Need Some BackUp Advice

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by tombuhn, Aug 30, 2007.

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  1. tombuhn

    tombuhn Registered Member

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    Ok I used Ghost for years, but have now moved to Acronis. I have purchased the Disk Director Suite and True Image WorkStation V9.1 with the the plugins Acronis recommends. I love to image my hard drives etc......

    Now I need to run back ups on my small Win XP Pro file server. After making a complete image backup, I upload it to an FTP server on the net. I then want to make differential back ups and upload those to the net each night.

    The problem that I see and have read up on is that if I deFragg my drive (Which I do everyday on a schedule), then Acronis see's that change and my diff file is as big or bigger then the original backup itself :(.

    This won't work for me, at this rat eI will never get my backs to the net and I would need some un godly amount of space.

    So after much disappointment, I will only be able to use Acronis for imaging and now need to move to a software based backup solution that allows for encryption, compression, and true diff back ups.

    Does anyone have a suggestion as to what software would be good for backing up small home servers. I also need to do this for my brother inlaws small business so I want something solid.

    I saw that Symantec bought BackUP Exec :( .......... Also note I have BackUp SE but thats not what I really need, I also have Memo but again not a good solution, Win XP backup lacks features that I need so now what.........?


    Thank for your time!
     
  2. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    OK, let's distinguish between system backups (everything: operating system, programs, settings, and data) and data backups (just the data with none of the rest).

    You need a system backup to restore your system if the hard drive fails. Unless you install a new program or make lots of setting changes, an old system backup will be sufficient to restore the hard drive to fully working condition but you will have to do the Windows, antivirus and other updates. Also the data will be old.

    However, if you separately backup your data frequently, you can restore all your new data to the restored old system backup and have a fully up-to-date system.

    TrueImage is great for the system backup. It can also do the separate data file and folder backups. On the other hand, there are also other applications to make data backups to the Internet such as Mozy and Connected Online Backup.

    The file and folder backups will be much smaller, especially the incrementals or differentials since these are based on a changed file basis and not drive sectors.

    Does that help?
     
  3. tombuhn

    tombuhn Registered Member

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    Thanks for the response John.

    I understand the restore part etc....

    What I am getting at is when I do a differential or incremental back up the back ups are to large due to the way Acronis was design to do its backup. So Acronis will not work, again the Differential back is just as large as the original. I can't keep trying to upload 3 - 4 GB every night to the internet, it is just too large. Now if the differential or incremental was say only 100 or 200 mb then great, but it isn't :(

    Here is some actual data:

    Drive C with windows xp pro sp2 with no major programs is 6gb, the initial back up is a nice 3gb file, but the next day when the diff or inc back up runs it produces another 3gb backup, that means I have to move 6gb of data to the net, which our DSL can't get up with!

    Drive D with my actual data and shared folder is about 7gb, so the initial backup is about 3.5 gb when the diff or inc back up runs I get another 3.5 gb backup.

    Now between the 2 backups that’s 7 gb of data a day I am trying to upload to an FTP server over night in a 10 hour period, while on a 500kb dsl upload. LOL, do the math and you'll see my problem.

    I need a back up program that will do an initial bu of 3gb, then do incremental or differential back ups which should be a lot smaller like 100 / 200 mb files. Acronis can not do this :(.

    Any suggestions?

    Like what used to be Veritas BackUp Exec. Just a good solid BU program that doesn’t create diff or inc backups that are as large as the initial back up.
     
  4. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Symantec Backup Exec System Recovery can. Even after daily defragging. You did ask for a recommendation.
     
  5. tombuhn

    tombuhn Registered Member

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    LOL, yes I did, thank you. I will still use ATI it has it's purpose, and is an awesome program I just whish it didn't make such large diff and inc back ups :(
     
  6. SloPoke

    SloPoke Registered Member

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    The incrementals and differentials are as large as the original full images because they are in fact not incrementals or differentials but full images themselves.

    You say you are moving the original full backup to an ftp server. Note that if TI can't find the original full image in the same folder it is creating the incremental or differential, it will do another full image instead. Why? Because by definition an incremental or differential compares the current state of the disk sectors with the previous state. If it can't find the previous image file, it has nothing to compare against and has to start over again.
     
  7. tombuhn

    tombuhn Registered Member

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    No I am not moving the originals to the net, I am copying the originals to the net. As they say 1 local backup and 1 off site bu :).

    I knew that the original has to be in the folder to make a true inc or diff, but that doesn't change the fact that the diffs are still huge.
     
  8. SloPoke

    SloPoke Registered Member

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    OK, so much for that theory.:p I defrag my hard drives regularly, and my incrementals are only a fraction of the original image. Have you checked the description of each incremental using the mount wizard to see if they day "volume 2, 3, 4 of multivolume file"?
     
  9. seekforever

    seekforever Registered Member

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    Kill the defragger for a couple of days and see if that cures the problem. If it doesn't then look elsewhere.
     
  10. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    But you missed my point that you don't need to do an incremental or differential of a boot drive image. The programs part changes only rarely, so an old backup is fine.

    There's no need to do an image backup with incrementals of a data drive either if there are other things on the drive that change as in your case.

    The second backup you need to do is a Files and Folders backup which allows you to choose only the folders which contain the data you want to backup. The incrementals or differentials in the Files and Folder backup will be much smaller and most likely meet your needs.

    The Files and Folders backup is essentially what Backup Exec did.

    When you first start a backup, TI asks what you want to backup. My Computer is an image backup. My Data is a Files and Folder backup. In version 9, it is clearer as Partitions or Files and Folders.
     
  11. tombuhn

    tombuhn Registered Member

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    Mine is the same, meaning: Drive C is an image of a partition and drive d is made using the files and folders option, hence a large part of my frustration :(
     
  12. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Just in case anyone is confused, Symantec Backup Exec is totally different from Symantec Backup Exec System Recovery. The latter is an imaging program.

    Very similar names but completely different programs.
     
  13. Xpilot

    Xpilot Registered Member

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    Hi tombuhn,

    Have you considered a different method to satisfy the need to get off site storage? I say this because even if cutting down on defrags reduces the inc/diffs to a manageable size you will still have the problem of renewing the base image from time to time. With the passage of time unless you are ruthless in deleting old data and or taking it off line on a semi-permanent basis you storage volumes will steadily increase.

    My own way is to use removeable media as one leg of of a backup strategy. There is then no load on your internet connection and you can store the external media where you wish. As to the media itself a pair of external hard drives either as USB or similar incarnations or, my favourite, removable hard drive caddies are the way to go.

    Xpilot
     
  14. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    OK, if you are doing a files and folders backup of D, the incrementals should be small as you expected.

    Now, I'm out of ideas other than to suggest you try a different file backup program for D.

    As I mentioned, I have had good luck with Connected online backup and Mozy but you have to pay for the service monthly.
     
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