Install Vista after XP - Correct Procedure?

Discussion in 'Acronis Disk Director Suite' started by freeyayo50, Feb 8, 2008.

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  1. freeyayo50

    freeyayo50 Registered Member

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    I want to install Vista. Currently I have 2 primary partitions with XP installed on them(P11& P2), 1 shared data partition(P3), 1 small partition with OSS and swap file(P4) and a formated NTFS partition(P5). 5 partitions all together. I want to install Vista on the NTFS partition(P5).


    Are these the correct steps I should take in order to install Vista and have it be shown in OSS?

    Procedure:
    1) Deactivate OSS (don't uninstall)
    2) Boot to DD and set P5 partition Active and hide P1 & P2
    3) Boot to the Vista DVD and install Vista (have it format the NTFS partition)
    4) Let the Vista installation continue and make sure you can successfully reboot into Vista
    5) Reactivate OSS from the DD CD
    OSS should find Vista and setup the menu entry for it. (*Note)


    *Note - Will I have to do the procedure stated in Post#1 of this thread before reactivating OSS to have Vista show?
    https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=148352&highlight=install vista xp
     
  2. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    The steps I'd recommend would be as follows:

    1. Make an Entire Disk Image backup of the drive before starting. This allows you to restore and try again if necessary.
    2. The P5 partition needs to be a Primary partition. You say you have two Primary partitions and they are both used by XP. P5 may need to be converted to a Primary partition using DD prior to installing Vista. This means that the OSS/Swap and the Data partitions need to be Logical partitions.
    3. Deactivate OSS (don't uninstall).
    4. Boot to DD, set P5 Active and hide P1 and P2.
    5. Boot to the Vista DVD and install Vista (let it format the P5 partition).
    6. Complete the Vista installation and make sure you can boot successfully.
    7. Reactivate OSS from either the DD CD or by installing DD and OSS in Vista. This is a guess as to which will work better. Sometimes Vista is recognized better by OSS when it's installed from Vista. Other times it works better from the DD CD.
    8. Reboot and see if OSS has added Vista to the OS menu.
    You should not have to follow the steps in the thread you linked. That was a "fix" for the pre-Vista builds of DD and doesn't usually work with build 2,160 (the current build).

    If Vista is not detected properly by OSS, it can be added manually. See this thread: Vista disappeared in dual boot. Post #14 details the procedure.
     
  3. freeyayo50

    freeyayo50 Registered Member

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    I tried your solution exactly how you stated, but Vista refuses to install. It's giving me an "unable to find system volume that meets criteria" message.

    I have attacthed 2 screenshots. One of the error I am given and the other is how my setup looks in DD. I Hid the XP Primary partitions, set the Vista partition to primary and active.
    While trying to install Vista, you can see the the Vista partition is shown as Logical and the 2 XP partitions are Primary. I've tried formating in the install, but nothing changes.

    Any suggestions on how I can get the Vista partition to be shown as Primary?

    200802091419_00037.jpg 200802091423_00040.jpg
     
  4. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    When you're booted into XP, does XP's Disk management show the Vista partition as a Primary partition or a Logical partition? (It probably shows it duplicated because of mixing Primary and Logical partitions.)

    If you have a BartPE or VistaPE CD you can boot to that and check without needing to start XP with the Vista partition visible.

    Can you post the exact order in which you created the existing partitions along with any conversion steps?

    Vista won't let you mix & match Primay and Logical partitions and that may be the reason. Vista and VistaPE probably see the Vista partition inside the Extended partition container, which means they see it as a Logical partition.

    One way to fix the problem would be to delete the Data, Swap and Vista partitions. This would leave only the two XP partitions. Then create the Vista Primary partition. Finally, recreate (or restore) the Data and Swap partitions. To do this, you'd have to copy off everything and copy it back or create a backup image and restore it.

    There may be some program out there that will "unscramble" the partition table, but I can't think of one right now.
     
  5. freeyayo50

    freeyayo50 Registered Member

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    You are correct, XP is showing duplicate Vista partitions in Disk Management. They both are located in the Extended container.
    Partitions in XP.JPG

    I can't remember how I setup my partitions. I believe I setup the 2 primary XP partitions 1st, than I setup the Data partition, than the Swap File partition. Than I think I left the 5th partition Unallocated and formatted it to NTFS about 2 weeks later.

    If possible, if you think of a good software that can unscramble a partition table, please post it here?

    I have about 150GB worth of data in the Data partition, so it will be a pain backing it up as it will take several hours backing it up over to my NAS device over the network.
     
  6. K0LO

    K0LO Registered Member

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    Would it work if you delete the primary partition C: and leave it as unallocated space, then move the Data partition to the right, leaving the unallocated space following the other two primary partitions, then finally create a new primary partition in the unallocated space?
     
  7. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    Do you have a current backup image of the drive? It's always recommended before doing any partition changes in case something goes wrong.

    Do you mind doing a little partition shuffling?

    The Data partition is in the position the Vista partition probably needs to be in. You could try this:
    1. Delete the Vista partition.
    2. Use DD to convert the Data partition to a Primary partition.
    3. Boot to the DD CD and set the Data partition Active and hide the two XP partitions.
    4. Boot to the Vista installation DVD and see if it sees the Data partition as a valid installation destination. If it does, then continue. If it doesn't, stop and post back.
    5. Boot to the DD CD and set the correct XP partition Active and the other partitions as normal so you can boot XP. (You know what these settings are.)
    6. Boot back into Windows.
    7. Use DD to resize the Data partition as small as it will go.
    8. Create a new Logical partition in the unallocated space (this is between the Data partition and the Swap partition).
    9. Name the new partition TEMP.
    10. Copy as much data as possible from the Data partition to the TEMP partition.
    11. Use DD to again resize the Data partition smaller.
    12. Use DD to resize the TEMP partition larger to use the new unallocated space.
    13. Copy more data from the Data partition to the TEMP partition.
    14. Repeat steps 11-13 until the Data partition is the size you want (around 46GB).
    15. Then do a final resize of the TEMP partition and copy the remaining data from the Data partition.
    16. The Data partition should now be empty.
    17. Rename the Data partition as VISTA and rename the TEMP partition as Data.

    It's kind of a convoluted procedure, but I think it would work.

    Now, you should be able to boot to DD and set the Vista partition Active, hide the XP partitions and install Vista.

    I haven't had any time yet to look into any programs.
     
  8. K0LO

    K0LO Registered Member

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    Paul:

    I see what you are attempting to do by forcing the proposed new primary partition for Vista to be in the third slot of the partition table, but I don't think that's necessarily required for Vista to install properly. All you need to do is to untangle the extended partitions so that they are contiguous. A primary can then be in any other slot.

    For example, I've attached a picture of my Vista disk layout, created by DD10. Note that I have a primary, followed by the extended partition container, followed by another primary. While Vista Disk Management cannot create a layout like this, DD10 can, and Vista is perfectly happy with it.

    While I am pretty sure that your instructions will work, it may be the hard way. I also think that my suggestion in post #6 would work, and it may be easier to do. But either way should work.

    By the way, the drive letters referred to in my post #6 are unclear. I mean the letters as shown in the Disk Director picture in post #3.
     

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  9. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    Mark,

    There are several ways to do this. I agree that it should work the way you suggest. It would probably also be faster because it would have less data to move.

    I have not run any tests on this scenario for what Vista considers a "valid" installation partition. In your setup, Vista was already installed and you moved the boot partition. This was a manual procedure. The installation program may not see it as valid. If it does, then it shouldn't be a problem. As you say, the main thing is to get the Primary partition untangled from the Logicals.

    My only concern was because of how strict Vista is when it creates partition. If it follows the same rules when checking for valid installation partitions, it would fail in this setup.

    I may run a test on this later and see what happens. It's nice not having to guess...
     
  10. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    Both methods resulted in the Vista Primary partition being in slot 4 (the Extended container remained in slot 3). Vista had no problem installing either way.
     
  11. K0LO

    K0LO Registered Member

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    I wouldn't have guessed that. I would have guessed that your method would have resulted in a primary partition in the third slot and mine would have resulted in a primary in the fourth.
    Yes it is. Aren't Virtual Machines wonderful? I'm going to have to get on the bandwagon. It sure seems like a great way to conduct experiments with very little risk to your existing setup.
     
  12. freeyayo50

    freeyayo50 Registered Member

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    Thanks MudCrab for the info.

    This is what I did:
    1) Boot to DD
    2) Deleted the Vista partition to make it Unallocated space
    3) I than used the Move option the Data partition to the right by using the unallocated space. Now the unallocated space is to the left of the data partition.
    4) I formatted the empty space to NTFS
    5) Made the Vista partition active and hid the other XP partitions
    6) Booted with the Vista DVD and it was able to see the partition as Primary.:D

    Everything installed fine. I reactived OSS and it was able to see the Vista partition without a problem.
     
  13. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    I was thinking the same thing. I though DD would keep the partition in slot 3 because that's where it started. However, it kept the Extended container in slot 3 (probably because there were other linked Logicals) and set the Primary up in slot 4.

    Yes they are. It's also a lot faster when booting because booting from an ISO file of BartPE (for example) only takes a few seconds since it's reading from the hard drive instead of the CD. This makes tests involving multiple reboots much, much faster.
     
  14. MudCrab

    MudCrab Imaging Specialist

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    That's good to hear. And it's especially nice to hear OSS picked up Vista with no problems (that's usually 90% of the battle).
     
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