Using Windows 8

Tough decision eh? Kinda hard to justify it, even at that price...

 

Allow me to tempt you. Windows 8 is more lightweight. Look at all the garbage removed!

http://www.msfn.org/board/topic/156585-features-and-options-removed-in-windows-8/

 

Blazing faster performance too! (after disabling various 7 components and aero glass, i wonder what 7 would do).

http://www.bit-tech.net/bits/software/2012/10/26/windows-8-performance-benchmarks/1

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/windows-8-gaming-performance,3331.html

http://arstechnica.com/information-...our-benches-measuring-windows-8s-performance/

http://www.zdnet.com/windows-8-vs-windows-7-benchmarked-7000002671/

Upgrade now, don't remain with a mature OS, where all drivers and programs work fine, when you can have all this goodness plus live tiles!

 

The move could have gone a lot better had they not dumped "touch tech" into the same OS designed for desktops. There was little desktop hardware to support it and now hardware manufacturers are going nuts to get supported hardware out..helping to stall Windows 8 growth. They could have easily separated mobile from desktop and I'm fairly sure it would have taken off. Sure, desktop users can tweak things around and not see "Metro", but the initial impression is what sells, and not many are liking what they see on first boot. 8 at its core is not a bad little OS. It's too bad that a design decision is screwing it out of its chance in a major market.

 

Wrong. Why would hardware manufacturers push touch based hardware when the OS doesn't support it? Touch for Windows 7, no thanks.

First things first, you need to make software that's touch oriented. Then you can build the touch oriented hardware to run that software on. Obviously there will by a dry period between the software being ready and the market becoming flooded with touch based hardware, that's inevitable.

Also, by building Windows 8 Microsoft has opened the door to a new type of device, hybrids, something not possible before.

 

I was somewhat apprehensive when I installed Window 8 Pro - I was already running Windows 8 CP in Virtualbox and had experienced a number of stability issues, including Metro Apps frequently not working. (got to expect that in a pre-release I guess) I bought the 'cheap' disk upgrade pack on the assumption that the price would only increase as adoption of Windows 8 grew. My fears have since vanished as the upgrade to Windows 8 Pro has proved it's worth. I don't mind the Start Menu at all – but admit that I do use Classic Shell Start Menu as much, if not more. I'm a 'mouse' man and despite having a Notebook (which I use as a 'desktop') I dislike using touchpads, so I use a wireless mouse – I prefer navigating Windows 8 (via Classic Shell) with my mouse than using the Start Menu, but otherwise enjoy using Windows 8. I could configure Start Menu with my apps – but since I have Classic Shell, why bother? I have an SSD installed – and find that things happen lightning quick in Windows 8 – programs seem to open far quicker than in Windows 7. Eg, I have a Windows Mail account and accessing it via Windows 8 is instantaneous, unlike Windows 7 where it's a painfully slow process. I see Windows 8 as still scrambling up the hill – will it reach the top? - hmmm! - on current uptake, that seems a moot question.
Would I use Windows 8 in preference to 7? - not in the near future, but then I don't need to - I already have the best of both worlds! When I fire up Windows 7, I launch virtualbox > Windows 8 – I can then use both systems simultaneously - to switch between the 2 systems takes only one click!

 

Huh? I'm confused, Funky. Hardware manufacturers weren't pushing touch hardware until Windows 8. That was my point, Windows 8 desktop was pushing touch in a pretty touch-less environment (home users without tablets/smartphones at least). I agree that the software coming first is right, but that's also another reason people don't seem to be taking to Win 8. On their current systems, out of the box it's just a strange experience. Tweak it a bit, and yeah, there's a nice little OS under that initial UI. But most folks tend to like or dislike something from what they see right there in the store or when they get it home. The hardware market wasn't ready for Windows 8, but since MS doesn't seem to want to let go of touch, the hardware market will have to get ready. It was they that were complaining as well about Windows 8.

I don't know how hybrids will fair, but I'm sure we'll eventually see.

 

In what exactly are you basing your opinions on popular reactions to 1. hands-on experiences with devices made with Windows 8 in mind and 2. the looks of the Modern UI (Metro)? Are you working at some store? As for "youtube videos" and "web comments", there are plenty for every perspective.

Personally, I visit stores at the most expensive shoppings on my area frequently and what I see is enormous excitement with Windows 8 and devices made with it in mind (on the positive side), and somewhat poor availability of said devices (on the negative side).

Not surprisingly, most devices made with Windows 8 in mind are expensive atm.

 

I'm not basing any opinions on Youtube videos or general web comments. My comments come from years of knowing how the masses react to change that "upsets their apple cart", personal relationships with both brick and mortar staff and several online retailers, who more than once have said the interest is very low. Respectable tech media websites have more than once agreed upon that, and really, the presence or lack of interest in your area or my area does not mean overall success. There are quite a few more areas in the world with people and wallets. The truth is simply that, as of yet, those wallets aren't opening as much as MS was expecting.

And yes, the lack of available devices is also hurting it. I base my thoughts on the evidence available to me, those thoughts are not the end all, be all of thoughts however. We disagree it seems, and that's fine, we're allowed to do that.

 

The comment about your understanding of "the masses" is empty IMO - for the simple reason that there is no consensus on whether the changes are pleasing or upsetting for the majority. Besides, the majority isn't necessarily always right.

The comment about your "personal relationships with both brick and mortar staff" (your words) is also empty, unless you elaborate and tell us what data they showed to you and what supports that data. If this isn't happening (most likely), emptiness remains.

As for the comment about several online retailers and "respectable" tech media websites - here, again, you can find evidence that supports every perspective (from the most positive to the most negative).

I would also like to remember that I wasn't questioning Windows 8 sales and market performance, I was questioning the popular reactions (if they are mostly positive or mostly negative) to devices made with Windows 8 in mind and the Modern UI.

Sales and market performance are a very different matter, because many other factors enter the equation.

 

Would you care to tell me exactly what else there is in deciding whether a product fails or succeeds beyond sales/market performance..to those in sales and marketing? I can turn it around and ask you for data regarding your empty comment of "enormous excitement" (Where do you live, in Redmond?). But will you do that? Not likely. I have no data on sales to show you from these companies, though I'm fairly certain I can believe those in position to tell from my contacts at Best Buy, TigerDirect, Fry's, Newegg and several others. If I can't, well, that's a problem for me I guess.

What do I know about the "masses", beyond having spent several years in sales as well? Well, I know they get googly'eyed by spec sheets they don't understand, they get frustrated by things missing (say, the Start button?) or information overload , and change in general can bother them.

As far as tech websites go, well, I get the same information you do, and right at the moment, after the praises of Windows 8 have been talked over, the bad showing of Windows 8 as an OS has taken over the discussions. You know, popular reaction has a very big influence on sales and marketing, so yes, reaction to devices the OS was designed for is generally good, hell I like it somewhat on those devices. But the PC market still exists, and millions of users with it. They have a very different reaction, and you don't need them all to come in here and support my opinion, the data is out there for you to read, and shows it. It really matters not if this majority is right or wrong. They may hate it for the wrong reasons, they may be MS fanboys or girls who will eat anything MS feeds them. Sales and marketing departments and MS doesn't care why they buy or don't buy, they simply care if they do or don't.

You don't have data for your opinion, I don't have sales sheets from companies or a million users to call you up and tell you themselves. So, we're both stuck. Windows 8 will fail or succeed no matter what we think, so let's just leave it there.

 

There are many many reasons why great sales/market performance isn't the one and only factor in deciding if a product generates popular good impression or not. Instead of listing all them, I'll try a more material example. Try to imagine the usual impression people have when they see and experiment a Rolex Submariner. Amazingly positive? Something like that. But what about its sales and market performance compared to most other watches? Definitely, not great.

The situation we have now is that devices made with Windows 8 (and Windows Phone 8 ) in mind are almost "luxury goods", when compared to the other options the market is currently filled with.

 

Lack of hardware plays in, I'm sure, but that's not MS's fault; the manufacturers aren't going to invest a lot in creating hardware unless they are at least somewhat confident that it will sell, so it's not unusual that they would wait and see -- the same thing dealt a big blow to Vista because of software vendors holding off on making software Vista Compatible (due to the major structural changes for security that so many people demanded).

Tablets are changing the way that people compute and think about computing, and many believe that tablets will eventually replace desktop systems. It would be foolish for MS to ignore this, and they are betting on everything becoming touch enabled (I don't believe this about desktops, but whatever). The other part of it is to create a unified experience with all of your devices.

The magic of Windows 8 will come when people have multiple Windows 8 devices including phone, tablet, and X-Box (or other companies make their devices Win8 compatible), and when there's more mobile apps. You'll have the ability to access and control your info and media across devices, developers and engineers will come up with brilliant and innovative ways to enhance entertainment and productivity with things like docking apps on the side of your screen, and so on.

It's still very early days, and it's a bigger change than anything in the Windows world since Win95, so the people using it now are early adopters. People aren't going to get it and will find a multitude of reasons to gripe while others wait for the new stuff to mature, but once things get going a bit I think that a lot of things will change. Until then, Windows 8 on the desktop really isn't a huge change, and you can enjoy the better performance and security until things pick up.

Windows 8 is the first step in a long term play; it's a transitional product between current and future devices. If you're at all passionate about technology, then Windows 8 will be exciting, if not for what it does now then the opportunities for new innovation for the future. Windows 8 doesn't need to be a runaway hit right out of the gate as long as it can get the ball rolling so that Windows is ready for the future of computing when it comes.

Right now it's just like the earliest days of Android when there were few apps; it "sucked" because it was just a platform and it's the apps that bring it to life. And yes: hardware too; just don't blame MS, because their job is creating a basic platform, and we know what happens when they try to make anything more. If MS failed at anything it was consumer education.

Personally I have no problems using Windows 8 with a mouse; the only thing that I might want different would be bigger/more visible hotspots.

 

That's a hell of an example there, Wild Fantastic pieces, but I wasn't really referring to limited and highly specialized markets. You made a good point though.

 

I bought W8 when I built my last computer because it was cheap and I bypass the metro screen. Having a mouse allows me to click fairly accurately on a small box. I don't need those hulking squares like someone with a touchpad might. Just in terms of convenience, having programs pinned to the taskbar means less mouse movement overall, especially since I have muscle memory from previous Windows version.

 

The debate about Windows 8 Metro Start, is quite frankly.............getting boring The same thing happened with Windows 7, people didn't like a particular feature, Well Give It a Rest! It's simple enough, if you don't like it, DON'T! use Windows 8 What is the point of upgrading if your just going to revert it back to the way it was with a previous version. After All behind the Cloak and Dagger of Windows 7 or 8 is exactly the same thing.........A Windows OS, and it's about time people started realizing this

 

They are not "exactly the same thing" and Modern UI (Metro) isn't the only difference. More complete lists:

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/explore-windows-8.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8#New_and_changed_features
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_8
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_features_removed_in_Windows_8

 

Just thought I'd point out my sarcasm here (since I imagine most people won't catch it I've colored it red) should've put upgrading in quotes to emphasize that windows 8 is actually a downgrade from windows 7.

 

I still got 21 days before the $40.00 promo expires . . .
Decisions . . . Decisions . . .

 

try the demo before you spend the money.

 

Well each to their own I guess, but I'm going to buy 3 more Windows 8 licences (I currently have 2) before the end of the month.

 

Thanks for the reminder. I just bought another license.

 

Yeah, I found that out. Thanks

And sorry for the late response.

BTW, on my Windows 8 laptop, I didn't see the Windows Update taskbar icon (in desktop mode) informing me that there are updates available like in Windows 7. Today I just opened Windows Update from the Control Panel and found updates available. Do I need to change something in the configuration, or am I missing something here? Are Windows update notifications shifted to the login screen or something?

Also, is there any way to bring back the "Non Plug and Play Devices" in Device Manager?

As for my opinion....I think Windows 7 was not a huge upgrade over Vista since I had a very good experience with Vista and only upgraded since I could no longer find an anytime upgrade pack for my Vista Home Basic. But Windows 8 is....interesting. My brother hates Metro though! I haven't bought Windows 8 for my desktop yet though....I'm going to have to think about it, and well, I think I don't really need the features of the Pro version

 

I just bought Win8 that came with my new Dell computer. At first I thought I had made a bad mistake getting Win8. But it has been 4 days now, and I am starting to get used to it. For just using the desktop, it really isn't that different. I have had a hard time trying to find some of the stuff that I previously had no problem finding. In a way I like it better, in a way, I don't. I have no use for a touch screen, as I have arthritis in my shoulder. I am not sure how ergonomics plays a part with a desk top touch screen. I am using an older screen, that I had with XP. I loved XP, but I think I enjoyed Win 7 even more. I never had Vista, so I cannot comment on that. I do like the new task manager very much. I would use more of the aps on the start screen, but they want a Microsoft account for some of that stuff. I just want to be able to use my yahoo email account on the mail ap in metro. I can't share, use my calendar, or email, without a Microsoft account. I use Yahoo, because that is who my service provider uses for our email. I hate the way Win8 shuts down. So I added the classic button. It is less time consuming that way. When I do want to close an ap in metro, it is more time consuming with a mouse. To make matters worse, I can't tell if an ap really closed, and what aps are still open. You have to take your mouse all the way up to the top, then pull down, the ap gets smaller, and then it goes down...it still shows a small pic, and I don't know if it is totally closed when I do that. All of this will take some adjustment. I know I like Win 8 much more today, than on day one. Day one was not good at all. I got this computer because my Win 7 laptop bit the dust. It just turned 3 years old, and the screws were falling out, the battery needed to be replaced, and the final straw was the power jack in the computer. That would of cost 200 dollars to get fixed, not even counting the battery. So I just said to heck with it, I'm going back to a desk top.