True Image 10 (retail version)

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by mccoady, Apr 8, 2009.

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  1. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    I'm a new user with this software and find the user instructions very complicated, I want to create an image of my current C drive and then replace that drive with a larger drive. What I've done so far:

    Booted from the Acronis True Image 10 cd rom (retail version) and followed the steps here: http://www.whatsabyte.com/P1/Acronis_image.htm I checked the NTFS (C) box but not the Fat32 box. The image backup is now on my other internal drive M.

    Beside buying an OEM hard drive from newegg I haven't installed it yet I'm still using the original C hard drive.

    I was getting ready to install the new drive and follow these instructions to restore the image to it: http://www.whatsabyte.com/P1/Acronis_restore.htm

    So to begin with have I created the image correctly and I'm now ready to install the new drive and then proceed restoring the image I created to it by booting from the cd rom?

    My computer (local company build) came with a Factory Restore program with several options that you got to during the booting cycle, will this be transferred with the image of my C drive?
     
  2. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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  3. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    Okay I went back and checked Disk 1 so now the restore will have both the C: partition and Fat32 partition so that part has been corrected.

    Okay this is confusing to me, first what is the MBR I do not see that when creating the image? Also I know very little about Partitions, how to use them or how to create them.

    My original C drive is 250GB and my new drive is 750GB so what happens during restore to the new drive space if I just select Disk 1 instead of first restoring MBR and Fat32 and then during a second restore C:? Would I not have most of the 750GB allocated to the C Drive?

    Since I've not went through a restore yet it may get a little confusing to me when it asks "Where to store the image" and "Then choose the hard disk drive location that the image will be placed".

    Hey thanks John for trying to help me through this!
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2009
  4. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    Right. With some systems a drive other than the boot drive is number 1 (and on some screens the first drive is called 0). It's an excellent idea to give your C: partition a name. In My Computer, right click on the C: drive and then click Properties. You can give it a name at the top of this window. Call it anything not too long, like George or Nancy or Boot. That way even if some other partition gets the C: drive letter, you will see Boot and know that's your real boot drive. Similarly, give your M: drive a name like Martha or Mop or Backup to identify it.

    When you boot from the Rescue CD which uses the Linux operating system, the order of drives can change, so names can help you avoid disasterous mistakes.

    Every hard drive that you use has at least one partition. Your current drive has two. One is formatted FAT-32, an older format used by Windows 9x and fine for small partitions; and the other (C:) is formatted NTFS which is preferred for Windows XP.

    You create a partition when you install an operating system or install a new hard drive that has only unallocated space.

    That would be fine. The Master Boot Record will be transferred to the new drive to make it bootable, then the FAT32 and C: partitions will be written to the drive. Doing it this way, the two partitions will be the same size as the ones on your 250GB drive, and you will have about 500GB of unallocated space. That's fine for the moment, and you could test to see that this drive boots up normally.

    You could then go back to the restore process and restore only the C: parttion from the backup (source) and restore it over the C: partition on the new drive (target). Since you are now only restoring C:, you will get the screen where you can increase the size that you want C: to be on the new drive. You could make it the entire drive, except for the FAT32 partition, or less than that if you think you might want another partition, perhaps for data or whatever.

    Most people have only the C: partition for normal use on their computer (they may not even know that a diagnostic or other partitin exists because it doesn't have a drive letter and is invisible to Windows Explorer. Since that's the normal and most common setup, it's obviously not a bad thing.

    Some people like to have another partition for data or other stuff that they don't want to have on C:. It's a matter of personal preference. Some people put their most valuable data on this partition so they can back it up easily without having to include Windows and programs. Other people put their least valuable data there and never back it up. It's just personal preference like what you put in your attic or basement or safe deposit box.

    That's what it asks when you are creating a backup: what to backup (source) and where to store the backup (target). You pick Drive 2 with the C: partition as the souce and your other inxternal drive M: as the target. Actually, you can pick a folder on the M: drive to store the backup.

    When you do a restore, the source will be where the backup is, M: and, the target will be where you want to restore the image. If you are restoring the entire drive, the target is the new drive, drive 2.

    If you are restoring only the C: partiton, then you pick just that from the souce and restore it to the C: partition on the new drive 2.

    Sounds like you are ready to go as soon as you make the backup of the entire drive.
     
  5. dwalby

    dwalby Registered Member

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    Ah, I just noticed you did a recent edit, I thought I was going crazy because there was a mention about the M: partition before that is no longer there.

    The MBR is the Master Boot Record, its a small sector of code that the computer uses to boot with. You will want to restore that to the new disk. Its not within the C: partition boundaries, so a restore of the C: partition won't include it.

    Its been a while since I restored a complete disk, but I think if you check the entire disk on the restore menu it will restore all the partitions plus the MBR, essentially replicating your 250GB drive on the new 750GB drive.

    So if I understand you correctly, you're going to remove the 250GB disk that has the OS on it, replace it with the new 750GB disk, and the image you plan on restoring from is on the M: partition, which is on a separate disk that will remain installed in the computer, right?

    If so, boot using the Acronis disk and then follow the instructions as you see them in the link you attached, but you won't see the step where it asks you to reboot because you will be running from the boot disk already. Select the image file from the M: partition, then select the entire disk checkbox, then select the physical disk you want to restore to and click on proceed.

    Acronis will create the new partitions on the new disk for you in the process, so you don't really need to know how to do partitioning. It will prompt you about changing the partition size, but for now to keep it simple just keep the same size you had before.

     
  6. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    You understand correctly what I'm wanting to do and the M drive is a second internal drive I use for my music/data backups that is where the backup image was placed. I also have an external drive where I store my final backups. I like the idea of naming the drives like John suggested.

    I have noticed when I am booting from the Acronis disc and creating an image when I'm done I exist the program and then it goes to "System Restarting". I didn't know at this point if I should leave the disc in or remove it although I've tried it both ways, but it kinds of stays on that screen forever so I end up doing a hard shutdown. I've been using "Full mode" and haven't tried "Safe mode" so know if the behavior is the same or not is this normal?


    Whoa Nelly I'm getting an error screen E000101F4 ("Failed to read data from disk/Failed to read from the sector 0 of the hard disk") and also ("Failed to read from the sector 6,160,047 of the hard disk 3") not what I was expecting and my options are to Retry (doesn't work), Ignore, Ignore all or cancel. The first time I clicked on "Proceed I got the error and it wouldn't even start restoring but after trying several times and going back to the beginning of the restore it would start but then I would get the error somewhere along in the process.

    Okay now everytime I got the error after it actually started the restore I clicked on cancel but instead of canceling the program it continued on with the restore this happened 2 or 3 times. The last time I clicked on cancel it was about done with the restore so it said the restore was completed and existed out of the restore, I think it rebooted my computer at this point. Windows did load like normal with the image now on the new drive so is there likely to be errors within the OS or drive since I had several error messages during the restore with the end result my having to reinstall the old drive and creating a new image?

    By the way it wouldn't let me select to restore just the MBR and Fat32 I had to choose one or the other so I selected to restore everything on Disk 1 (thought my C drive was listed as Disk 2 but it was Disk 1).
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2009
  7. dwalby

    dwalby Registered Member

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    I don't know if its normal, but it doesn't sound like anything to worry about. However, you can do the image step while the OS is running, no need to use the boot disk for that step.


    yeah, the Acronis restore wizard should allow you to resize the C: partition larger during the restore operation, it will give you a range of possible size which will take into account the FAT partition. You drag the ends of the partition graphic to expand/contract the target partition size.

    This sounds bad, like you have a disk problem with your drive containing the M: partition. This will probably prevent you from being able to do a successful restore of the C: partition to the new disk. You will most likely have to reinstall the old disk with your OS, and I'd recommend doing a new backup image of the C: partition to another drive like an external USB if you have one.
     
  8. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    So you're saying the Image Backup must be done by rebooting from the Acronis disc but the Restore does not?

    I was afraid you were going to say that, yes I do have an external drive I can make a new backup to. Now this time when I do the backup are you saying I only have to backup the C: partition only not MBR and Fat32?

    After I make the new backup is there anyway to check the image backup this time to make sure it is good before I swap out the drives?

    I use a program called Diskeeper that runs in the background and auto defrags my drives and I noticed after putting the image on the new drive when I open the program I'm getting an error screen for the C drive "MMC has detected an error in a snap-in. It is recommended you shut down and restart MMC." Not sure what this means but I never had it on the old drive so I'm assuming it has to do with the above restore errors.
     
  9. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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  10. dwalby

    dwalby Registered Member

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    The other way around, you can do the image backups with Windows running as Acronis can lock down any partition and copy it elsewhere to do the image backup. During restore of the C: partition you'll be overwriting the OS partition, so you can't have it running at that time, so you need the boot disk for that operation. Both image backup and restore of non-OS partitions can be done with Windows running and doesn't require the boot disk at all. Some people prefer to use the boot disk for everything, just to avoid any possible OS hiccups, but that is a matter of personal choice.
     
  11. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    Okay John I've created a new image (C,Fat32, MBR), backed it up to my external drive, restored it to Disk 1 partition and put it on my new 750GB drive. The only differences this time besides backing up the image to my external drive is I missed these directions last (Acronis True Image will warn you that there are partitions on the drive you have chosen and ask what you want to do with them. Select yes to delete all the partitions on the hard drive before restoring.") This step defaults to no so I selected yes this time. I also ran CCleaner to clean up old files and leftover registry.

    Anyway there was no error screens this time although it seems to be hanging on reboot or shutdown and when I clicked on a drive and properties the screen wouldn't appear for awhile. I rebooted and the second issue didn't reappear (for now anyway) but Windows still hung on reboot. I just ran a disc check and may run the Western Digital Diagnostic software just to rule out things.

    I was having some of the same issues with my old drive before I ran a Factory Restore program that fixed everything although I did have to reinstall my programs. I did all of this before I created an image backup of the old drive.

    So if Window's keeps hanging that might not be something I can live with especially since I had just fixed it on my old drive but for now I need to know how I increase the size of the C drive I'm getting confused on what to select:

    1. Click on Recover

    2. "Partition on Disk To Restore"- NTFS (C)

    3. "Restored Partition Location"- Do I highlight "NTFS (C)" 230.5GB or "Unallocated" 465.86GB?

    4. Next step is to select "Active" or "Logical"- if you highlighted "NTFS (C)" then it defaults to "Active" but if you highlighted "Unallocated" it defaults to "Logical". "Active"- Active is the partition the computer boots from. "Logical"-Logical is recommended if the partition image does not contain an OS that is booted from a Primary partition. Which one?

    5. "Restored Partition Size"- If I highlighted "NTFS (C)" 230.5GB then I can't increase the slider it's at maximum. If I highlighted "Unallocated" 465.86GB then I can increase the slider to the 465.86GB.

    I want the C drive to include every GB available allowing for Fat32 so how do I achieve that? Shouldn't I end up having around 700Gb (C partition) or more total capacity allowing for Fat32?
     
  12. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    That sounds good. Hanging or slow shut down can be due to a program that you installed not closing properly. Since the OEM restore didn't have this problem, you might be able to watch for it after each program that you install if you ever need to repeat that process.

    One way I use True Image is to do a clean install and then make an image, install a few things and make another image and so on. When I discover something that causes problems, I can go back to the last image before that installation and continue from there.

    It is important to check only the box next to C: and not any other box.

    Since you want to make C: larger, you need to select that partition. This will let you increase it's size by expanding it into the currently unallocated space.

    Choose C: as described. You must make it Active to be bootable, and it does contain the Windows OS.

    If you chose only the C: partition to restore, you will be able to increase the size now.

    Just increase the size of C: until the unallocated space is down to zero.

    Sounds like you are almost there.

    By the way, dwalby is absolutely correct that when you make backups, you can do it in Windows if you have TI installed. That's the most convenient way to make backups. If TI isn't installed, you can still make backups from the Rescue CD.
     
  13. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    I forgot to mention one issue that I was having on the old drive (even after the factory restore) and thus was transferred to the new drive is that I'm getting an error screen Windows Explorer needs to shut down followed by Dr Watson sometimes locking up my computer. Just doing normal things like clicking on My Computer or Control Panel so I don't know why this started about a month ago.

    Since I just got another delay with the screen appearing when I clicked on properties of a drive I wonder if this is all connected, it is taking 30 seconds for a screen to come up after I click on properties of a drive and this definitely wasn't going on with my old drive. Hopefully if I reinstall the C partition again it will cure this all that aside the computer's really fast and works well!

    I must be missing something here because I've tried it this way three times and I don't see how to increase the size of C. When I choose C: partition it shows the whole graph filled up to the 230.5Gb capacity so I can't increase it, I don't know what I'm missing?

    Okay under Restored Partition Location:
    Capacity Free Space
    C Partition 230.5GB 193GB
    Fat32 2.375Gb 329.7MB
    Unallocated 465.86GB Unallocated

    I select C Partition and then Active which brings me to the Restored Partition Size:
    Free space before 0 bytes
    Partition Size 230.5 GB
    Free space after 0 bytes

    The bar graph is a full bar showing the maximum 230.5Gb I can decrease the size down to 37.46Gb by moving the slider but I don't how you make it larger than 230.5GB the slider bar is already dragged to the far right as far as it will go. Approximately what should be the highest capacity of the C drive be considering I installed a 750GB drive and Fat 32 is only 2.37GB?

    This has got to be pretty simple I feel so stupid not being able to figure this out too bad there's not another way to increase the C partition size without having to restore the C partition again.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2009
  14. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    John or someone else I'm at a standstill trying to figure out why I can't enlarge the C partition, out of frustration I'm about to give up and reinstall my old drive
     
  15. dwalby

    dwalby Registered Member

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    Its hard to say for sure, but what appears to be happening is the C: partition has the FAT partition between it and the unallocated space. You can only extend the C: partition into the unallocated space, so you're blocked by the FAT partition in your current configuration.

    If you have partitioning tools extend the FAT partition to include all the unallocated space, then shrink it back down to the original size you have it at now, leaving the unallocated space between the C: partition and the FAT partition. If you don't have partitioning tools then I think you should be able to do this by doing restores of the FAT partition usingTI as well.
     
  16. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    dwalby thanks for responding I tried to restore just the Fat32 partition but nothing changed and I do not have or nor would I know how to use partitioning tools if I had them.

    I suppose I could download the trial Acronis Disk Director but I would need to have detailed instructions using it on how to do what you said needed to be done.



    Mike
     
  17. dwalby

    dwalby Registered Member

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    If you can live without the FAT partition temporarily I think you could use this approach:

    1. backup the FAT partition (you may already have done this)

    2. delete the FAT partition (I think the Disk Management tools provided by Windows will allow you to do this, but I always use Disk Director so I'm not 100% sure about that)

    3. Now you should see a large unallocated space adjacent to the C: partition, so when you go to restore C: you should be able to resize the partition to take almost all of that unallocated space. Leave enough space unused so you can put the FAT partition back there later.

    4. restore the FAT partition, select 'unallocated space' as the destination during the restore. This will put the FAT partition at the end of the disk, after the C: partition. Depending on how your disk is partitioned you may see more than one 'unallocated' destination entry during the restore process. Look at the disk partitioning first before doing this step to make sure you know which one is the one you want at the end of the disk (note the size before doing the restore, then look for something that size during the restore operation).

    editorial comment: You're seeing one of the drawbacks of doing a complete disk image backup/restore in one operation, the old disk partition layout got applied to the new disk, which you didn't really want. That's why a lot of us only work with one partition at a time, it gives you more control of how you arrange the pieces later.
     
  18. GroverH

    GroverH Registered Member

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    mccoady

    From what I have read here (and I may have missed it), it has not been established where the small 2.37gb partition is positioned on the old 250GB drive. Open Windows Disk management and using the graphical view options, it the first or last partition?
    If you are restoring both partitions, this posting is important:
    TrueImageHome "Partition or Disk to Restore" Screen
    https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=218533

    The resizing guide on line 3 of my signature below should help.
    This illustrates your version 10.

    If you are willing to delete all the partitions on the 750GB drive and start over with a blank unpartitioned drive,
    How To Delete Disk Partitions Using TrueImage Home
    https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=213446

    Restoring to a blank drive should be
    ..........................partition 1.....................partition 2
    Free space before............0...............................0
    parttition size........desired size partition 1...............Desired size of partition2
    Free space after.......Size of 2nd partition.................0

    As illustrated in my guide below, when restoring
    Select partition 1 and size this leaving enough free space after for partition 2
    Select partition 2 and size this with no free space before or after
    Select MBR

    My understanding: you want to maintain your existing small partition with the balance of space going to your system partition (C)
    The backup to be used is the one referenced in post #3 which includes all partitions on the old disk.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2009
  19. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    I don't see that Windows will let me do this.

    Yes I can see that is the way to do it but I guess I misunderstood the procedure. John said to restore MBR and Fat32 and then the C partition but I thought he meant I needed to restore MBR and Fat32 both at the same time which it wouldn't let me do so he must have meant to restore MBR, then Fat32, and then the C partition.

    Opening Computer Management if I'm looking at Disk 1 I guess would be the bar graph I have (C) 230.51 GB NTFS, then Fat32 2.38 GB, then Unallocated 465.75 GB but if I use List view and look under "Volume" it shows Fat32 first and then (C).

    Correct I've created an image of my old 250GB drive (C partition, Fat32, MBR) and I'm trying to put this on a new 750GB drive with all the space going to partition C except for the space allowed for Fat32.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2009
  20. GroverH

    GroverH Registered Member

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    Your biggest problem is that it is all new to you. We all were in your shoes when we first started. One of the nice things about TrueImage is that you can practice and practice and practice until you feel comfortable with your option selections. It is practice until you reach the Proceed or Cancel option. Click Cancel to stop the practice. Caution: If you click the Proceed button, the selected changes will begin and its too late to stop the proceedings. If you do not like the result, then you have to start all over from the very beginning again with a blank drive. Had your new drive been the same size, your initial restore procedures would have been successful. However, since the new drive was larger, you needed to use the "Restore with Resize" procedures instead of check marking the disk option which does not enable a resize option. This mistake frequently occurs as your posting illustrates.

    In order for you to expand your C drive, you must either delete the small partition first before attempting another restore with resize. I do NOT recommend deleting only the FAT32 partition but would much prefer deleting all the partitions on the drive and starting with a fresh blank drive. You have a better chance of success by starting with a totally blank unallocated drive.

    My prior reference shows how to do delete the existing partitions using the Acronis "add disk" option but you can also perform the same deletion within Windows if that is your preference. Just be careful to select the 750GB disk (probably Disk 1) for partition deletion. Using TrueImage, you would boot from the Rescue CD and perform the partition deletion and then continue with the "Restore using Resize" as per my guide listed on line 3 of my signature below.

    You should maintain the same file system (for each individual partition) on the new drive as on the old 250GB drive. Do NOT accept the Acronis defaults. You should also maintain the same partition size for the small second partition. (You performed a disk option restore and the small partition is shown as being the second partition as confirmed by you (bar-graph) in the preceding posting.)

    My Resize guide illustrates restoring a 3 partition drive. Since you only have a two partition drive, when you finish image G18 then you would jump to image G25. In other words, ignore steps G-19 through G-24 which relate to a 3rd partition--which you do not have. This is a only a guide. File types and sizes need to be matched to your computer requirements--not Acronis defaults.

    When sizing the new disk, you want to continue to have Drive C as the first partition and it should be resized so it consumes all of the space except leave enough space at the end for the smaller 2nd partition.
    Code:
      --Partition 1 (C)-(image G-9)--                       --Partition 2 (image G16)--
    Free space before= 0                                Free space before= 0
    Partition size= 696.GB (approximately)              Partition size=   2.375GB
    Free space after= 2.375 GB                          Free space after=  0
    Yes, you want to restore the MBR to the new drive as illustrated by images G25-26-27.

    As you have worked through these instructions, don't forget you can cancel and restart again for more practice. Practice until you feel comfortable. Only click PROCEED when you feel comfortable with your option selections. I would suggest that you print my "Restore with Resize" guide so you have your examples handy for review.

    These are my suggestions based on your preferences. I hope you find them useful. My own personal preference would have been to keep Drive C small (100GB) and add a 3rd data partition to consume the remainder of the space. The data partition would have been used for the storage of personal files such as video's, audio files, photos, documents, email, etc. When you keep everything in one partition, backups & restores become difficult to manage due to their large file size. If you had a small drive C system partition, it's easier to restore should you have a virus or corrupt Windows install.

    Good luck.
     
  21. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    Okay GroverH I've been reading through your very informative guides I wish I had known about them before I started although it's alot of information to try to process and understand especially for someone who's never used TI before.

    So I'm ready to use GroverH's guide to start over and delete all the partitions so if I follow these steps one at a time can I get where I want to be, that is include the total space available on my C partition allowing for Fat32:

    1. Delete all partitions

    2. Restore MBR

    3. Restore Fat32

    4. Restore C partition - by restoring this last will it automatically include the rest of the space not allocated to MBR and Fat32 or will I still have to resize it?
     
  22. dwalby

    dwalby Registered Member

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    You will still have to resize it, the default size will be the same size as the partition you backed up with the disk image operation. As long as you have the unallocated space next to the C: partition this should be easy, just drag the yellow bar during the restore process to extend the partition as far as you can into the unallocated space. You should see a mention of 'free space before' and 'free space after' the partition to guide you in the resizing.

    Also, in regard to your comment a few posts ago about not being able to delete a partition in windows, as long as you're logged in as administrator you can do it this way:

    control panel/administrative tools/computer management/disk management, then right-click on the graphical box containing the partition you want to delete, and select delete partition. I know that's not the plan of attack for now, but thought I'd mention it in case you need to use that option in the future.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2009
  23. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    Does the 4 step process I layed out that I think would be easier for me (and dwalby said would work) contradict what GroverH just said or is it basically the same steps?
     
  24. GroverH

    GroverH Registered Member

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    mccoady,
    I cannot confirm your plans as being correct. I would wait.

    You have indicated that the C partition is pictured first. If that is true, then it the C partition should be restored before you restore the smaller FAT32 partition. Please confirm before you proceed. If you are confused, can you show us a picture attachment as to what is causing this confusion. Whichever partition is pictured as the first partition should be restored prior to the other.
     
  25. mccoady

    mccoady Registered Member

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    Okay hope this helps!
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Apr 14, 2009
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