Rollback91 and Hot Imaging

Panagiotis,

Thanks very much for the feedback. It would be interesting and possibly productive if you were to discuss the RB situation with them and of your test-results re IFW, Phylock, etc.

Aaron

 

@ Brian or Panagiotis:

Does IFW provide a 'DS-like' restore feature - where, from inside Windows, you can instruct IFW what and where to restore and then it will automatically reboot into DOS/Linux to do the restore?

I don't see this option but there are so many check-box selections I may have overlooked it.

Aaron

 

Aaron,

To restore an IFW image you can boot into IFD, IFL or WinPE. If you are dual booting you can boot into the other OS and restore the IFW image with IFW. Each of these processes can be automated in several ways.

The easiest method is with IFD and is described here...

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/howto/howto-ifd-bootfile.htm

It looks complex but the instructions are good. Don't forget to add the /uy switch to the command line to make it completely automatic. With the trial version of IFD you will probably have to click an OK. With this method you can set up several command line restores if you have several OS. Or several choices for differential image restores.

To run the configured IFD boot file, double click run_ifd.bat. This can be scheduled to run at 3 AM if you wish to do the restore while you are sleeping.

The IFL method is a little more complex.

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/howto/howto-ifl-bootfile.htm

But it can be used for network restores. For example, from my computer I can initiate a restore of one of the kids' OS partitions. I keep images of their OS in my computer. Their computer restarts into IFL, connects to my computer and uses the image stored in my computer for the restore. I don't have to visit their room.

If you have BING you can use this method..

http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/kb/article.php?id=363

For first timers I'd recommend the IFD method. Please ask questions as I know it looks frightening on the first attempt.

 

Dear Brian,

Where can I find the following option in IFW mentioned by Panagiotis in his below post. I looked everywhere in IFW, but couldn't find it.

Many thanks in advance!

Best regards,

KOR!

 

KOR!

I haven't been following that thread so it's best to wait for Panagiotis to reply.

 

OK, thanks!

Best regards,

KOR!

 

@Aaron
Another method besides those Brian mentioned is the following
How To Set Up A Hidden Recovery Partition (V2).

@KOR
Take a look at the following screenshots.
Also try to enable the "use mbr geometry" and "Validate MBR Geometry".

Panagiotis

 

Brian & Panagiotis,

Thanks for the pointers to the ways of setting up an IFW-IFD restore, but why oh why can't they make backing-up & restoring simple (as DS a few other imaging programs do)? ....oh well, hopefully in v3.

Aaron

 

Aaron,

I guess I've been using IFW too long for me to think it is complicated. I must say IFW/IFD/IFL have features that are unique. For example, how many imaging apps can restore an image over a wireless network? IFL can. You might not want to do it but it is possible. I think these apps are great fun to use as there are lots of possible ways to accomplish a task.

Another way to restore images. I have a DOS CD that boots to a menu. I select the image that I want to restore (eg #5)(the images are on a HD), IFD starts and I can immediately remove the CD and go and have lunch while the restore runs.

 

Brain,

IFD/IFL is quite good, but I don't like its "text-based" gui. If its GUI-based(like Ghost v11 DOS, Acronis linux-based bootcd) is more user-friendly, I think more people will like it.


>"restore an image over a wireless network"
Maybe Acronis's linux-based bootcd can do it, but I have not tested. I think if its bootcd has network support(of course, it should have enough network drivers and the app support restore an image over network) the app can restore an image over a wireless network, right?

 

andylau,

I guess "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder". I like it. The hot-keys allow me to run completely through the menus in just over 5 seconds.

Give it a try and let us know. Getting around the WPA2 encryption will be the stumbling block.

 

Greetings from a new poster...

A little background: I have been using DS (Tom's, not Drive Snap; a bit confusing, no?) for over 3 years and have purchased quite a few copies for clients I support. Have backed up and restored hundreds of times with almost no issues. However, most of this has been with XP. I am just now starting to use DS with Win7 and have been running into a few problems. I am still amazed that Tom has been able to do so much with a 300K executable! This is the first forum I've found where DS is discussed in such detail and I am happy to be here

I had an email exchange with te last week about the --restoreMBR option. I was just about to send them another message regarding exactly what portions of track 0 were backed up/restored when I found this thread! I believe I have been affected by the "32 instead of 63 sectors" issue that Panagiotis ran down for them. I'm surprised this hasn't surfaced before since it is my understanding that a normal Win7 GPT goes out to sector 34, but maybe this is only a problem for GPT's with 121 partitions or more!!

Anyway, I'd like to get a copy of v1.40.0.15451 mentioned above to test, but the latest download link on drivesnapshot.de is 1.40.0.15449

@Panagiotis,
How did you get .15451 and is it possible I could get it as well??

Thanks for everyone's good info here!!,
emmette

 

Dear Panagiotis,

Thank you for your response. I tried the above but it didn't work. Now I am up to 55 sectors from 19 sectors. When I looked at the report, it showed lead and start sector to be 19 as before. The 55+19=63 sectors.

All other hard disk show lead and start sector to be 2048. So, I did it again, but this time I also checked "Use 2048 Sector Alignment". However, the end result were same.

See image:

Best regards,

Mohamed

P.S. What would you suggest me to do next?

Many thanks for bearing with me and helping me in this. I am grateful to you!

 

Aaron, is easier to do it than it seems.
I'll start a new thread to explain how to do it.

Panagiotis

 

Hello emmette,

and welcome to the wilders.
They send it to me, through email. I'm pretty sure that when they test thoroughly the new version they will update their site. In the meanwhile check yor pms.

Panagiotis

 

If you can somehow make it as simple (or nearly as simple) as DS' restore from within Windows, that would be outstanding!

Aaron

 

@Mohamed,

do you know if your drive uses the Advanced Format?
Send a support request to terabyteunlimited, tell them that your drive is the model WD15EADS-00P8B0 and ask them how to proceed (what Geometry settings to use).

Since Easus does not support, yet, that drive I wouldn't trust their utility about the drive specs.

Panagiotis

 

Not as simple but is easy enough to follow and you don't need to boot in IFD to find the restore parameters. After you done it once, you'll find it very easy afterwards.

Panagiotis

 

Dear Panagiotis,

I believe you are right that it is about time I wrote to TeraByte. In the meantime, for my learning I want to ask you some more questions.

1. Does the image, contains information about the sectors?

2. If no, then Mark suggested to use Wipe.exe from TeraByte and then restore the image, what do you think about this?

3. If the above works, would it requires my programs to be activated again?

4. I have lots of other hard disk. If I restore to one of these, would it mess up the sectors on it?

5. If no it won't, what problems I will enconter trying to restore a 100gb partition to a new 320gb hard disk.

6. What will happens to my progrms in the above case. Would they need to be activated again?

Best regards,

KOR!

 

@KOR

Wipe the entire drive first then look at other avenues. Check for bad sectors with HD Tune. Check the HDD geometry label matches the same as in BIOS. Can sometimes enter the settings manually in BIOS if wrong. Update your motherboard BIOS. Check if there's any firmware updates for your HDD. Compare the HD geometry report between different softwares. Check the capacity is correct.

A corrupted still working MBR can give funny results. At end of HDD is stored geometry info which reports it to the BIOS, is untouchable without special software. The firmware updates it.

There are many full wipe programs. mbrwiz will completely wipe a disk. eg. mbrwiz /disk=1 /wipe=disk

The numbering scheme of partitions has changed in the newest MBRWiz. 0 is now 1 which now makes it the same as DS.

------------------------

Go back a few versions with DS and test if that bug still there if you can.

 

1. yes it does contain info about the sectors, heads and cylinders.(that info comes from the mbr)
2. No need to wipe the entire disk. wiping the first 63 sectors or better the 1st mb is more than enough.
3. If you restore the disk signature during the restore most of the programs will not complain but some could (e.g. adobe programs would need reactivation).
4. Probably since the info is stored in the mbr of the image.
5. None, but better not try it until you solve this. (BootItNg could help with the sector problem and would update the mbr but is difficult to explain its settings).
6. Yes more would complain because some use the hardware ID of the disk and not only the disk signature.

Panagiotis

 

Unluckily, I did not have a wireless NIC or notebook, therefore, I could not do a test for it.

 

You "did not" or you "do not".

LOL

Best regards,

KOR!

 

now, do not

 

Greetings all! Although I'm very much a noob in this particular forum, I'm definitely not new to the subject. It was suggested from whence I came (The Rollback RX forum) that I stop by and offer our findings on the SUBJECT of "Hot Imaging" and "Rollback RX." If interested, the two threads below cover our discussion to date... the first is LONG, beware , the second is recent and offers some conclusions in this area...

http://horizondatasys-forum.com/rollback-rx/986-imaging-rollback-rs-protected-disk.html

http://horizondatasys-forum.com/rollback-rx/2491-rollback-rx-image-windows-perfect-together.html

To summarize what we've found, from inside a HOT Windows system...

1. The only way IFW (Image For Windows) can be completely successful, i.e. totally RBRX transparent, in the imaging of a RBRX-enabled system is if the IFW product is installed AFTER RBRX, and RBRX has not been re-installed after the installation of IFW (I know... sounds strange, I'll explain later).

2. As this group (great work, Panagiotis) has already found, restoration of an IFW image not only redirects the machine state at backup time to now be the new machine's baseline (Installation) image, it also FAILS to restore a proper MBR/Track0 if needed (didn't see mention of this in your discussion).

Essentially, item # 1 relates specifically to a Windows REGISTRY key that is position dependent once it's installed. Here's the key...

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE
...SYSTEM
......CurrentControlSet
.........Control
............Class
...............{4D36E967-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318}

The key is used primarily to manage the direct DISK service under Windows, and as such, allows for "pre-drivers" to be used when chatting with the system's main disk driver, "disk.sys."

Both Rollback and IFW use this facility, specifically a DATA value called "UpperFilters." Rollback provides its pre-driver (called "Shield) and IFW provides its pre-driver (called "phylock"). In a nutshell, if you look at the DATA value with the Windows (or any other) REGISTRY tool, you will see both these values in that key if both applications are installed on your system. If the Rollback "Shield" value is above IFW's "phylock" value, the system will fail to image properly (as described in item #2 above). If the order is reversed, both the IFW partition/disk image AND that disk's MBR/Track0 will be backed up correctly (and restored correctly and in tact). This fact was discovered while trying to track down an MBR-based virus on a RBRX enabled system. With this fairly simple (I know, some folks don't like messin' with the system's REGISTRY) REGISTRY edit, IFW becomes the complete HOT IMAGE solution for RBRX systems... at least until HDS comes up with ULTIMATE SUPER DRIVE CLONER.

If the REGISTRY DATA entry reflects "phylock" above "Shield" in the above mentioned key (what would occur if IFW was installed AFTER RBRX), AND the system has been restarted after that edit, any IFW image after this change will be a true copy of the disk being managed and when restored (including the MBR and/or the rest of Track0 if needed) will provide for the entire RBRX database and all its snapshots, including the proper baseline.

If the REGISTRY entry has "Shield" above "phylock," the image taken by IFW will be just like the other imagers... real baseline replaced by the machine state at backup time, AND a faulty MBR and/or Track0 if restored.

Hope this helps the discussion!