Whoo Hooo!!! Vista Rocks!!!!

Discussion in 'other software & services' started by DVD+R, Feb 1, 2007.

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  1. lodore
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    lodore Registered Member

    btw one random thing.
    has anyone held down the scroll wheel button on windows xp?
    it shows all the windows above the desktop so you get a view of them all but smalller and then you click the one you want open.
    thats another reason why you dont need the stupid vista eye candy.
    all i want in an operating system is it to be stable, securable and can use the software i like.
    by secureable i mean like xp it can be safe if you use the right programs and tweak it.
    i dont need stupid eye candy.
    the thing is the HIPS popups from UAC is gonna throw the adverage user and they will just click yes to everyone to make it go away.
    how is that then safer than xp?
    sure every proccess has a different secuirty level and that helps but its still not enough.
    lodore
  2. chaos16
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    chaos16 Registered Member

    I am thinking when Windows XP was released there were not a lot of support forums online also there were not as much feedback from user as today?

    So as Vista today would get a lot more feedback and bug report than Windows XP at the time?

    So thats something good for Vista?
  3. Ice_Czar
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    Ice_Czar Registered Member

    a logical deduction, there where forums, just not as many with as many sophisticated users.

    of course many of us saw no point in migrating to XP
    (we already had XP in W2KPro less the flash, and didnt need to activate it everytime we turned around twice)

    a portion of the numbers came from the same core of early adopters you see now,
    but even more Win98\Me users that really did need the upgrade\security, they swelled forums as n00bs

    that was about a half a year before I joined this forum and a half a year after I join several others
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2007
  4. ronjor
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    ronjor Global Moderator

  5. Peter2150
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    Peter2150 Global Moderator

    Hi Notok

    I was teasing. Reorganizing can be okay. It's the control issues. I understand the administrative rights issue. Fine, set the default the way itis, but give me the choice if I want to run Admin. It's my machine, I paid for it, and bloody well am having to pay for Vista. That is my issue.

    Pete
  6. ThunderZ
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    ThunderZ Registered Member


    One more point to be added to the discussion if I may as far as paying for something and owning it versus owning the rights to use it. Yes, you have paid for and own your PC and every hardware component of it. Software, especially from MS is an entirely different matter. In the case of MS OS`s, you are only purchasing the "rights" to use it (the OS in this case). Almost a rental agreement of sorts. Would be very interested if someone were able to run EULAlyzer on the MS install agreement at some point. Do not think that is possible however as it happens only on initial install and do not think it is reachable afterwards.
  7. Longboard
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    Longboard Registered Member

    The more I find out about the "upgrading" and LOL 'family discounting' the more peeved I am getting

    $700 for Ultimate + 50 (US$) per family box
    Currently I have 4 boxes at home and 3 at work
    + 3 Laptops: will be useless for Vista of course

    Not counting HW and SW upgrades and lost time and staff training and "debugging" (see Peter's install log), this is looking VERY exxy: tell me again why do I need this pile of poo?

    And for the doubters: I was quick to take up XP when it came out.
    I thought it was a much better option then the Win 95 I was on.
    Maybe just do the same again and 'skip' an upgrade. ;)

    Then again my car is 8 years old.
    Still gets me where I'm going on time, dry, safe, reliable.
    Will probably keep it for a while longer :D

    ~700 million win users in the world: nice earn MS. :mad:
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2007
  8. Peter2150
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    Peter2150 Global Moderator

    Yep Thunder you are so right. Not sure I want to read the Microsoft EULA. They probably reserve the right to own you as well as the software:D Just kidding folks.

    Pete

    As a PS, don't get me wrong, I'll keep on looking and playing with Vista as it evolves. At some point I suspect the benefits might increase, and the annoyances might decrease to the point I switch. Just right now I see no benefits to offset the annoyances.
  9. eyes-open
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    eyes-open Registered Member

    Hi lodore :)

    From my perspective, you are in danger of being one of Microsoft's best friends. You're like a visual aid for my post #70. A linux supporter that doesn't appear to be able to grab the language of the 'rich experience' and wants to keep things nice & basic. It's as if all you see is the gadget ....... the thing that spins & sparkles.

    As long as that is the case, as long as the voices that also have an interest in linux are turning a nose up at development - then we need not wonder that Microsoft is able to take advantage and attempt to rewrite the standards. Look at the World around you, look what people will pay just to increase the size of their television by a few inches. It isn't about right or wrong - it's about the next horizon and it isn't stopping for you or waiting for Linux.

    All platforms will benefit from a proportion of the next few years development
    Windows XP user's will get a bigger proportion still of the goodies
    VIsta user's will aim to get them all.

    Like it or like it not, folks want to keep up with their neighbours... the youth market more than most.

    Complain about EULAs, Security concerns, broken standards ........ it doesn't matter - the instant one kid starts playing with 3D interactive Daleks on their desktop, they'll all want to have a go and then they'll want to top it. The new technologies aren't stopping at the desktop, they're going to be all around you..... and if Linux isn't offering it then it doesn't matter because Microsoft is and the price for full admission is Vista.

    One fairly high profile effort at the moment is this in association with the British Library:-

    http://www.armadillosystems.com/ttp_commercial/products.html

    You may consider that to by quite dry - but try and see that this is just a minor scratch on the surface. Get past the idea of Vista being just 'eye-candy'. It's not, it's a stage of development that not only challenges Linux to catch up - it's setting the rules and the pace.

    It hasn't even begun yet - and yes there will be horror stories out there that'll make blinkies seem classy. But the good stuff will be a must have for many people.

    So you may have no need for 'eye-candy', but in my book to meet the needs of the next decade - Linux has a need of user's who can engage positively on this level and meet the challenge.
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2007
  10. Pedro
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    Pedro Registered Member

    eyes-open refers to some basic points about market. But it's not about market in this topic, is it? It's about what does Vista offer of such importance to warrant 700$! A new computer!

    And i think some confuse what Microsoft built, and what others built for Windows.
    It's about market share.;)
  11. Rilla927
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    Rilla927 Registered Member

  12. eyes-open
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    eyes-open Registered Member

    Hi Someone,

    Sure - the title is about why Vista rocks - I didn't actually take the subject into Linux, it just became a feature of the thread.

    I'm arguing that why Vista rocks is not because it has gadgets. What I'm saying is Vista is a stage of OS development designed to Mirror and take full advantage of the development of what's elusively termed the 'rich experience'. I'm saying to be blindsided by 'eye-candy' is a fundamental misunderstanding of the role of Vista's graphical elements.

    I've tried to illustrate it as well as possible without providing a hundred links and using TLA's all over the place. If you haven't had chance to gather a picture of the developing relationship between Vista, XAML,WPF WPF(e) and all that stuff then it becomes a bit more difficult to picture I guess. (not meant to be patronising, just to accept that not everybody is interested in this stuff).

    If I use this as an analogy, just to try and explain it - tho' not as a claim of parallel importance:-

    Vista is a colour TV waiting for producers to create the films, while the rest of us stomp our feet and insist we're happy with black & white and don't see the need for colour .... sooner or later as colour programming appears, so colour TV sales increase. This is how I see Vista's place in the way things will develop. It is the unit best placed to take full advantage of future development. As I've said earlier, Vista isn't a 'thing' it's an evolving OS, just as it's predecessors have been. I'm saying being a licence owner is not simply about what it does today, it's what it's positioning the licence owner to do tomorrow while the rest of us watch. How long do you think Joe Bloggs will hold out before he wants to access the good stuff that his mate has ?

    Vista's underlying engines, the stuff that will enable it to rock are positioned for a Market that is now being created specifically to enable Vista to rock .... how can you can seperate them ?
  13. TairikuOkami
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    TairikuOkami Registered Member

    BD and HD burner are just too expensive and I do not expect to buy a new sooner than in a few years, till then, according to MS, a new Windows will be out. As for DRM, I have 32-bit, listen only streaming radios, so that problem does not bother me. My Vista is vista. [​IMG]
  14. Rilla927
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    Rilla927 Registered Member

    Yes, you are right, they are too expensive.

    What do you mean "a new Windows will be out"?
  15. TairikuOkami
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    TairikuOkami Registered Member

    MS said, that Vista is the last Windows, which has been rewritten from the scratch. [​IMG]
    The new Windowses should be released once in 2-4 years, so I expect new version soon.
  16. Pedro
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    Pedro Registered Member

    I understand what you're saying, it's an OS that enables better software achievements in the future. I've seen a video of Cranky Geeks (lol), where the guy from yahoo says it was much simpler to design for Vista. Comparing to XP note.
    But this is subjective. Is it better than in Linux, ie the alternative? How do you infer this?

    Not to mention that you'll be stuck more and more in Microsoft's products. If they don't want you to use something, you're screwed. Microsoft with its DRM's alike (not only DRM, some of the other decisions too) will get an even bigger grip over your computer, and then the whole software market. Pretty soon you don't have a choice: you buy everything from them - monopoly not only in OS. It's not that simple, and i took a leap here, but there's a reasoning.
    About IE, if it was up to them, you wouldn't have a choice, and the same applies to many other things.

    Consumer rights is still a big issue in Europe (hopefully forever, but who knows...), so it isn't that easy for them. They still can and will complicate things for you, like uninstalling IE: how?

    You'll end up tweaking Vista just like you do with XP. This is where Mrk is absolutely right: it comes to a point where you wonder if you should do this, when you could be learning Linux basics, and choosing what to run, and how.
    Why Linux is still hard: it isn't 1/100 as supported as Windows. Drivers, programs, references, etc.
    And here is why Windows is popular: not only it's used everywhere, it's somewhat automatic, if you take what's given to you. It's a vicious cycle.

    Vista overall seems to be a superb OS. It comes with pretty much everything a normal user wants / needs. Media Center, easy navigation, speech recognition, etc. Nothing new, but all installed and ready to use.

    But two things emerge:
    Are you in control of your computer? Do you trust it?
    Was it worth all the money? Can't you wait for the dust to settle, the price lower, and when you know where are the weaknesses? (there will be many, go figure how i know this)
  17. TairikuOkami
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    TairikuOkami Registered Member

    Well said, users would use Linux, but it would have to be much more better supported, which could happen, if it would have more users, but it will not happen, because it is not supported.

    About learning, Vista settings mostly use the same location in the registry as the Windows 95 did, so once a man will learn it, he will know, where to look for. Eg I have not had to change none of my IE's reg settings, I just added some new as well as for windows. Though Windows likes to change file location with each Windows, like documents, aplication's settings and etc.

    3 times yes, though at the moment I am a bit unsettled since I stopped using a firewall, but I am sure, that the feeling will weather away as my feeling about "so needed" realtime AV did.

    I wanted to wait until SP1, but I have to admit, that MS advertisments talking about security got me. Do I pity it, not really, it runs as good as XP, though dozens of games do not work due to missing opengl support from ATI, so I even can not try demos, but overall I am satisfied. :)
  18. Lamehand
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    Lamehand Registered Member

    This is what it's all about, the hart of the matter so to speak, vista can be superb in what ever, even making coffee for you, but if you don't have anything to say over it and can't control it the way you like, it's useless, certainly if you have to pay this much money for it.

    Lamehand
  19. Lamehand
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    Lamehand Registered Member

    What is meant by not well supported?, there is loads of stuff to be had for Ubuntu (which i use) and there are forums all over the place for this, so i don't know what is meant by this.

    Lamehand
  20. TairikuOkami
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    TairikuOkami Registered Member

    I meant supported by driver, games & software developers, who do not care much about Linux.
  21. Antarctica
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    Antarctica Registered Member

    Absolutely agree with you, it needs better support but lots of European government and Cities have started to migrate.

    Still to few but it's a start anyway.:)

    http://www.linux.org/info/linux_govt.html

    http://news.zdnet.com/2100-3513-6138372.html

    http://news.com.com/Munichs Linux migration slips to 2006/2100-7344_3-5850633.html
  22. TairikuOkami
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    TairikuOkami Registered Member

    Linux is a great OS, especially for a server and for an office and Windows for a desktop.
    As for me, I want to have Vista on desktop and Ubuntu on a notebook (when I buy one).
  23. Lamehand
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    Lamehand Registered Member

    Ah, yes i understand, you're right this has to change, some company's are very hard to persuade.

    Lamehand
  24. lodore
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    lodore Registered Member

    at the end of the day people want the following
    1. pc always work without needing to reboot
    2.no stupid questions from ms uac or other HIPS or other secuirty software
    people mainly just want to use the computer and not have to worry about stuff like crytic messages or blue screens.
    the funny thing is i only had to reboot my old windows 95 pc twice in 4 years!
    who can honestly say that with a newer os?
    lodore
  25. TairikuOkami
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    TairikuOkami Registered Member

    I have not had to reboot Vista due to any problem for 2 months I use it.
    If I would not use the special settings, I would not have to reboot at all.
    Of course, when some software requires restart, it just has to be rebooted.
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