No Boot After Clone

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by SixString74, May 17, 2008.

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  1. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    I know I'm far from the first to have problems with this, and I apologize in advance if I missed an older thread that would solve my troubles.

    I just got TI11 (downloaded yesterday), cloned a 60GB Hitachi 2.5" drive from my Acer laptop to an USB external 120B WD 2.5" drive (both ATA) with hopes of using the 120GB in the laptop. When I swap the drives, I hear the drive spinning (real quiet, but it's there) but I get a black screen with a flashing cursor in he top left, a lot of beeping if I try to type anything. I made the recovery CD (unless there's another option and I chose the wrong one), but it makes no difference when I reboot. Replacing the original drive gives me no problems, as I'm typing this post from the laptop.

    Any help on this would be much appreciated. Please keep in mind, I'm more than capable of following your directions, but I probably don't know much correct terminology. So, I guess you can call me Mr. Layman. (but not afraid to do his own computer upgrades.)

    Thanks.o_O
     
  2. jonyjoe81

    jonyjoe81 Registered Member

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  3. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    Windows XP Home SP2 ( I KNEW I was going to forget some detail!)
     
  4. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    You have two options. Do what has been called a Reverse Clone - put the larger drive in the laptop first and the original in the external case. Boot with the TI boot cd and clone the original to the new larger drive.

    The other way assumes that there is enough room on the original to store it's own backup or if you have another external to store a backup then use that. Make a Backup Image of the original and store it on the new drive then move it over to the original drive (I think I've read that you can store the backup right away on the same drive you're backing up, but personally I don't like to do this, plus I have a few other externals to use).
    Swap out the drives and restore the backup to the new drive.
     
  5. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    Jonyjoe, I honestly don't even see any indication on the external drive (enclosure is open) specifying the drive/head geometry.

    DwnNdrty, by "enough room ... it's own backup" do you mean it has to be less than half full? I have 3 partitions. PQSERVICE with 40% of 2.93GB free, ACER (C: ) with 16% of 26.38GB free, and ACERDATA (D: ) with 92% of 26.55GB free.

    Now that I look at it in "Disk Management", the cloned C has 17% free, a difference of about 90MB. Could something essential be missing in that 90MB?
     
  6. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    "Boot with the TI boot cd"...

    I have the download. Is that what I get from "Create Bootable Rescue Media" under Tools?

    Also, should I reformat the larger (target) drive before trying the reverse clone? Or can I leave it as is and overwrite the first clone attempt?
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2008
  7. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    Yes, to Create BRM.
    No you don't have to format it first. Everything will be overwritten, so be very careful to choose the correct drives.

    About the other option, usually with the default normal compression, a Backup Image will be about 60% of the used space on the drive - depending on the type of files you have. If you have a lot of music, photos, and video, these will not compress much so the Image may be closer to 80% of used space. So from that you have to judge whether you will have space on the original to move the Image to, after it is stored temporarily on the larger drive.

    But let's hope the reverse clone will work.
     
  8. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    Okay. Does the Recovery Boot disk have to be created with the source computer? Because the one I made doesn't boot up the laptop with the drives swapped.
     
  9. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    No, the Recovery Boot disk is independent of the system on which it is made. Check in the laptop's bios setting and see if the boot order has the CD/DVD drive ahead of the hard drive.
     
  10. OnlyMe

    OnlyMe Registered Member

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    Hello, I too am pulling hairs in exactly the same situation experience as you. I also purchased and downloaded TI 11 yesterday to clone my original Toshiba laptop 120GB HD over to a new Seagate Momentum 7200.2 200GB HD in hopes that I could convert my laptop over to a faster and larger drive.
    I am also running Windows XP SP2. After many attempts at cloning from internal HD to USB2.0 connected external new HD, the clone process always seems to go well and finish successfully. But after removing original source drive and replacing it with the newly cloned 200GB hard drive, it won't boot!
    I emailed Acronis Tech Support today, but no answer yet. I also made a separate Acronis Boot CD and cloned it using the CD method. Same results, successful (no errors) clone but afterwards, the new drive won't boot. It just sits there with a blank black screen with the cursor in the upper left corner. The original drive works fine always. You beat me to the post asking same question! But I figured I must chime in about this because Acronis should mention this quirk in their advertisments. I am now going to try the tricks mentioned in this thread by the other helpful members. I will reverse the drives and attempt to clone and see what happens... I will report back my results.
     
  11. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    Alright. The BIOS issue got the CD running. (Getting pretty quick with a screwdriver swapping these drives back and forth!)

    Just to confirm, I am definitely cloning, not backing up, correct?
     
  12. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    Yes, cloning obviates the need for the extra restore step to get a working bootable drive, which in the case of laptops where you do not have an extra usb drive, is usually more convenient to do. Just be very careful that you know which drive is which when choosing the source and the destination. You don't want to make the mistake and erase your original. This is why the Backup followed by Recovery (restore) is safer. But for Backup you have to have a place to hold the Backup Image, like I explained in a previous message.
     
  13. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    Not to worry. I purposely deleted the partitions from the new drive (obvious by the extra 55.something GB unallocated) so I would know the difference.
     
  14. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    HELL, Yeah!! That reverse clone seems to have done the trick. Thanks so much for all your help.

    OnlyMe, good luck!!
     
  15. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    I'll join you in the celebration ... WoooHoooooooooo ... :D Glad it worked for you. Oh, one more thing to check. See if in Windows it shows as having 120Gb (actually should be about 113Gb) or only about 55 Gb.

    Should work for you too, OnlyMe.
     
  16. OnlyMe

    OnlyMe Registered Member

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    Another WooHoo! here! I just finished cloning with the drives reversed and it booted up just fine! Hooray! This tells me that it probably was related to the CHR being different than what the laptop's BIOS needs to use. When you format it inside the laptop it formats the disk correctly to its own needs.
    When the external USB enclosure formats the disk it does not match the laptop's BIOS expected format thus the laptop cannot recognize nor read the disc.

    Bravo for the help from everyone who pitched in.

    Thank You!:D
     
  17. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    Like I said to SixString .... if your new drive is larger than the original, check in Windows and see if Windows reports the size of the new drive correctly or is it showing the size of the old drive.
     
  18. SixString74

    SixString74 Registered Member

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    I had about 55 or so unallocated. I'm just about finished partitioning that block. Then I'm moving My Documents off of C. (amazed at some of the simple things I wasn'taware I could do)
     
  19. DwnNdrty

    DwnNdrty Registered Member

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    If you prefer to have just one large partition, we use what has become known in the forum as the Secure Zone trick. Here's the method I saved from another user:
    ================================
    If you have already cloned/restored your drive and just want to regain the missing (unallocated) space proceed as follows:
    1. Make the bootable True Image Rescue cd, if you have not already done so.
    2. Boot with it and from its main menu choose Manage Acronis Secure Zone.
    3. Create an SZ of any size less than the missing unallocated space. Do not accept the default to activate the Startup Recovery Manager.
    4. OK back to the main menu.
    5. Go right back into the Manage ASZ.
    6. Choose to Delete the SZ.
    7. When asked what to do with the space, accept the default to append it to the existing partition.
    8. Back out to the Main Menu, Exit the process, quickly remove the CD and reboot the system (if it doesn't self reboot).
    ====================================
     
  20. OnlyMe

    OnlyMe Registered Member

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    Yes, Windows reports the correct size of the new cloned disk space. It is reporting it as about 186GB for the 200GB Seagate drive I put in. So everthing has worked out well. I have now also cloned another Toshiba A105 laptop 160GB, 4200 RPM drive over to a new Hitachi 160GB 5400 RPM drive. Same size, worked beautifully using the reversed drive placement method and the bootable Acronis CD. :)
     
  21. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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  22. OnlyMe

    OnlyMe Registered Member

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    Here is what it shows for my new cloned Seagate Momentum 7200.2 200GB hard drive:
    Number of Cylinders: 24297
    Number of Heads: 255 Number of Sectores/Track: 63

    Ending Cylinder: 1024 Head: 254 Sector: 63
     
  23. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    OnlyMe,

    Thanks. Now we know Toshiba laptops have conventional CHS geometry. Folks have reported 240 head geometry (internal HD) with IBM and HP/Compaq laptops but these laptops see external HDs as 255 head geometry. Hence the problems with standard clones. Reverse clones are often needed even when the geometry is conventional. In the case of a 240 head geometry laptop, a reverse clone is usually essential.



    PS.. Was your Ending Cylinder: 1024 or 1022?
    What is the geometry of your external HD?
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2008
  24. OnlyMe

    OnlyMe Registered Member

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    Oops! My Ending Cylinder is 1023 not 1024 as posted before.
    Type: 07 Boot: 08 Start Cyl/Hd/Sctr = 0/1/1.


    I am wondering if I will have any problems cloning from a new laptop 250GB drive to a new 200GB drive. Will Acronis TI 11 properly clone over, adjust and fit the 250GB image down into the 200GB image? I am due to get a new Asus M50Sv-A1 laptop this week with a 250GB drive. Before I even boot it, I want to clone the 250GB 5400RPM drive to a faster but smaller 200GB 7200RPM drive.

    Thank You!

    I don't know the geometry of my external drive because it is now my internal drive which I cloned to boot up with!
     
  25. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    I messed up too. 1023 is correct.

    To be certain of success, I'd resize the 250 GB HD to 195 GB before performing the clone. Otherwise, defrag the 250 GB HD and hope you have moved all data below the 200 GB sector mark.
     
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