Prevx support sucks

[ako]

I sent the following question 4 days ago to support:

"PrevxR licence expires soon. Will you extend it, or is this the end of PrevxR group? Do you still need beta testers for new prevx products?"

Earlier I had sent it by email to two Prevx members.

In all cases I got no reply.

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "I sent the following question 4 days ago to support:

"PrevxR licence expires soon. Will you extend it, or is this the end of PrevxR group? Do you still need beta testers for new prevx products?"

Earlier I had sent it by email to two Prevx members.

In all cases I got no reply." }-

Did I miss something?

You've sent me a PM on 4th February 2008 and you've got a reply on 5th February 2008. I don't understand why you're saying "I got no reply".

[ako]

-{ Quote: "Did I miss something?

You've sent me a PM on 4th February 2008 and you've got a reply on 5th February 2008. I don't understand why you're saying "I got no reply"." }-

Hi!

No, YOU did not miss anything. The emails I am talking about were sent 7.7 and 11.7 to Jacques Erasmus and Paul Stubbs. Both have earlier been kind enough to respond. Not anymore. (By the way, has Paul left Prevx?)

When I sent you my question long ago, you said: "PrevxR community will be active till July 2008, so you'll receive updates until that date. After that, we're reviewing whether the programme will continue or not yet."

Any new information here?

[sukarof]

Why the harsh words? Doesnt Prevx have their own forum anymore?
It is after all vacation period now. Me for one never check my work email when I´m on vacation. If stubbs and erasmus are smart they wont either.

[ako]

-{ Quote: "Why the harsh words? Doesnt Prevx have their own forum anymore?
It is after all vacation period now. Me for one never check my work email when I´m on vacation. If stubbs and erasmus are smart they wont either." }-

The support forum is dead. Has been that for a long long time. You never get a response from Prevx there.

I was mainly complaining about SUPPORT.

[Longboard]

@EraserHW :are you all that is left of PrevX ? :(
Is there anything you can give yet apart from vague promises.....?
HAs PrevX abandoned home systems.?
There's gonna have to be something soon, some sort of update info.
My curent install never updates local db despite all these 'new' mals; is that correct ??
License due soon...give me some reasons to resubscribe.
I fulfill my part of the bargain by updateing to you if something triggers an unknown.
A lot of FUD at CC; but no real answers to relatively straight forward questions, which, unfortunately, has led to some -ahem- vigour in the postings.

Just this recently with no validation:
-{ Quote: "However one can only hope that once PX3 has evolved thru internal Beta and QA then Paul, Darren and co will have time to re-visit and return us to a somewhat more technically orientated (and infinitely more interesting) discussion again?" }-

Hate to say it but 3rd party condescension is even worse than nothing :(

FWIW: the forums at CC are currently a bit of a bust: very slow to load if at all.

ANd just one more question: on the home page: the comparison chart notes the mals uncovered by Px on home systems: and cross references with installed "Anti" utilities
I dont recall giving PrevX permission to take that specific information from my system: is that part of the EULA ??
What other info is harvested?

Holding the faith
Regards

[Killtek]

It's obvious PrevX 2.0 is dying a slow death. Their silence proves it. Like I said before, PrevX CSI is their new starlet. I personally think CSI has no legs and that they should of focused all their efforts on making PrevX 2.0 their flagship product.. NOT CSI wannabe Windows LiveCare crap.


Oh well.. they lost one customer...

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "@EraserHW :are you all that is left of PrevX ? :(
Is there anything you can give yet apart from vague promises.....?
HAs PrevX abandoned home systems.?
[........]
ANd just one more question: on the home page: the comparison chart notes the mals uncovered by Px on home systems: and cross references with installed "Anti" utilities
I dont recall giving PrevX permission to take that specific information from my system: is that part of the EULA ??
What other info is harvested?
" }-

Prevx hasn't left anything, and I can assure you this. We're hardly working on new technologies. I know you won't trust to my words, and it's ok, I could understand this.

Prevx is here, and there are many new technologies and improvements we're internally developing. If you would have read some of my posts over Wilders, I've left some hints too sometimes.

Sorry, I can't say anything more yet.

About the comparison chart: all data gathered comes only from Prevx CSI, as written in the Prevx home page.

Yes, everything is written in the EULA:

-{ Quote: "
12. PRIVACY AND COMBATING INTERNET CRIME

Prevx

Prevx is committed to combating internet crime, the abuse of the internet and unauthorized intrusions into personal privacy. We believe Prevx CSI is a powerful tool in this fight, providing you with added protection while accessing the internet and information to help fight internet crime.

The Prevx Software provided to you will report attempted intrusion events (the Attack Data) to our Community threat database anonymously. The Attack Data and program information is anonymous and cannot be traced to you or your PC. We do not receive or record any personal data that can or will be used to identify you or your computer. We do not require or request your email address (other than the legal requirement for credit card processing, if applicable, which is not linked in any way to the Attack Data received) or any other personal details to identify you or your PC.

We need your Help

Prevx appreciates your help in contributing to the fight against Internet crime. This fight cannot be won without the help and collaboration of the end user community, hence the term Community. Prevx believes this is essential if the Internet is to be saved from destruction by misuse and crime, your Attack Data will play a part in helping with the effort to combat this.

On receipt, the Attack Data is aggregated into our Community database and used to make determinations on good and bad programs. In addition the Attack Data is used to produce general statistics on attacks, threats, their propagation and overall measures of the level of internet abuse and crime. These statistics may be used by Prevx in its malware research, publicity, marketing and promotional materials. We use the attack data for analyzing and publishing overall threat activity on the internet, researching threats, compiling statistics and to further refine and improve the performance of the Prevx Software. If you do not wish to be part of a campaign to fight internet crime through the Community, then do not download or run Prevx CSI.

Users and their agents may publicise any of the information provided by the Prevx CSI product on forums and in public information statements that are intended to draw attention to malicious or suspect software, provided that they include a suitable acknowledgement that the data was gathered using the Prevx CSI product.
" }-

Kind regards,

Marco

[Perman]

Hi,
It is so exciting to hear so positive words from the developer. But, sometimes, the words, such as "trust me"."something new is in working/cooking" are not so convincing.

IMO, some carefully crafted wording will re-ignite PC users' fire, something that smart marketing kids are so accustomed to. Good luck with your development.

[Dark Star 72]

Marco,
I understand that you are restricted in what you can say about Prevx but can you just answer one question:
Is there a new and improved Prevx in the works. ie: being worked on - being developed. I'm not asking when it will be ready or what improvements - new features etc it will have, I just want to know if there is something beyond CSI. I have a Prevx license that expires in a couple of weeks, should I renew it?
Yes or No?

Ian

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "Marco,
I understand that you are restricted in what you can say about Prevx but can you just answer one question:
Is there a new and improved Prevx in the works. ie: being worked on - being developed. I'm not asking when it will be ready or what improvements - new features etc it will have, I just want to know if there is something beyond CSI. I have a Prevx license that expires in a couple of weeks, should I renew it?
Yes or No?

Ian" }-

A strong yes ;)

Just one more info (http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?p=1267613#post1267613) (I've written it some weeks ago, a hint to one of so-many things we're developing)

[Dark Star 72]

Many thanks Marco. I look forward to it.

Ian

[bellgamin]

-{ Quote: "We're hardly working on new technologies." }-An unfortunate choice of words -- indicating that not much of anything is being worked on. A Freudian slip of the real truth? ;)

[Dark Star 72]

-{ Quote: "An unfortunate choice of words -- indicating that not much of anything is being worked on. A Freudian slip of the real truth? ;)" }-

I wonder if he meant "working hard" instead of hardly:-\ ?

[fcukdat]

-{ Quote: "I wonder if he meant "working hard" instead of hardly:-\ ?" }-


Probaly as English is not Marco's native language:thumb:

[Perman]

Hi, a slip of keyboard sometimes could be lethal.

That's why I said in an earlier post; a carefully crafted wording are so imperative in fending off criticism. And at the same time, got the message delivered. I would find an image dresser quick before all matter is getting out of hand.

[trjam]

First of all, if they were, "going under" I really dont think they would say it outright, now do you. Prevx is owned by Retento Ltd in the UK so the euros are there if the product returns a profit. This is the one product I have wanted to fall in love with more then any other, but it just never lived up to its billing. Remember Notok? I honestly think they do have something in the works, but maybe not standard Prevx or CSI for that matter down the line. The protection is about in the middle pf the pack which isnt a bad thing. The cost is low and yes, I would buy a new license if it has worked for you.

It will be interesting to see where it goes, but die, I dont think so. Most vendors are now finally seeing the light about scanning, and adding some type of virtulization. In 2 years, most AVs will encompass this type of method. Well, all but one maybe, ahem version 5. lol

So it still remains a good product with a solid parent company that others dont have. Does it suck? No. Even regular Prevx with Vista, is all you need with some common sense.

[Longboard]

-{ Quote: "My curent install never updates local db despite all these 'new' mals; is this correct ??" }-
Is prevx totally web based 'server' scanner now or does the 'local' db still actuate detection.

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "Probaly as English is not Marco's native language:thumb:" }-

Touché :-[ :)

Yes, the meaning was: "working hard"

Sorry :)

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "Is prevx totally web based 'server' scanner now or does the 'local' db still actuate detection." }-

Almost totally server-side centralized database

[Longboard]

MG we know you as one of the good guys:
-{ Quote: "Prevx hasn't left anything, and I can assure you this. We're hardly working on new technologies. I know you won't trust to my words, and it's ok, I could understand this." }-Yes we read the posts..and yes I suspect we understand your position-{ Quote: "A strong yes" }- Ok, so watch and wait...
Been a few users burnt by some vendors lately.
Home users: restless bunch: always want something new to chew on..;)

[simmikie]

and of course developing the new is perfect justification for leaving current license holders with a sense of abandonment, isn't it?

and if Prevx3 does in fact come to light, can those eventual license holders count on the same hunkered down, bunker mentality while Prevx4 is under development? :dry:


Mike

[ako]

-{ Quote: "and of course developing the new is perfect justification for leaving current license holders with a sense of abandonment, isn't it?

and if Prevx3 does in fact come to light, can those eventual license holders count on the same hunkered down, bunker mentality while Prevx4 is under development? :dry:


Mike" }-

And complete silence falled again...

[Longboard]

lol
mike and ako aint never gettin a license again...;D

Essentially, I agree: how hard can it be just to touch base with the licensees.... just occassionally.. a bit ...rather then MG carrying the weight.

[Threedog]

I was quite a big fan of Prevx until it let Antivirus 2009 fully install without letting off a peep and then when I checked the logs it showed all green lights beside everything it had installed. I had returnil flicked on and had purposly let it install just to see what Prevx would do with it. This was all done with Prevx on ABC mode. With it on Pro mode AV 2009 didn't stand a chance.

[Saraceno]

Prevx is a good product, and the site provides a lot of useful information, so it should continue to do well.

Threedog, regarding Antiviris 2009, I was using/trying a popular AV and did the same as you and wanted to test if 'Antivirus 2009' could get through, got stung, and had to rollback. SAS added the definition a few days later, along with most others, so I wouldn't say it was a prevx problem, more like a timing issue with the malware being relatively 'new' on the scene. :)

[simmikie]

-{ Quote: "I was quite a big fan of Prevx until it let Antivirus 2009 fully install without letting off a peep and then when I checked the logs it showed all green lights beside everything it had installed. I had returnil flicked on and had purposly let it install just to see what Prevx would do with it. This was all done with Prevx on ABC mode. With it on Pro mode AV 2009 didn't stand a chance." }-


what is AV 2009? rogue anti-virus? i will preface by stating i am not challenging your findings, nor 'sticking-up' for Prevx. rogue anti-virus could be a tough one for BB, as most behave very closely to real AV's. the difference is the rogue AV informs the user there are infections, where there aren't, in the hopes the end-user will purchase the product. also, afaik, there are usually pop-up advertisements as well. again close to legit AV's. i use Avira free, and after every update recieve the 'you should buy me' pop-up.

in Prevx case, if the community database has not determined AV 2009 as bad, and the behaviour did not trigger anything, then yes, the rogue gets through. btw, and i realise you may not accept this, Pro mode does not increase protection. it merely queries more functions/processes. i agree if the end user chose deny within any of the pop-ups, then that particular file would have been jailed halting the infection. but how many folks would have, in this case, denied any pop-ups, especially in light of the fact they believed they were installing real AV software.

in any case, i am going to attempt to find this rogue, and run it against A2 Anti-malware on one snapshot, and Threatfire 3.5 on another, to test my rogue AV is difficult for BB softs theory. i'll be back! ;D


Mike

[Threedog]

Usually something like that it "orange flags", though.

[SystemJunkie]

-{ Quote: "An unfortunate choice of words -- indicating that not much of anything is being worked on. A Freudian slip of the real truth? " }-;D ;D
A2s scan results are more to trust then PrevX, prevx tends to flag everything. They create a huge database of all files they find no matter if good or bad I don´t know if this is a good strategy. People become confused, they should only flag bad files that are really bad.

[simmikie]

well the facts have brought to light, i have no idea of what i am talking about. Prevx2 should have snagged the rogue.

i found 3 older AV 2008 variants and tested against A2 Antimalware & Threatfire, and since i have a 13 month old in my lap, that is not allowing me to type, the results are. Threatfire only alerted to an autorun, which if i believed i were installing a legit anti-virus app, i personally would have allowed.

A2 alerted on the bad file (from signatures)
the autorun (behaviour, allowed)
code injection (behaviour, again i allowed)
installing invisibly (behaviour, which i blocked and quranteed)


Mike

[ako]

-{ Quote: "lol
mike and ako aint never gettin a license again...;D

Essentially, I agree: how hard can it be just to touch base with the licensees.... just occassionally.. a bit ...rather then MG carrying the weight." }-

We will see. ;D

I doubt you can find many "civilians" who have been/are more ethusiastic on Prevx than Mike and me, and we have also put some effort on testing in order to help developing Prevx (Most of the work has been presented in our numerous posts here and especially at Castlecops during last 2 years, some has remained between us and Prevx).

Shoot the messager...

[Threedog]

Prevx 2.0 has been one of my most recommended security apps to people but now I am having reservations on it. Like, I don't know what the Marketing people are thinking (smoking) over there with all their focus being on CSI and cleanup, but what the people want is PREVENTION! With 2.0 they have an app that has the ability to be top dog in this market. It's easy for the "non Wilders" computer user to understand and use. It just needs a little more TLC by the Prevx ladies and lads.

[simmikie]

-{ Quote: "We will see. ;D

I doubt you can find many "civilians" who have been/are more ethusiastic on Prevx than Mike and me, and we have also put some effort on testing in order to help developing Prevx (Most of the work has been presented in our numerous posts here and especially at Castlecops during last 2 years, some has remained between us and Prevx).

Shoot the messager..." }-

this really is true. in spite of the 'let's shoot ourselfs in the foot' approach to customer relations, i am very much looking forward to a revamped Prevx2 or P3.

i have finally weaned myself from classic HIPS, and am running Comodo Pro as a firewall only (one must disable D+, reboot, and then uncheck all of the Monitor This boxes, reboot, and D+ is sterile/gone) Defensewall (replacing D+ and SafeSpace), Avira, & Threatfire (these 2 to be replaced with A2 Antimalware as soon as i get to my primary snapshot). but as soon as P3 or reworked P2 surface, i will without hesitation replace A2 (as impressed as i am by it) with Prevx's latest offering. i believe wholeheartedly in the concept, and Prevx ability to execute. it's their commitment to the home user base i question.


Mike

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "And complete silence falled again..." }-

Sorry, I don't understand what and why should I reply. His post was totally sarcastic, so I don't see why I should reply.

Every answer I could give, it wouldn't change Mike's thoughts - as he has always said on his posts.

So, what should I reply? I've already written what I had to write.

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: ";D ;D
A2s scan results are more to trust then PrevX, prevx tends to flag everything. They create a huge database of all files they find no matter if good or bad I don´t know if this is a good strategy. People become confused, they should only flag bad files that are really bad." }-

Totally wrong and simplistic thougt used when someone doesn't know exactly how does everything work behind the database.

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "I was quite a big fan of Prevx until it let Antivirus 2009 fully install without letting off a peep and then when I checked the logs it showed all green lights beside everything it had installed. I had returnil flicked on and had purposly let it install just to see what Prevx would do with it. This was all done with Prevx on ABC mode. With it on Pro mode AV 2009 didn't stand a chance." }-

I could show you n-thousands malwares that bypass most security solutions, it *could* happen to every security software, even to Prevx.

We do the best to prevent every malware to damage your system, but if something - for any reason - bypass Prevx, then it could be really useful to report the sample to Prevx Research labs so that the detection can be added.

[Longboard]

-{ Quote: "So, what should I reply? I've already written what I had to write" }- You're doing fine MG: grateful for you responding at all.
WE did actually pay some $$ for this and expect some 'service' more than the utility sitting there. :)
-{ Quote: "it wouldn't change Mike's thoughts - as he has always said on his posts" }-Cant speak for him: but he has always described liking PX: just wants clear feedback and a roadmap it seems.
Devt, Position of CSI v PX, etc etc..
-{ Quote: "So, what should I reply? I've already written what I had to write." }- Still doing fine.

LOl we are a bunch of dogs chewing on a bone: MG are you marketing support or high placed tech person.?
These comments actually express strong interest and clear commitment from endusers.
The exact role of CC forum remains unclear: support or feedback.??
Not counting the really slow load times and drop-outs.
TBH with some of the e-mail support some responses were: hmm a little less than adequate.
The forum format at least 'expands' the kb in a rapid way and allows collective increase in experience.

Need a "better" forum methinks.
You (MG) seem to be the only responder to any comments or q's lately and mostly here.
:thumb:

[simmikie]

-{ Quote: "Every answer I could give, it wouldn't change Mike's thoughts - as he has always said on his posts." }-

not true MG. changing my mind about Prevx as an organization, will only require one simple action. communicate. i am already a beliver in the product (Prevx2) and at one time was very positive about Prevx support.

no end-user should feel as though they are an imposition when attempting to get answers to questions we feel are relevant to the usage or understanding of the product.

my mind is very willing to be changed, but the ball is in your court, not mine.


Mike

[Biscuit]

Now that the Prevx2 software has stabilised in the past year, I have been using Prevx2 very successfully on both my own & my customer systems. I have found PrevxCSI to also be a useful cleaner & will tend to try this product first in infection situations. On all occasions I have found that PrevxCSI will clean the Antivirus2008/2009 spyware.

[ako]

-{ Quote: "Sorry, I don't understand what and why should I reply. His post was totally sarcastic, so I don't see why I should reply.

Every answer I could give, it wouldn't change Mike's thoughts - as he has always said on his posts.

So, what should I reply? I've already written what I had to write." }-

I think Longboard and Simmikie already answered this. You of course cannot tell details of roadmap etc, but we would like to get answers to relevant questions. Why Prevx decided to stop communicating at Castlecops support forum?

[Biscuit]

Maybe the same reason as me? I've not been able to reach Castlecops for over 2 weeks! :(

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "MG are you marketing support or high placed tech person.?" }-

I'm malware researcher and developer, nothing related to marketing support :)

[Longboard]

-{ Quote: "I'm malware researcher and developer" }-And as we know a bloody good one
Sorry, that was badly phrased q. I knew that.

;)
get the publicity/marketing/'relationship' guys to come and take some flack: do they care about grumbles ??
-{ Quote: "I've not been able to reach Castlecops for over 2 weeks" }-:(
Yes.
Very a big shame, such a great site.
I know they have issues with servers , but, it's a real effort getting there let alone posting.

:shifty: hint to PrevX : @Wilders
There's a parallel universe here already. ;)

[SystemJunkie]

-{ Quote: "Totally wrong and simplistic thougt used when someone doesn't know exactly how does everything work behind the database." }-Not totally wrong, it is simplistic thought yes but maybe you can shed some light about the system.

[bellgamin]

-{ Quote: "I've not been able to reach Castlecops for over 2 weeks! :(" }-My sympathies are with CastleCops proponents. However, it is of questionable utility for Prevx to maintain its support forum on a host that is often down &, when up, often can't seem to provide enough bandwidth to enable users to readily post there.

I suggest Prevx re-locate their support forum to another provider such as...

Gladiator Security Forums (http://forum.gladiator-antivirus.com/index.php?)
OR
Smokey's (http://www.smokey-services.eu/forum/index.php)
OR
Dozleng (http://www.dozleng.com/updates/index.php?)

OR -- maybe Prevx should set-up its own, stand-alone support forum, as has been done by several others such as Online Armor, Drive Sentry, & System Safety Monitor.

In my case, I will not buy any software as complex as a security app UNLESS it has a VIABLE support forum, plus an excellent reputation for fast & friendly & effective support. As of now, Prevx does not meet those criteria.

[lordpake]

@bellgamin: I don't think it's necessary to move their forum :) After all, I don't remember seeing many posts from PrevX staff for a long time there. Perhaps if they actually were active there it'd be worth the trouble to relocate it ...

[EraserHW]

-{ Quote: "Not totally wrong, it is simplistic thought yes but maybe you can shed some light about the system." }-

In the past, we've revealed some info on our how databases work, but, our policy has changed and no one is allowed to say anything about how any of our back end software works. Yes, it's a bit of security by obscurity, but having a majority of our code on the server prevents malware authors from doing any reverse engineering and getting around our systems.

@All:

We're looking into options outside of castlecops for a forum, but we probably won't establish anything at least until P3 is released.

Btw I'll be out during all the next week, so if I won't reply please don't write immediately "Ah, Prevx support sucks because they don't reply etc...etc..."

[simmikie]

-{ Quote: "until P3 is released." }-

:o ;D :argh: :thumb: :thumb: :D just to be clear! 8)


Mike

[Longboard]

-{ Quote: "Btw I'll be out during all the next week, so if I won't reply please don't write immediately "Ah, Prevx support sucks because they don't reply etc...etc..." }-"Hey, no problem we already n know where you're going.. heheheheh :lurking:

[ako]

-{ Quote: "

We're looking into options outside of castlecops for a forum, but we probably won't establish anything at least until P3 is released.

" }-

That's good news! :thumb:

-{ Quote: "

Btw I'll be out during all the next week, so if I won't reply please don't write immediately "Ah, Prevx support sucks because they don't reply etc...etc..."

" }-

Have a nice week/vacation(?) :)

Thank you for your comments.