Sata disks not found on recovery

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by RonLyon, Aug 23, 2006.

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  1. RonLyon

    RonLyon Registered Member

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    Hi
    I have a the latest trial workstation version. I did a full back up of my c drive but cannot use recovery to restore it.
    I have a new machine with an asus p5b motherboard with 2x250gb hitachi sata drives running on Winxp. Winxp installed without needing any sata drivers installed and i installed the intel chipset drivers after the windows install.
    If i try and do a recovery from windows, it reboots, loads the launcher and then reboots to windows again. If i try to recover from a boot cd made from within true image, it boots to the proper screen but will only show an usb drive that is also attached. There is no other hard drives showing.
    How can i get my sata drives to show so that i can do a partition recovery ?
     
  2. rah99

    rah99 Registered Member

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    I have the same problem here also with an Asus P5B motherboard (P5B Deluxe/Wifi).

    Just a single SATA drive here
     
  3. Tabvla

    Tabvla Registered Member

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    The most likely cause is that the Linux shell does not include the correct driver(s) for your MOBO / Chipset / SATA configuration.

    Suggest that you raise a support call with Acronis Support. Provide them with full system details and ask them for a Linux driver(s).
     
  4. rah99

    rah99 Registered Member

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    More info.

    The Safe version does see the hard disks, but I can't find the DVD drive to restore the image. Full version doesn't see the hard disk at all and nor does One-Click restore.
     
  5. thomasjk

    thomasjk Registered Member

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    See my post #5 here for a possible solution: https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?p=823862#post823862
     
  6. rah99

    rah99 Registered Member

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    Thanks, I saw that in my searches - I'll raise a support issue I think. I'm using the secure zone as a stopgap measure.
     
  7. Tabvla

    Tabvla Registered Member

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    I am not disagreeing that BartPE is a great utility. But I think it is a very challenging route to take for anyone who is non-technical.

    The tools do (and should) exist within TI to meet the requirements of most users most of the time. When dealing with almost limitless hardware configurations drivers are always an issue - mainly because they are amongst the most expensive code around.

    For the non-technical user I am not comfortable with recommending BartPE as a solution. The non-technical user should be able to use both the Windows and Linux UI with confidence that they will work with the vast majority of hardware configurations without having to resort to 3rd-party addons.

    In those cases where the Linux kernel does not have a required driver, it is, in my view, the responsibility of the vendor (Acronis) to source the driver. If the product is very new then it is understandable that a driver may not be available in the short term and that the user will have to make some interim arrangements until a driver is available.
     
  8. navkan

    navkan Registered Member

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    As a "non-technical user" I agree 100%. I have no knowledge of BartPE nor the desire or time to learn, even if it is a wonderful utility. I want TI 9 to work with my system or if not, Acronis to fix it right away. There is nothing on their website that indicates restrictions on what hardware their software will work with.
     
  9. equilter

    equilter Registered Member

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    Same problem here. I have a brand new Gigabyte GA-965P-DQ6, along with two Western Digital WD2500JS SATA drives. Acronis does NOT recognize these drives for recovery no matter where I connect the drives. I have tried both the Intel ICH8R Southbridge SATA and the Gigabyte SATA2 Controller, in both single and raid configurations.

    This makes Acronis of limited use, since most new motherboards barely support IDE drives any more. Ancroniso_O

     
  10. Tabvla

    Tabvla Registered Member

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    As much as I can understand the frustration of users who find compatibility problems between ATI and their system, there are some practical economic realities that should be taken into account.

    Creating drivers is a specialist task. Programmers who specialise in this field are amongst the highest paid in the industry. Consequently drivers are expensive to code, test and deliver. Hardware manufacturers will first create drivers for their equipment for the most popular platforms, which usually means Windows.

    If your product (Motherboard, HDD, USB device....etc) works with Windows then it should work with ATI, because ATI does not communicate directly with the hardware but communicates through the OS.

    When you use the boot CD you use a subset of Linux for the OS. If the manufacturer of the product has a Linux driver then it is Acronis' responsibility to source that driver. If the manufacturer has not created a driver for Linux then your product will probably not work or may work but might behave in an unstable way. There are many thousands of very talented Linux programmers out there who create Linux drivers. However, if the driver is not approved by the manufacturer then there is a possibility that you will invalidate your warrantee on the product if you use a driver created by the "enthusiast" community.

    In this respect, "thomasjk" is correct. BartPE is a great utility for circumventing the ATI boot CD Linux OS, because using BartPE you work within a Windows environment. The problem is that, in my view, BartPE is a very challenging route to take for those who are non-technical, and who have no desire or motivation to become technical guru's.

    In the past we used to use DOS as a boot OS. (Some software utility developers still use DOS). I believe that ATI has made the correct decision by using a Linux subset as the boot OS as it provides much greater versatility than DOS. But, the problem of Linux drivers for new or uncommon components is and will probably continue to be a problem for the foreseeable future.

    And to be fair, this is a problem that to a very large extent is beyond the control of Acronis.
     
  11. thomasjk

    thomasjk Registered Member

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    The other major reason I use BartPe is the Acronis Rescue CD full version does not work on my desktop. It has always and still does give an error on boot. I reported this to Acronis and they gave me a safe version ISO which works but has no USB support. All builds of TI 9.0 have this issue for me.
    I don't consider my self a super technical person but I was able to follow the BartPe build instructions successfully the first time . Acronis does include a plugin for BartPE in the latest builds.
     
  12. seekforever

    seekforever Registered Member

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    I am not quite as charitable, Acronis selected the recovery environment and driver availablility has always been a Linux issue regardless of the hype that there are a zillion geniuses worldwide just waiting to provide fixes for Linux problems.

    However, I have been fortunate in that my configurations haven't had any real problems with Linux.
     
  13. seekforever

    seekforever Registered Member

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    It certainly isn't as bad as it looks at first glance but it does require a certain level of computer knowledge.

    From time-to-time I have pondered just what is the target audience for a product like TI. I don't think it makes much sense unless you know about disk partitions and the like but on the other hand if you install it and don't get too daring with the features, are diligent in RTFS and some RTFM it might be just fine for the average person. Also, if at least, whole disk images are made and disaster happens, there will be an image available for some more techy person to assist in restoring.
     
  14. Tabvla

    Tabvla Registered Member

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    You're kidding! I am sending your comments to uncle Bill, that will make his day!

    Best question we have had on this Forum for some time. TI is a great utility for those who have some technical ability. It is not for those who have neither the need nor the desire to be technically competent.

    The non-technical user really wants to do nothing more than click an icon on their desktop (or some automated process) that backs-up their entire PC - system, programs, files. And when the dreaded BSOD strikes they have a very simple and non-techy way of getting everything back again.

    If companies like Acronis don't provide this type of idiot-proof functionality then you can be absolutely sure that an organisation like Google will. Watch this space.....
     
  15. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    I doubt that it's possible to achieve a fully automated one-click backup and restore capability as the user will still need to decide where to store the image file. However, perhaps a good start would be for a future version of True Image Home to have the option to select from two Graphical User Interfaces - one for beginners and the other for advanced users. The beginners version could cut out all the bells and whistles and just leave the bare essentials needed to successfully backup and restore a complete system image to/from an internal or external hard drive or DVD.

    Regards
     
  16. Omen

    Omen Registered Member

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    I have an ASUS A8V motherboard with a Hitachi 400 GB HD attached to a VIA 8237 SATA controller. This is my boot disk.

    I found out (very painfully) today that TI9 Home can't see my SATA drive. Instead of spending a few minutes restoring my boot partition, I spent ~10 hours debugging and fixing a McAfee uninstall screwup that left XP Pro unable to boot :mad:

    Needless to say, I'm looking for other backup solutions. I've been with Acronis since version TI7, and I've never needed to restore a boot partition until today. It's my fault that I didn't test this scenario beforehand, but I've learned my lesson.
     
  17. thomasjk

    thomasjk Registered Member

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    I strongly recommend that you build a Bartpe http://www.nu2.nu/pebuilder/ disk with Mustang's plugins ( http://www.mechrest.com/plugins/
    ) until Acronis is able to supply Linux drivers for the rescue disk.
     
  18. Omen

    Omen Registered Member

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  19. rah99

    rah99 Registered Member

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    Support mailed me to say that a new build will be available in the next few days that should fix this issue.
     
  20. John2222

    John2222 Registered Member

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    I agree with almost everything Tabvla posted about software companies writing their own drivers. Impossible and impractical.

    However, I don't agree that ATI made the correct decision on choosing Linux vs. DOS.

    What I would say is: ATI made the wrong decision by choosing Linux instead of the Microsoft Windows Preinstallation Environment boot cd.

    WinPE is the boot CD of the day. Yes, it boots slower than DOS or Linux. Because it is Windows XP, the same as is used by the XP startup and Recovery CD and contains ability to add scsi or sata or as needed drivers during boot.

    http://www.microsoft.com/licensing/sa/benefits/winpe.mspx

    In simple terms, when a hardware vendor (motherboard, hard drive, etc.) releases a product, are they going to more likely to release a XP driver or a Linux driver with it?
     
  21. gori

    gori Registered Member

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    hi everyone (and support ?)

    I think I have the same problem but you can surely advise on what to do :
    (sorry for the long post and if it is not the right topic)

    the config :

    -win xp pro sp2 french
    -abit ab9 pro motherboard rev 1.3
    -2 sata II HD (300G) controlled by Intel ICH8R in raid 1 for system, datas and temp/scratch partitions seen as DISK 1
    -4 sata II HD (400G) controlled by Intel ICH8R in raid 5 for media archive + extra backup of the raid 1 datas seen as DISK0
    -1 usb / esata external sata II HD for copy and spare backup when messing up things as I am about to do right now :)
    - 1 plextor cdrom + 1 pioneer DVD IDE controlled by JMICRON 363 ide/sata raid controller (but seen as SCSI)
    - 1 plextor DVD-R SATA II controlled by JMICRON363 (seen as scsi)

    the need :

    I need to change physically my HDs and rebuild RAIDs conf like that :

    the two sata2 300G hd will be used in matrix raid 0+1 controlled by intel ICH8R as :
    (hopefully seen as) DISK 0 : raid 0 for the system / swap / temp (3 partitions)
    (hopefully seen as) DISK 1 : raid 1 partitions for personal+pro data / misc archives

    the 4 sata2 400G hd seen as DISK2 raid 5 controlled by intel ICH8R for audio/video/backup (3 partitions)

    as I will have my main boot system on raid 0, I need a software that can restore "easily & quicly" my daily backed up C: system partition even if there's no more bootable hard disks, so I thought to give ATI a shot.

    I downloaded the trial home edition (build 3633, last one available for the trial o_O) to see if acronis software can suit my needs better than Norton ghost 10 (if you have other names, shoot!) ...

    After backing up all my data (in file format from all partitions) on my external HD, I made a full ATI backup of my C: system partition (full image), burn it on DVDs, made one copy in acronis hidden zone on DISK 0 (raid 5) that I created to see the usefulness of it and one in my “backup” partition on RAID 5.

    Then burn a bootable cdrom of ATI from the ATI interface (iso then nero) with both full and safe version on it. And activate the recovery option that changes the mbr of my disk (on DISK0 by the way not on my DISK1 system...)

    And finally made a Bart PE builderpe iso disc with acronis plugin on it plus the intel, jmicron, sil3132 sata/raid/ide controller drivers (and forgot the diskpart winxp sp2 dcomlaunch plugin...) just to check if bartPE was useful or not… (remember I am about to destroy everything system wise…)

    Results of the test (I wanted to be sure before doing the real thing!) and that is where I need your help:

    Boot from my system C: with F11 key option :
    - I have the blue xplike option screen and I choose the full (with usb, scsi) option
    - Loads a bit, I have the black screen with the orange acronis logo on the top left and the (soon to be annoying) “loading…please wait” for hours…
    - Nothing after that just the same dull "please wait"…

    I choose to reboot, F11 from HD boot, safe option : the same…

    Ok…as I am planning to kill my C: system, don’t need to boot from it in the future so, I boot from the ATI recovery cd I burned and…same thing…"please wait" for ages without anything happening…

    Worried about the quality of ATI software so far (or something I forgot to do but not explain properly), I boot the BartPE burned iso with the ATI plugin on it :

    Ok, seems to work…ok I can see all my disks and partitions. (the only thing is that my C: is now my first DISK 0 media archive partition, but it seems logical as the RAID 5 is seen physically as DISK 0 and my system boot as DISK1 (that’s also why I need to re conf the all thing), it even sees my USB/esata ext HD.

    So my conclusion so far and questions are :

    - did I miss something by not using properly the ATI recovery option leading me to the dreaful “loading plese wait” ?

    - is my only option if my C: system crash (and you know, raid 0…) is to use thirdparty BartPE boot cd with acronis plugin ?

    - Even if I was able to compile and boot a BartPE cd, I find outrageous to buy a software (ATI) that cannot see by itself any of my hard disks and claiming on their own pages that ATI can handle RAID or SATA configs.

    - Do you guys have a solution (with this software or another one (but I like the interface and option better than Norton ghost for instance) to avoid using computer geek/genius skills and third party (even hugely impressive) software like bartpe ?

    - Do I still have an interest in buying the complete home edition of ATI to backup my system or do other (& working) solution exists for my (and yours) particular case (sata, raid…Etc) ?

    Thanks a lot for your time, but that is an important choice for me as I don’t want to go back into these questions and just enjoy a working / secured system.

    Regards,

    Eric
     
  22. jpo312

    jpo312 Registered Member

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    I agree.
    I have the same problem with my Asus P5B and SATA Disks on an ICH8 and P965.

    Acronis should immidiatly fix this problem.
     
  23. rah99

    rah99 Registered Member

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    Still no update on this issue :(

    Any news on when a new build will be available? I'm happy to test a version since this is a new machine that isn't in production use yet
     
  24. Scopacetic

    Scopacetic Registered Member

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    I just learned to make a BartPE disc (out of necessity) within the last few weeks and I am already seeing the same thread themes starting from scratch over and over with occasional twists and turns.

    What we need is a single BartPE "Sticky Wiki" at the beginning of this forum. Most people can just follow the instructions on the BartPE website, but there have been enough issues that come up that a good set of instructions and a troubleshooter would be great.

    Ultimately, I hope Acronis has carefully looked at options of dealing with this revolving door of drivers and rescue disc problems. A good automated system to create a rescue disc using a Windows PE operating system would be technically the best solution. It seems the drivers used by a particular system could be determined by a good rescue disc creation program and be copied automatically to create a custom disc tailored to each system. Only then could this program really appeal to the masses.
     
  25. Xpilot

    Xpilot Registered Member

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    I agree wholeheartedly.
    I struggled for hours when I made my first Bart PE disk. This is now some time ago and I am not loking forward to making another when I eventually upgrade my computer to bleeding edge technology.

    Please kindly moderators do not throw this thread into the dense jungle of the dreaded Wish List never again to see the light of day.

    Xpilot
     
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