Windows XP allowed to live again

Discussion in 'other software & services' started by HURST, Dec 23, 2008.

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  1. HURST

    HURST Registered Member

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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7795302.stm
     
  2. dw426

    dw426 Registered Member

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    I've got 100 dollars that says it's stay of execution lasts right up until the launch of Windows 7. They know Vista overall is going nowhere (and I do mean overall, not just figures thrown out by the media and MS itself), so they are keeping the peace with the XP lovers until they release 7.
     
  3. ThunderZ

    ThunderZ Registered Member

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    Was thinking the exact same thing. Not going to take that bet. Then again MS has made decisions in the past that have left many scratching their head. o_O So who knows. :rolleyes:

    Had read somewhere that the downgrade(?) to XP on new PC purchases would cost an additional $100+. Can not find the article now.
     
  4. dw426

    dw426 Registered Member

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    Just because they are in a way admitting defeat and bowing to the XP'ers, doesn't mean they aren't going to take a little cash ;)
     
  5. ThunderZ

    ThunderZ Registered Member

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    Guess they gotta recoup the Vista development cost somehow. :D
     
  6. dw426

    dw426 Registered Member

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    You hit the nail square on the head :)
     
  7. Pedro

    Pedro Registered Member

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    I'm pretty sure it's the netbooks. It's a big market. I read that 7 will be lighter, and capable of carrying the XP 'torch'.
    Think about it. If you don't get XP, you get an option: Linux. There goes ~1/3 of the market. :)
     
  8. ThunderZ

    ThunderZ Registered Member

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    Have not read much about 7 yet. Really still early and you know what they say about the best laid plans..... But if what you say is true my interest has just been raised.
     
  9. dw426

    dw426 Registered Member

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    Well, reports are saying that Windows 7 is being developed into a "Linux killer". Think about what Linux has to offer, and then, think about Windows 7 being developed and released exactly the way MS intends. You have a Windows that is small, light, secure (if the "sudo" methodology is incorporated), and, from pictures I've seen, MUCH nicer looking than Vista. If all that is the case, then Linux has nothing left to offer except being free, IMHO of course.

    Let's break this down just for the heck of it:

    Linux Pros:

    1. Security touted due to user not being able to perform system changes unless rights are elevated.

    2. Free

    3. A treasure trove of free apps that are 99.9% spyware/virus free (if downloaded from official repositories).

    4. Light resource usage and easier hardware requirements (though at this point in time, I must say unless your running a 6 year old computer, Linux is only ahead because of Vista in this pro).

    5. Compiz Fusion looks great.

    6. Cute little mascot (yeah, I did have to).

    Linux Cons:

    1. Very little official support unless it is a commercial distro. Meaning you have to go on a hunting trip if something screws up you've not dealt with before.

    2. Gaming is still quite far off from where it is in Windows, and doesn't look like it will speed up much anytime soon.

    3. Websites are still in the "Windows" frame of mind. Meaning some won't work at all, some are crippled due to proprietary plugin usage and certain aspects needing IE.

    4. Open source programs have a habit of being abandoned or developed at a snails pace, and Linux uses 99.9% open source software. (Yes, feel free to pick apart this con, this one is mainly opinion).



    Windows 7 (and general Windows) Pros:

    1. If the Sudo method is used, Linux can no longer claim security as its top advantage. And any other security issue is handled easily with apps.

    2. Official support widely available.

    3. Apps, apps, and more apps, and few likely to have "that one guy in the basement" up and quit on them.

    4. Gaming is top notch.

    5. Looks great (if Windows 7 screenshots are to be believed)

    6. No issues with websites unless a low user-base browser is being used (Here's staring at you Opera).

    7. Will (again, if information so far is correct) run better on lower hardware. No, it may not run on that 6+ year old system...but why are you still using it anyway?

    Windows 7 (and general Windows) Cons:

    1. Resource usage.

    2. Hardware requirements can be high (Thank God though Vista is on its way to the wastebasket).

    3. Security lacking because of default running of Admin privileges and browser intergration with the OS.

    4. Wide usage and Con#3 leads to widespread virus and spyware attacks.

    5. No mascot ( I am kind of mad about that, yes).

    So, basically, what Linux TRULY offers is security, low hardware requirements, and looks. If Windows 7 can meet or exceed these very good reasons to use Linux, then Linux, for the mainstream is laid in a coffin and buried, IMHO.
     
  10. Meriadoc

    Meriadoc Registered Member

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    A quote from Linus Torvalds springs to mind when replying to the notion that MS is evil
    :) No, I'm sure with 7 they'll get right this time. :doubt: :)

    XP will live on for quite awhile yet.
     
  11. JRViejo

    JRViejo Global Moderator

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    While I don't disagree with dw426's thesis at all, I have to agree more with Pedro's. In the last 2 days I have seen lots of people buying Netbooks everywhere and even some in my own family are buying them as Christmas gifts for the kids.

    $350 for a 1 GB, 120 GB Hard drive, built-in Wireless, Camera & Microphone, besides using WinXP, is an irresistible deal!
     
  12. Pedro

    Pedro Registered Member

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    I was only pondering on what MS is thinking. Not who wins or who kills who :)
    ThunderZ, i know as much as you do, but it's what i'm reading.
    JRViejo, that's what i was thinking about, what is MS's target (or one of them).

    dw426, just a few comments, perhaps it will help you get another perspective.

    Support: From my own personal experience, i think you get better support. But do remember not to compare support from a distro you downloaded with Windows. The one you want to compare with is, yes, a commercial distro. But even for free, me thinks you would be surprised with how much people can help you, and willing. Seasoned Linux users / developers, i bet, know more about Linux than their counterpart from Windows. Reason - source is known, development is open (and you can follow), people mess with it everyday. And if you're reporting a bug, they want to fix it - you get developers willing to sort the issue. I don't like generalizations, but it's my own personal experience.
    It will vary, as with everything in life, from distro to distro, developers and so on though. Pick one that aims for the masses.

    Games: for some type of games, i think it will be better in the next 5 years. Some "engines" are maturing, and are being used in other projects etc.
    But for top commercial games, most aren't made for anything other than Windows. What you need here is WINE or the commercial Crossover. I just tried Deus Ex and it runs perfectly. In fact, and this is really weird, it's running better than on XP (?).
    I think Crossover is a mysterious piece of the puzzle, yet to be taken seriously. Probably lack of publicity.

    Websites: i use Debian at home, not Windows. It's rare to find a website that won't work well these days. But it may still be a problem, you may just have to run IE6 in WINE! I haven't found the need yet.

    "Open source programs have a habit of being abandoned or developed at a snails pace": yes, i feel the need to pick this apart. I think you're thinking of some programs made for Windows, and forgetting tons of closed source programs that had that "habit". Any program could be abandoned, regardless of license. The difference is, with a free/ open source program there is the possibility that someone continues it, or use the code.

    Windows 7:
    "Official support widely available" : true, but guess what, when i needed it, it just sucked :)
    Forums are the best Windows support ime..
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2008
  13. dw426

    dw426 Registered Member

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    Hi, Pedro. Looking back, yes, I can see your arguments and where I may have jumped the gun a bit with generalizations. I do still believe that games are always going to lack in Linux, and it's not because of capability, but money. Game developers, just as other software makers and, especially driver developers, are always going to be Windows first, everything else last, people. MS just pours too much money to them for that to change in the forseeable future.

    As far as my outlook on open source software, it's been my experience that almost every time I find some useful program, a quick look in the support forums shows posts containing " Is this ever going to be fixed?", or, "Where did he/she (the developer) go?". Of course that can happen in the closed source world also, and it wasn't my intent to show that only open source software has this problem. Only that it is more prevalent in open source.

    I think the biggest thing with websites, and I should have been clearer on this, is plugins. I'm in no way able to explain the technical reason behind it, but experience has shown me that some websites are coded in such a way that only the Windows version of, let's say Flash, works properly (this especially seemed to happen with sound applets in games, Pogo.com being a prime example). That and video card drivers may very well be why Linux has never reached the masses.

    Looking back on my post about support, I managed to forget my experiences with "Jason" (name made up), who couldn't speak a word of english hardly and who liked to transfer me to other departments when the answer to my question wasn't in his training manual he left open.
     
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