Rollback Home Free Help

Discussion in 'backup, imaging & disk mgmt' started by khanyash, Mar 17, 2015.

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  1. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    FD-ISR/ Instantrecovery are impervious of such problems.

    By the way HorizonDatasys was a reseller/distributor of its predecessor FD-ISR and actually it's little brother FD-Rescue (now called InstantRescue) was created on demand for HorizonDatasys.
    Strange that you did not know of it's existence.

    Panagiotis
     
  2. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    Don't. FD-ISR and Rollback-RX can coexist but is like playing with fire inside a store with explosives.:eek:

    Panagiotis
     
  3. Tarnak

    Tarnak Registered Member

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    Hi pandlouk,

    You are the guru on 'instant system recovery' software.... I will follow your advice, and not tempt fate. :)
     
  4. jwcca

    jwcca Registered Member

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    In broad terms we (I hope) agree that we need to back up 1) our OS and 2) our Data.

    The OS
    1) changes infrequently for most people, i.e. only when they install/update/uninstall programs.
    Some people have their programs 'auto update', others ask for reminders/notices and update manually.

    The Data:
    1) some changes frequently, such as spreadsheets, access or sql databases, e-mail, etc. or
    2) some is 'fixed', such as photos, movies.

    (It's good practice to keep a spreadsheet of installed programs, in chronological sequence recording when they were installed or updated. That will allow going back to the 'right point in time' if it's neccessary to restore a back up of the OS.

    It's also good practice to only update programs manually, so that a backup can be made before the update and the spreadsheet can be accurately maintained.

    ===========================================

    'Imaging' the OS is necessary:
    1) to allow an image (and MBR/EFI stuff) to completely recover the OS in case of physical drive failure or to new hardware, or
    2) to roll back any installs/updates i.e. uninstall cleanly. In this case, Imaging should be done just before any installs/updates, it doesn't need to be done 'all the time' IMHO.

    Macrium Reflect and AX64 are very good for the first option, Raxco's IR on it's own is not quite as good but can be used, Rollback can't do this.

    Raxco's IR (and it's predecessor FD-ISR), Reflect, AX64 and Rollback are all good for the second option and all take very little time.

    Differences between IR vs. AX64 vs. Reflect vs. Rollback:
    (This assumes that Data is kept on in a separate partition)

    IR uses 'Snapshots' and 'Archives'.

    A Snapshot in the IR context is a complete, bootable, copy of the OS. There should be at least two of these on the system drive (C:) generally named Primary and Secondary but they can be named any way you like. This takes up 'twice' the disk space needed for AX64/Reflect/Rollback. Normally the Primary is used to update the Secondary just before an install/update. Then the install/update is done in the Primary. If the results are acceptable, continue to boot to the Primary. If the results are not acceptable, boot to the Secondary and use it to restore the Primary from the Secondary, returning it to it's previous state and effectively uninstalling the unacceptable install/update.

    The time to perform the update of a Snapshot is from seconds to a couple of minutes. Add a few extra minutes to do two boots when restoring a Snapshot.

    An Archive in the IR context is a copy of a single Snapshot that can be used in a similar way except that it(they) must reside in a different partition(s) than the OS Snapshots, preferably on a different physical drive(s), they are non-bootable and must be restored to a Snapshot (new or old). These are useful to keep multiple version/configurations of the OS and programs at different points in time -plus- if the system drive fails physically, the OS can be fresh installed on a new drive, IR can be installed and an Archive restored to both Snapshots, but only if the Archive was on a different physical drive. This obviously takes more time, beyond installing the OS and IR, the full Archive needs to be restored and the time depends on the size of the Archive and could take tens of minutes.

    AX64 and Reflect use Full (baseline- the whole C: drive at the time it's created, and would include both IR Snapshots if IR is also used) and may also use Differentials and/or Incrementals. Some people refer to these as Snapshots as well but they are not the same as the IR Snapshots. They are similar to the differences that you'd find between the IR Snapshots and Archives used by IR depending on when they were run. Depending on the frequency of creating/maintaining the Differentials/Incrementals as well as Full backups (baselines), the time to restore to a previous point may/should take from seconds to minutes. In addition, they can be used to recover a FULL image and any Differentials/Incrementals for that base line should the system drive fail physically but only if they were on a separate physical drive and the time will depend on the size of the OS/programs and could take tens of minutes. However it may be difficult to select the correct recovery point if Incrementals are used and scheduled frequently through the day at the same time as you install/update something.

    Rollback can roll back programs and data to multiple points in time but cannot, on it's own, restore to a new disk if the original failed (or it gets 'confused').

    ========================================

    Data - if it is in the same partition as the OS, then:

    you need to have a separate data backup program that automatically backs up the data to a different partition, preferably with Versioning

    -or-

    IR, AX64, Reflect need to be (scheduled to) run (more) frequently and the size of the Full, Differential and Incrementals will therefore be larger and take longer to restore. Rollback does this automatically.

    This would not be an acceptable solution to use with IR, it would require too many archives or, if you use data anchoring and an update includes modifying a Data format, Anchoring will likely cause errors when booting to an alternate snapshot which doesn't know about those changes (so don't use Anchoring!). Plus, if you don't like a new program/update and want to restore to an earlier point in time, you will/may lose changes made to your data (unless you can restore the data from a separate back up location).

    Therefore Data should be in a partition separate from the OS. It can be on the same physical drive as the OS, but preferably, it's kept on a second physical drive, just in case of a primary drive failure. It should be backed up prior to an update in case there's a format change and you need to revert data as well, which is why you should only do manual updates. A separate Data backup program with Versioning is good for this situation.

    ================================================

    My preferred configuration is:

    C: a small SSD containing only the OS (a bit bigger for multiple IR snapshots if using IR)
    E: a small SSD containing only actively maintained data (changes, frequently)
    F: a larger SSD/HDD containing back up images of the OS and back up copies of the actively maintained data.
    and
    G: a very big HDD for data that 'never' changes, such as movies, and is normally offline.
    H: a very big HDD which is a backup copy of G: and is normally offline.

    I use Reflect for drive failure or different hardware, I run it manually, FULL only, infrequently.
    I use IR(FD-ISR) for program installs/updates/testing and removal, I run it manually, when appropriate.
    I use FreeFileSync to back up my data, manually, when I feel it needs to be done, it doesn't have Versioning but I have 2 online backup discs and 2 offline backup disks to make up for that.
    I'm protected from a physical drive failure, I can uninstall a program that I don't like, I can recover data that might have been corrupted by a new version of my document/spreadsheet/database/'other' program.

    I don't use AX64 or Rollback because I don't want the hassle of trying it/them and finding that it's not reliable on my system.

    J
     
  5. manolito

    manolito Registered Member

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    After your post I did repeat my tests, this time with a very basic Win7 64bit installation. Just added Chrome, ImgBurn and VLC to the core Win7 installation. Total size is 18.7 GB

    Hardware specs:
    MSI notebook bought in 2010
    CPU AMD Turion x64 Dual Core 2x1.8 GHz
    2 GB RAM
    160 GB WD SATA HDD

    Backing up the complete drive using Acronis True Image 11 (medium compression) took 10 minutes.

    Creating the secondary snapshot upon installing InstantRecovery (no AV software present) took 55 minutes, IR indicated a rate of 6.4 MB/sec.


    My computer setup does not have any problems, I am quite sure that it is InstantRecovery which has problems. My notebook may be slow by today's standards, but it certainly is not hopelessly outdated. It even handles the latest Win 10 builds flawlessly.

    So I stand by my conclusion that InstantRecovery is slow and clumsy...


    Cheers
    manolito
     
  6. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    While admittedly I do have a fast machine, but I can make a snapshot or archive of 120gb in about 1hour and 5 minutes. Archives are a bit faster then snapshots.
     
  7. Kurtis Smejkal

    Kurtis Smejkal Registered Member

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    I did research and we are separate companies, so all this talk of product being developed by another company and sold by us is simply a conspiracy. Facts are facts.
     
  8. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    It has nothing to do with how powerfull the system is. It is related with the sata controller or the disk or the drivers. Check your bios if your disk is in IDE or ACHI mode and also update your AMD sata drivers (some versions performed very poor compared to the microsoft ones).

    And I agree with you; I would never install it on a system if its speed was similar to your results.

    Panagiotis
     
  9. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    ...and you still continue with the BS...

    Conspiracy? Facts?
    Here is my receipt of the FD-ISR license bought from HorizonDatasys and processed by Avangate.
    ~Private communication removed.~ Ron

    ps. do your research better next time.;)

    Panagiotis
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 6, 2015
  10. Kurtis Smejkal

    Kurtis Smejkal Registered Member

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    There's no BS at all. Andrew (our developer) works for us. His software he produces, he produces for us. There is no BS, and if you could put your bias against HDS aside, you'd see that.

    We are sister companies, that much has been said. Also, our products are completely independent with a different code, etc. Being that they are our sister company, and Andrew also develops for them, I can imagine some ideas make it through to the other software. However, by no means is this a 'Save As' situation and you'd best to get your facts straight first before you go ahead trashing me and the company.

    Next time you want to make inflammatory remarks, find a better source.
     
  11. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    ... and the BS continues...:rolleyes:

    As I said/advised you previously, research better before before responding. FirstDefense-ISR Developer is Todd Lear and has nothing to do with Andrew Shen.

    And slight modification/customisation, on demand signing with another certificate, do not make a product internally developed. Different codeo_O more than 99% of the code is exactly the same.

    And since HorizonDatasys Employes use frequently the term sister companies, when referring to Eaz Solutions, can you please enlighten us who exactly is your parent company?
    http://smallbusiness.chron.com/difference-between-subsidiary-sister-company-35043.html

    As for the Bias and trashing remark. There is no such intention at least from my part; HorizonDatasys and its Employes are doing pretty good job in trashing it's name by themselves.

    Panagiotis
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2015
  12. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    HorizonDatasys history and the products that "internally developed":D over the years. (since Ron wan't allow me to post any private communication with the various developers is the only way to prove who is lying and who doesn't)

    1 December 2002
    Clean Slate
    Fortres 101
    Cooler
    Central Control
    FulProof Security (Mac)
    Cyber Snoop
    http://web.archive.org/web/20021201102630/http://horizondatasys.com/

    4 December 2004
    Drive Vaccine
    Exe Vaccine
    FulProof Security
    Clean Slate
    http://web.archive.org/web/20041204063854/http://www.horizondatasys.com/

    26 December 2005
    Rollback RX
    Drive Vaccine (Mac & Windows)
    Exe Lockdown
    Registry Vaccine
    LockDown RX
    http://web.archive.org/web/20051226015303/http://www.horizondatasys.com/piece.html?piece=welcome

    10 December 2006
    Rollback RX
    Drive Vaccine
    Desktop Security RX
    Optimizer RX
    Remote Vaccine
    Fool Proof
    http://web.archive.org/web/20061210141140/http://www.horizondatasys.com/167306.ihtml

    2 July 2007
    Rollback RX
    Drive Vaccine
    FirstDefense-ISR
    Desktop Security RX
    Net Control2
    http://web.archive.org/web/20070702050217/http://www.horizondatasys.com/167306.ihtml

    10 December 2007
    Rollback RX
    Drive Vaccine
    FirstDefense-ISR Rescue
    Desktop Security RX
    Net Control2
    http://web.archive.org/web/20071210161521/http://www.horizondatasys.com/207064.ihtml

    6 January 2010
    Rollback RX
    Drive Vaccine
    Executable Lockdown
    Desktop Security RX
    Net Control2
    Drive Cloner RX
    Data Backup RX
    http://web.archive.org/web/20100106073312/http://www.horizondatasys.com/167306.ihtml

    20 Deccember 2013
    Rollback RX
    RollBack RX Server
    Drive Vaccine
    Net Control2
    Drive Cloner RX
    http://web.archive.org/web/20131220113958/http://horizondatasys.com/en/index.aspx

    17 Deccember 2014
    Rollback RX
    RollBack RX Server
    Drive Vaccine
    Net Control2
    Drive Cloner RX
    Reboot Restore RX
    http://web.archive.org/web/20141217072849/http://horizondatasys.com/

    Panagiotis
     
  13. Jim1cor13

    Jim1cor13 Registered Member

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    Very interesting Panagiotis...thank you!
     
  14. Kurtis Smejkal

    Kurtis Smejkal Registered Member

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    I'm not going to bother repeating myself. We're sister companies, we don't hide that. However all of our products are internally developed, we're not a re-seller of someone else's software.
     
  15. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    You are welcome Jim.

    Panagiotis
     
  16. clubhouse1

    clubhouse1 Registered Member

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    Thanks for confirming that.
     
  17. bgoodman4

    bgoodman4 Registered Member

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    :eek:Quite an impressive list of internally developed products,,,,,,,no wonder deployment of upgrades takes soooooo long.:rolleyes:

    Thanks from me too Panagoitis, much appreciated.
     
  18. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    Then instead of repeating yourself, tell us who is the Parent Company? of Horizondatasys and EAZ Solutions (without a parent company that owns both of them they cannot be considered sister companies). As for the comment that all your products are internally developed, I am not surprised, since HorizonDatasys is the only company (that I know) that occasionally the support personnel impersonates developer staff when they respond to tickets....
    Rollback RX = Eazy Fix (developer EAZ Solution)
    Drive Vaccine = Baseline Shield (developer EAZ Solution)
    Reboot Restore RX = Baseline Shield (developer EAZ Solution)
    http://www.eazsolution.com/
    RollBack RX Server = Keriver 1click Restore Pro (developer Keriver)
    Drive Cloner RX = Keriver Image (developer Keriver)
    http://www.keriver.com/
    Net Control2 = Net Control 2 (developer Net Software PC, previously named VAP Software)
    http://www.netcontrol2.com/

    ps. I wonder when your CEO is going to realise that your answers are damaging further and further the image of his company.

    Panagiotis
     
  19. bgoodman4

    bgoodman4 Registered Member

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    Its pretty clear they don't care Panagiotis, good thing they don't control this forum too or they would shut this one down like they did the old HDS Rx forum. Now thats how you deal with criticism and complaints (all of which are clearly made by a small group of malcontents, at least according to Kurtis).
     
  20. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    You are welcome bgoodman4.
    I agree. For the record they shut down/eliminate their forums in almost every major release of Rollback RX.
    7 -> 8 forum deleted
    8 -> 8.1 forum deleted (in that forum I had created a similar knowledge base/faq with froggie's https://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/rollback-rx-the-unofishul-faq.374977/#post-2480400 )
    8.1 -> 9.x forum deleted
    9.x -> 10.x forum deleted
    no wonder there are so little complaints in their forums.

    Panagiotis
     
  21. Keatah

    Keatah Registered Member

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    Ouch..

    To be fair, many companies, big and small alike, ask underlings to sometimes impersonate managers or developers when doing tech support. Been asked to do it myself.
     
  22. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Ah, but is it ethical. They may do it, but once I caught someone doing it, I'd be looking for another company.
     
  23. clubhouse1

    clubhouse1 Registered Member

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    I've decided to install this and try it again myself...This who owns who is all very exciting, I'm on the edge of my seat...Presidential elections and world affairs pale into insignificance.
     
  24. Kurtis Smejkal

    Kurtis Smejkal Registered Member

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    I've given you an explanation on many occasions, your bias against HDS is well apparent and quite frankly I don't think people are going to worry about someone making ficticious and non-existent connections.

    Facts are this: EZ Solutions is where our developer started off with, he created the various software, but over time there was a merger. Some of the software still sees updates, but it's not as updated as Horizon Data Sys products. Our products is now his full attention.

    It's very likely that many of these products appear similar, because they are being made by the same developer, but the products that are developed for us are independently developed. EZ Solutions is no longer really an entity. Their software is supported, but their software is more for an end user, not so much for the corporations/schools/libraries that use our software.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2015
  25. pandlouk

    pandlouk Registered Member

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    Then I am lucky because most companies that I had to contact for support use elevation system to treat support tickets.
    1st level: general support
    2nd level: specialised support
    3rd level: developers support

    Panagiotis
     
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