Curious to know

Discussion in 'privacy problems' started by RogerTHEDodger, Jan 26, 2007.

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  1. RogerTHEDodger

    RogerTHEDodger Registered Member

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    My PC requires a bigger hard disc. I propose to delete a lot of old sensative business data on the old drive using Cyberscrub ( Gutman 35 passes) and then wipe the free space on that drive before creating an image with TI9 to install on the new hard drive. The old drive will then be used for backups.

    My curiosity then kicks in about what will be included in the image ..
    Will any of the deleted files or fragments of files be brought accross in the image to the new drive that can enable recovery ?
     
  2. eyes-open

    eyes-open Registered Member

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    Hi RogerTHEDodger :)

    You were probably better off posting this in the Acronis True Image section.

    If I kick things off with how I understand it based on general reading, maybe someone else will point out any error.

    Firstly it is my impression that other than using very expensive recovery techniques - then after 35 passes, your useful data really is destroyed anyway (assumes no bad track/sector that won't take overwrite). Sure, a forensic laboratory could have a crack with electron microscopes, but how likely is that ?

    You don't say how your wiping the free space. For what it's worth, a few years ago I did that with Eraser and fell foul of the NTLDR file missing. If that is how you're erasing free space, it's worth double checking you know how to recover in the event of an error.

    As to passing it on through imaging. I think that imaging is a sector by sector process, not a file transfer process. So I would think that whatever data is contained in one sector on the source disc, becomes part of the transferable image.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2007
  3. zapjb

    zapjb Registered Member

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    I'm curious also. But mine is won't a Gutman 35 passes cleaning process take more than a week to finish? Maybe I'm wrong. Could you post the GB of the HDD & how long it did take.
     
  4. eyes-open

    eyes-open Registered Member

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    Hi zapjb,

    You're right, depending on the drive size etc, it is a potentially long process. It's also stated clearly in a few places that it's an outdated process. The thing is, if it can be done and it gives peace of mind without damaging the drive ......It's easier to let someone do it, than it is to prove how many passes would be appropriate to secure an equivalent peace of mind.

    Why 35 passes is passé is explained below.

    Not too technical:-
    Can Intelligence Agencies Read Overwritten Data ?

    A tad more technical:-
    Secure Deletion of Memory From Magnetic & Solid State Memory

     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2007
  5. RogerTHEDodger

    RogerTHEDodger Registered Member

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    Thanks eyes-open for your input. I was allways under the impression that imaging software would take across any file fragments as its a sector by sector image which is your understanding.
    I only have to make sure that "Joe Public" can't recover the files. If I was worried about forensic recovery I would have opted for a fresh install and trashed the old disc.
    It was interesting to note that the Gutman 35 pass is nowhere near as effective as the security companies claim so I opted for a 5 pass using Cyberscrub. I then wiped the disc free space after deleting the files as above again with a 5 pass using Cyber scrub before creating image for installing on new drive.
    To wipe the free 28Gb space took 4.5 hours and that was connecting the drive to Firewire 400. No doubt this would have been quicker if I had installed drive in a PC, but this served my purpose.
    All systems up and running. If I get a chance in next few days I'll try a few recovery programs to see if they turn up with anything.
     
  6. eyes-open

    eyes-open Registered Member

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    Hi RogerTHEDodger :)

    Glad your sorted @ welcome to Wilders :thumb:
     
  7. Mrkvonic

    Mrkvonic Linux Systems Expert

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    Hello,
    If you're going to use the disk for backups, why do you need to wipe it? Simple format will do. You're still be the one to use it, so there's no reason to destroy the leftovers... Format is enough.
    Mrk
     
  8. eyes-open

    eyes-open Registered Member

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    Hi Mrk :)

    I think there has been a misreading of his intent & his follow through.

    He never stated a desire to wipe the whole disk - just to target the sensitive data. It was partly this that made it not such a big a deal if he did opt to use the Gutmann technique - as it became more scaleable time wise.

    Then afterwards he proposed overwriting the free/unused space. Basically taking some steps to reduce a further portion of retrievable data from the disc, before making an image and transferring that material to a second source.

    I guess you can think of it as reducing cross contamination of a clone.

    As far as I know that's as far as it went with the original disk which was intended to remain as a back up. There's nothing to suggest a total wipe, re-install etc. although of course it may have happened after the event.
     
  9. RogerTHEDodger

    RogerTHEDodger Registered Member

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    Hi guys not been here for a while too busy,but eyes-open really summed the exercise up in a nutshell. The real purpose of the exercise was to reduce the amount of framents of deleted sensative files being transferred in the cloning of the new disc.
    The old disc to be used for backups was simply reformatted in the end.
     
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