunned like the flu............

         everyone wants to know...is there actually such a tthing as carnivore....is so...where is it....who is controling it....whats its purpose....etc. etc......

       

        the bible says to never let the right hand know what the left hand is doing.    is their anyone here who has never heard of the shell game?   is it possible everyone is looking in the wrong places.    Does such statements sound stupid........well just maybe thats the way its intended............there is an old story>  the angels asked God....Lord, where will we hide "wisdom" so that the people will never find it?   an God replyed: "right under their noses.!

     

        in a few days trout season begins in my area....an I'll be fishing in beautiful mountain lakes.....creeks with water so clear it could be bottled and sold.........I look for fish where fish live...........an thats not in my bathtub!

      if information is being collected off the internet....where does a person look to find whats collecting that information?

 

If Carnivore exists (and most people seem to believe it does) we, the end users, will never be able to detect it.

Consequently, we must assume that it, and Echelon, and trojans, and keyloggers, and spyware do exist and protect ourselves accordlingly.  The price of security and privacy is constant vigilance and self-education.

 

         Checkout

         Greetings.....most difinitely agree with you...what you stated are points well made.


          Checkout obviously you are a highly inteligent person.......withs lots of good old common sense.

          as you may have noticed in my previous post..I shun the subject of carnivore.   There are those who believe there is a carnivore and those who don't.  But what you said should be the practice no matter what the opinions are.

       regards
                     snowman

 

What's that "whooshing" sound?  Oh yeah - it's my ego being inflated!  

 

         LOL........hey, the truth is true.....an the snowman says it like he see's it.........an Checkout you are certainly deserving of the compliment.........

 

Paul, can we start a new sub-forum called "Mutual Admiration" please?