Kaspersky has gone bad

Discussion in 'other anti-virus software' started by Fly, Apr 28, 2009.

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  1. Fly

    Fly Registered Member

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    I've been looking for a replacement for this McAfee AV I have, and after some research and thinking I came up with a few alternatives.

    I trialled Kaspersky along with two other (free) AVs. (I can't say which ones, since 'this AV vs. that AV' is not allowed).

    Even with heuristics at high it was reasonably fast, strong and comfortable to use. I was leaning towards buying Kaspersky.

    Until today. :mad:

    I noticed the KIS 2010 thread, and decided to take a look at the next version of Kaspersky, it would obviously matter since I wouldn't want to be stuck with an outdated product. So I downloaded the beta from the Kaspersky forum.

    I know it's not the final version, but that's not the issue. When I tried to install KIS 2010 I had to agree to a piece of text to be able to install the software. (I don't recall if it was called a EULA, privacy statement, 'terms' or whatever)

    Kaspersky is playing fast and loose with people's privacy !
    There is what Kaspersky calls 'non personal data' (paraphrasing, I don't have exact quotes). And then there is what Kaspersky calls 'personal data'.
    There is the option to participate in an online community network (I don't remember what it's called) that does send data to Kaspersky, but it seems that it's possible to opt-out.
    Here it comes: what Kaspersky calls 'personal data' can be shared/released/(sold?) quite easily without a subpoena or warrant, 'good faith' (literal quote) is enough to share these data if Kaspersky deems it necessary, for Kaspersky's sake, associates (can be about anybody), or to protect others.

    While I don't recall the exact words (it got me mad enough to immediately uninstall Kaspersky), I'm sure they have no qualms releasing that information to the FSB (successor of the KGB), authorities of other countries (China, North Korea?) or whoever. It's about as open-ended as it can be.
    Name, address, bank/credit card data, email address, IP, hostname, maybe web surfing data and ?

    Is there really any (good) AV left that is completely clean ? (The free ones for Windows XP are just not good enough IMO)

    Why don't I just hook up my machine to a botnet ? :rolleyes:
     
  2. zapjb

    zapjb Registered Member

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    I doubt if the same EULA will be in KAV10 final.
     
  3. Baz_kasp

    Baz_kasp Registered Member

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    Hi,

    Thats the KSN- Kaspersky Security Network...it is completely optional and not a requirement to enable (it was also there in v2009, but also not a requirement to install). Please also remember that the 2010 betas are not for production use and still have incomplete options/badly worded text and many bugs- they are just testing builds and not reflective of the final product, Kaspersky respects it's customers privacy and does not sell or distribute customer data (that would be wrong for a security vendor). I think the title of this thread is most definitely premature and misleading.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2009
  4. trjam

    trjam Registered Member

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    Excuse me Fly, but you say AV to AV talk isnt allowed and that is true. But as I read, I see you writing nothing more then a political thought thread about what you think. And if I remember Mike saying it once, that aint allowed either. This entire thread should be deleted.
     
  5. Fly

    Fly Registered Member

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    Yes, I presume it was called KSN. And according to the terms, it was possible to 'opt-out'. That was not the issue.

    I think the text was quite clear. 'badly worded' ? You mean, in the final release it will look more slick, but they still can play fast and loose with your privacy ? I wouldn't know why they would put it this way if they didn't mean it. It's very hard to believe that it's just sloppiness.
    I've seen privacy policies being reworded (completely removing the selling/sharing of data -yes, McAfee- but I don't think their practices changed)

    How would the average user know if Kaspersky would mess with their privacy if they replaced the text I mentioned with a more slick version ?
    It's an issue of trust, and way too many security vendors have violated that. (Webroot: Spy Sweeper, McAfee, pretty much anyone who puts in an ask.com toolbar and not even offering an opt-out in the default installation)
     
  6. Fly

    Fly Registered Member

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    I hope this won't be deleted !

    It's about privacy, violation of privacy, by Kaspersky and to lesser extent others. It is by no means intended as being political.

    It's not just about what I think, it's mostly about what I read (facts) and a bit of interpretation.
     
  7. trjam

    trjam Registered Member

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    then you might want to rephrase the following thoughts.

    just my 2 cents.
     
  8. Joeythedude

    Joeythedude Registered Member

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    agree +1
     
  9. Trespasser

    Trespasser Registered Member

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    I agree with you, trjam.

    Later...
     
  10. steve1955

    steve1955 Registered Member

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    He's trying to make a big issue out of something that isn't:-if its optional just opt out!This post is all about what Fly "thinks" this agreement means and what he "thinks" may happen to the data gathered even though you don't have to agree to them collecting any!(talk about paranioa!! or is it a case of trying to instill it in others?)
     
  11. trjam

    trjam Registered Member

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    well it aint working. We are living proof of that here.:)
     
  12. steve1955

    steve1955 Registered Member

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    might be:-I'm going to go through all the EUA's Ive signed/ticked over last 10yrs to see what I've agreed to!(lol)
     
  13. trjam

    trjam Registered Member

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    that may take some time my friend.:doubt:
     
  14. steve1955

    steve1955 Registered Member

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    well to be honest I never really read them:-If I want the software I have to "agree" otherwise I can't install it!:-who knows who may be spending my money/using my details(lol):-anyway they'd prob spend less than my wife!!
     
  15. Badcompany

    Badcompany Registered Member

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    Nice one steve1955,Totally agree with that 100%.
    Badcompany:thumb:
     
  16. tonyseeking

    tonyseeking Former Poster

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    You just aren't happy with anything are you? :blink:

    So no use us recommending anything, because sooner or later you won't be happy with that either.

    Solution: Write your own AV and stop complaining.:thumbd:

    And what would you know anyway about AV to conclude they aren't "clean" or good? What are your security and programming qualifications?
     
  17. 3x0gR13N

    3x0gR13N Registered Member

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    This is also stated :)
    The KSN is used solely to combat new, spreading malware and keeping the users safe from new threats. Other AV companies also have similar services, ESETs ThreatSense for ex. or the quick analyze+submit log in SAS during install.
     
  18. The Hammer

    The Hammer Registered Member

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    Spy agencies don't need an Av vendors help to know all about you, if they're the least bit interested that is:rolleyes: .
     
  19. Dark_Hanzo

    Dark_Hanzo Registered Member

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    Norton has so called "Norton Community Watch" which can be opted-out during installation or disabled later under settings.
     
  20. fax

    fax Registered Member

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    Just FUD... ignore it .. :mad:
    First Prevx now Kaspersky... who is next?
     
  21. Fly

    Fly Registered Member

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    Having read the responses, I guess starting this thread was probably a bad idea.

    Feel free to ignore it- or not.

    I don't think I'll post in this thread again, I don't want to argue or flame.
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2009
  22. steve1955

    steve1955 Registered Member

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    you must know my missus then!(lol)
     
  23. steve1955

    steve1955 Registered Member

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    you knew what you were doing when you originally posted!
     
  24. TonyW

    TonyW Registered Member

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    KSN is an opt-in/opt-out service. The rules have to be in place should you decide to opt-in. As has already been said, KL isn't alone in this arena; other products use similar methods.
     
  25. mvdu

    mvdu Registered Member

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    Well, one thing these privacy threads have done is made me pay more attention to EULAs. That's good. I tend to react to these things, being a small l libertarian.

    I haven't checked Kaspersky's EULA, but as people have said, don't count the wording as a done deal yet. I'd be looking at it being in an authoritarian country like Russia, but I don't live there.
     
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