ShadowProtect Desktop 3 is out...

Discussion in 'backup, imaging & disk mgmt' started by HAN, Aug 22, 2007.

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  1. kennyboy

    kennyboy Registered Member

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    Although there are bound to be a few bugs in any new release, it is incredibly reassuring to have grnxnm keeping so up to date and interested. Makes you think that when it is finished, this will be a very desirable piece of software.
     
  2. Huupi

    Huupi Registered Member

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    I need no install,done everything from the recovery,SP 2 already serves me well,i can only think of a little speed difference,oke but that is just me,can imagine that many angry awaited the SP 3 release with more supported drivers,HIR etc.
    At the moment the extra provisions are just overkill to me.So i stay with.......

    huub.
     
  3. nexstar

    nexstar Registered Member

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    Does the Server recovery iso work with the Desktop installation?

    I've just requested the evaluation version but it is the desktop demo version I have installed and would be interested in.

    They said that the iso would probably be ready on Wednesday for download so I presume this would be the updated one.

    Graham
     
  4. HAN

    HAN Registered Member

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    My ISO download filename said it was the server version too but when I burnt it, it was, from everything I can see, the desktop version. IMO, you're good to go (except of course, the fact that the MBR restoration patch is coming in a few days.)
     
  5. HAN

    HAN Registered Member

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    Thank you for getting back to us. :)
     
  6. nexstar

    nexstar Registered Member

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    Thanks for the info. As I want to try it out with Rollback, I'll wait for the patched version before downloading it.

    Graham
     
  7. grnxnm

    grnxnm Registered Member

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    The ShadowProtect Desktop and Server Editions share the same ISO file for their recovery environment CD. In fact this same ISO also contains the installers for both the installed Desktop and Server edition products, as well as the ImageManager and KeyFileMaker (ImageManager and KeyFileMaker are for the Continuous Incrementals feature which is mostly for the IT community).
     
  8. screamer

    screamer Registered Member

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    I'm really interested in this software, but I'm a little confused. If I could get a better understanding of what I'm looking for, I'd be more than willing to go to my hip for the $80.00 / $160.00

    The last time I trialed this software I had issues w/ FD-ISR. I've been assured that they were corrected. This was on my laptop. I didn't have the balz to try it on my work box (FD-ISR & nVidia RAID 0)

    I only used the SP Recovery CD & Legacy Mode. My aim for this app is to replace ATI which I find super slow. 45min to image / 6hrs to recover.

    Storagecraft just suggested that I D/L ShadowProtect Desktop Edition 3.0 until the ShadowProtect Recovery CD is available on Wednesday.

    Do I need the Desktop edition or can I just use the Recovery CD to image and recover an image?

    I realize that my question may be very elementary, but for some reason I just can't grasp this app o_O

    Second, even more elementary question. What procedure should I follow to image and restore? Yes, I RTFM but I still don't get it.

    ...screamer
     
  9. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Lots of options.

    Okay. Assume you buy it. You download an ISO file and burn it to disk. That disk serves 2 purposes. 1) It is indeed the recovery disk. 2nd) It is the install disk for the Desktop version.

    From here the options expand.

    You can image from the desktop version, and you can verify the image from the desktop. Do it manually if you so desire You can also set schedules to automate taking incremental snapshots if you desire. Doing that will of course pile up incremental snapshots, hence Imagemanger. If you use continous incrementals it will follow a schedule every day taking say 15 minute incrementals. Then at the end of the day imagemanger will collapse the incrementals into one. At a designated time all other incrementals are deleted. Phew. It works beautifully. Hands off.

    OR

    You can fire up the Recovery CD and image/verify and restore from there. You can as in the desktop also mount the images.

    When you boot the Recovery CD you will also see two options. Legacy which boots to Winpe, and recommend which boots to VistaPe. VistaPe is much faster, but there is a catch.

    Nvidia Raid drivers. The drivers are now in the recovery CD, and the see Raid 0 configurations fine. Works fine on both of my machines which are different invidia chipsets. The catch is the set of drivers Microsoft chose to include with VistaPe. The chose a bad set, so although I can see my disks the results are at best sketchy. If it works the restore is fine, but it doesn't always work. So with Nvidia drivers best bet is use the Legacy boot, and all works fine.

    Overkillo_O?

    Pete

    Didn't answer one question. Simplest procedure of all is just image with the Desktop and restore with the recovery CD. Or even simpler if you want to do what I do which is restore every image. Just boot the CD and Image mount/verify(whichever) and restore.

    Also no FDISR conflicts at all. I use VSS on FDISR and all is fine.
     
  10. screamer

    screamer Registered Member

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    Pete, I recall seeing several partitions on the laptop. One was the Dell recovery partition which has been deleted. There were several small FAT partitions also.
    I needed to buy Acronis Disk Director in order to fix / combine all the small partitions in order to get my original 90G partition back.

    When I go to restore an image, do I need to delete it first, or will SP show me a partition that is OK to restore to?

    Will I see my original 160 / 320GB RAID 0 drive and just click Restore?

    If I do see several small partitions can I combine them? Not sure if I'm making sense here, It's been a while since I trialed this app.

    ...screamer
     
  11. silver0066

    silver0066 Registered Member

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    grnxnm

    I just purchased Desktop3 a couple of days ago. I did not get the Maintenance option as there was no explanation of it on the StorageCraft site.

    Will I be able to get the new fix when it comes out?
    What does the Maintenance option provide that is not available to me now?

    I will be buying more licensing after more testing with HIR and will need to know what the Maintenance provides over no Maintenance.

    Many thanks,

    Silver
     
  12. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Hi Silver

    Can't speak for grnxnm, but I have to believe since it it a bug, there will be no issue.

    As I understand the maintenance contract(I did get it), and what has actually happened, is I bought SP 2.0 and the maintenance contract. When 2.5 came out I received that. Now that 3.0 is out, I will also being receiving it. Another words anything release while the maintenance contract is in effect.

    From the website it looks like when my maintenance contract expires, I can just purchase another year.

    Pete
     
  13. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Hi Screamer.

    I have a new IBM(Lenovo) Tablet PC. First thing I did was image it. I told it to image the whole drive. I was using IT edition, but the recoveryCD would be the same. What it did was create two images, one of each partition. When I did the restore, I just restore, the main partition, I left the hidden partition alone. No reason just lazy. Had a wanted too, it would have been a separate restore.

    Pete
     
  14. grnxnm

    grnxnm Registered Member

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    @Silver

    Of course you'll receive minor patches for free, such as the fix to the MBR-restore issue (where MBR restore fails when restoring from split optical media sets).

    Maintenance gives you major upgrades for free.
     
  15. Huupi

    Huupi Registered Member

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    Imaging for a year with SP2 and FDISR[bootback] ,never ever met any problem.
     
  16. JimInVA

    JimInVA Registered Member

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    Obviously, one would expect any piece of software to stand on its own merits before making a purchase. I spent many hours that bridged into days narrowing that which I would personally use and that which will become my recommendation to hundreds of clients. In the end, it came down to the products of two companies - Acronis and StorageCraft. Each have their own unique merits but only the StorageCraft products come with easy access to one like grnxnm.

    It seems quite apparent that grnxnm takes pride for his portion of contribution to the product (at least for the ShadowProtect line) yet would be the first to suggest that it is a continual work in progress. Even with that, he would remain one of the most encouraging voices towards my right of choice towards any product... even that of a competitor's if it better fit my need.

    And so... while a piece of software must certainly stand on its own merits, at any one point in time, it is the attitude of those behind the product that allow me a glimpse of what is yet to come. And so I've made my bet with StorageCraft... and have already had reason to communicate with various departments within the company. I have found them to be responsive and each of them seems to share something in common - an enthusiasm for the job that they do. It is an attitude that is both surprising and refreshing in today's marketplace.

    Jim
     
  17. Huupi

    Huupi Registered Member

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    According to Nate/Grnxnm the HIR option in the Desktop/Server version is limited to a machine where already SP [any version] is installed,so you can place any image from whatever OS windows on this desktop, As a consequence it means if you want to "HIR" more desktops you have to buy that many SP3 copies. I guess for home users this restriction is not a worry,you can play and have some fun. The IT version SP3 has no restrictions of this kind,but then you have to pay $$$
     
  18. rodnh

    rodnh Registered Member

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    The HIR "limitation" with both the Desktop and Server editions of SP3 should be a concern for all home users who run dual boot XP/XP or XP/Vista machines. The limitation means that HIR will only work on one of the two boot partitions (volumes) - the one with SP3 installed on it. To have HIR work with both boot partitions, SP3 needs to be installed on both prior to imaging them. That appears to require two licenses, even though only one computer is involved. Either that or the $3500 annual fee for the IT edition, which is an amusing suggestion for home users. This significant restriction on HIR is not mentioned at all in the SPDT3 user guide or in the promotional material at the StorageCraft website. In fact, it is not even hinted that any type of HIR restriction exists for the Desktop edition. The way I found out about it was by accident in reading a post by Nate in the SP3 Server edition forum - hardly a place where home users hang out. I am now trying to get the licensing matter answered definitively over at the SPDT forum but I suspect that dual boot hard disks cannot be fully restored to new hardware with a single license using HIR. I purchased SPDT3 over other imaging software (most notably True Image, which I now use) for several reasons in addition to the promise of HIR. I am still pleased with it despite this limitation. The official WinPE recovery environment is well worth it even if that was the only benefit. I am a little disappointed however because I run a dual boot XP/XP system. I should be able to get one of my XP partitions migrated when the time comes. The other one will not be as easy as I had hoped, requiring a repair install and subsequent updates. Purchasing two licenses for one computer to accomplish this with HIR is not an option I care to exercise. Ignorance is bliss until you find out the real deal.

    Rod
     
  19. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Hi Rod

    One suggestion is do one partition at a time. Not sure this is all that bad a restriction. I think for most "home" users HIR is best left alone. People will assume they can just restore an image and like magic there system will run fine. Whole purpose of HIR is to be able to restore the image and have the system boot. That doesn't mean it runs perfectly. There is still a lot of driver installation work to be done.

    HIR works beautifully, and I have tested it thoroughly here, but still if I bought a new machine, I'd do software install from scratch. I can see the beauty of it for an IT situation where they may have lots of almost identical machines.

    Pete
     
  20. silver0066

    silver0066 Registered Member

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    Pete,

    The HIR feature is very beneficial for some home users. In my case, for example, I have a desktop as my main machine, and a laptop for traveling, which I do infrequently. It is much easier to restore the laptop from the desktop using HIR or Acronis UR than to reinstall/deinstall all of the program changes since I last used it.

    The driver installations can be handled automatically by using either Driver Magician or Driver Genius with their one click auto extract features. I have learned to uninstall some of the unique network and video card driver setup programs from the main machine before backing up for the HIR install. Then I just restore the main machine from a FDISR archive to get the drivers back.

    Silver
     
  21. grnxnm

    grnxnm Registered Member

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    On that note, if you're running a dual-boot system and you have ShadowProtect installed on one OS, and a job with incremental tracking, and you boot the other OS (assuming SP is not on this other OS) and make changes to the first OS's volume, the fast incremental tracking performed by SP in the first OS won't be aware that changes were made (because you made them from an alternate environment) and so your next incremental backup (when you boot back to the first OS) will be bad. You can work around this issue by deleteing all *.idx files in the root of your volumes whenever you boot to an environment on which SP is not installed. This will reset the incremental tracking serialized data. The drawback is that your next image will be a slow diff-based incremental rather than a fast incremental. This whole topic was discussed in another thread but I forget which one, sorry.
     
  22. grnxnm

    grnxnm Registered Member

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    Workaround for you -> Install ShadowProtect in both of your boot partitions, even if you only activate it in one of them. Desktop/Server edition HIR will operate on an OS volume containing even an expired trial version of ShadowProtect. The added benefit is that if you dual boot windows 2000+ OSs, and you install ShadowProtect in both, then no matter which OS you choose to boot, the incremental tracking will continue to take place and you won't have to worry about the bad incrementals issue which I mentioned in the previous post.
     
  23. rodnh

    rodnh Registered Member

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    Thank you very much grnxnm. I had a thought that might work but wasn't sure, currently have no convenient way to test it and didn't want to ask specifically. Anyway, I'm not complaining even if it wouldn't work. I knew about the possibility of such a restriction prior to purchase - from Nate's post, although I found it only by chance. I went ahead and purchased anyway since I had other good reasons to move to SP than the HIR capability. I didn't even need to trial the software to make that decision. The WinPE recovery environment, together with the ability to directly (and easily, w/o third party technical "fixes") add your own drivers if needed was a compelling enough reason for me. And it works slick, just as I expected it to.

    Regarding the *.idx files. I noticed they have shown up in the roots of the two partitions I have imaged with SPDT3 so far. I did not invoke any kind of incremental scheduling - at least not knowingly. Both images were done manually from within windows. One was also done at a prior time from the recovery disk. Would it be OK to systematically delete these files if I don't use the incremental/differential imaging features? Provided they are not needed for any other purpose, such as scheduling full partition images, I'd prefer to just delete them until such time as I might want to start using incrementals.

    I must say your posts here on product information/support present a great "public face" to StorageCraft. That's rare nowadays and it can be a compelling reason by itself to purchase a product. It certainly did not go unnoticed by me before I made my SP purchase decision. Even an excellent reputation can be damaged by a poor public face so I hope the SC powers that be are properly cognizant of your contribution to the company outside of your coding efforts and are compensating you in some extra fashion for it.

    Rod
     
  24. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Rod

    I've been using, testing, and beating on the ShadowProtect products. You won't be disappointed.

    Pete
     
  25. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    Well, I am. I must be a masochist. Despite my previous adverse experience with ShadowProtect v3, I decided to give it a second chance. I uninstalled Seagate DiscWizard (ATI v10), rebooted, installed the trial version of SP v3, rebooted then tried to make a backup image of my primary hard drive.

    After running for around 10 minutes, SP's screen said it was still initializing my drive. I noticed that both my MSN and Firefox browsers were frozen. I tried to activate Task Manager to check CPU usage but no dice. I moved my cursor to cancel the operation, but the cursor froze in place as soon as it touched the SP screen. I had to turn off my PC's power to escape then rebooted into a different FD-ISR snapshot. I have no idea what the problem/conflict is this time and probably never will. For a highly-touted program I've waited for months to finally be able to test on Vista, I'm disappointed I can't even evaluate it. :'(
     
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