(from CDROM) Why is a reboot required??

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by jura0001, Jun 11, 2008.

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  1. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    Something that has had me amazed for some time now...:

    Why do I sometimes get this message

    "Reboot is required for completing the operation; the operation will be cancelled if you choose not to reboot now."

    even if I use the Linux version of True Image (9.1) **from CD**?

    Why is a reboot (that, by the way, does not work) required? (Of course, I understand that under "normal" conditions, for instance, when using a "normal" hard disk based system, a reboot CAN be necessary.)

    I have windows and linux partitions on that PC and it appears that the above situation happens when I try to restore one of my Linux partitions (not even the main root partition). I must add that the corresponding Linux partition I am restoring is NOT mounted and - once again- that True Image runs from a self-made Linux live CD.

    I cannot understand why under these circumstances a reboot is still required (I am just trying to restore an unmounted partition from a .tib image!)

    The problem is that trying to do as the message tells me is useless, because there is no Acronis loader starting, but when I try to reboot my normal LILO boot menu comes up.

    But anyway, in my opinion (since I am working from a CD and with an unmounted partition) a reboot should not even be required. - I was under the (maybe) false impression that such a live CD gives me the possibility to restore at any time without any hassle, without needing to reboot.. I would be disappointed if not even such a live CD could do better than a normal hard disk installation...


    Any ideas?
    thanks
     
  2. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    Are you saying that sometimes when you boot from the TI Recovery CD, TI starts up normally and some other times you get the reboot message?

    If you put the CD in the drive, power down the system and then reboot, do you ever get that message?

    It normally isn't.
     
  3. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    Hm, no, you misunderstood what I tried to describe.

    I created my own version of a Linux CD which runs a minimal but fully functional Linux, so it is not a TI CD, but a Linux CD, but I added True Image by remastering the CD. So I can run Linux from CD and (from within my Linux environment) I can also launch the full Linux version of True Image 9.1.

    Now what happens?

    I can backup partitions as much as I like - no problems.

    I can also restore partitions - no problems, normally.

    But sometimes, when I am restoring a partition (and it always seems to be a Linux partition with an ext3 or ext2 file system) the process cannot terminate as usually, but I get the info message (see above) about a required reboot in order to be able to finish the restore process (otherwise (when not rebooting) it tells me the restore would not be completed).

    Why is this so?

    I could understand it if I used True Image from within a real hard disk based system and from a system partition that, of course, cannot be restored without a reboot.


    But I talk about a hard disk independent Linux system here:
    I run my Linux system (included True Image) from a CD and do not need (but I can) to mount any hard disk partition. So why does TI insist upon a reboot in this case? Sounds stupid.


    Hopefully, this is all much clearer now.

    Just imagine, this is not much different from booting from an original TI rescue CD; in this case just like in my own case (with the self-made CD) I am hard drive independent and would expect to be able to restore without rebooting. - I cannot use the original TI bootcd because right at the beginning everything freezes (keyboard, mouse, the whole system actually).

    Just imagine, this is something like a BartPE or VistaPE CD that I use, but while those are windows based, mine is Linux based.

    Now everyone should see what my situation is. ;-)


    thanks
     
  4. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    Just another example:

    It is NOT only with Linux partitions, but also with a windows partition that I now tried to restore from my Linux system!

    At the very end of the restore process, in the last three seconds even (!), I get a message that a reboot is required and that not doing a reboot will cancel the completion!?

    And this is from a Linux system trying to restore to a NOT MOUNTED windows partition. I ask again: Why??


    Regards


    P.S.
    So while everything looks normal (the restored windows partition), I cannot be SURE that everything is all right, because no Acronis loader was launched after rebooting; my boot manager came up and my Linux booted, but no Acronis loader!

    So I tried again with my isolinux based bootcd, and now there was no reboot message! But in both cases, the situation was the same: no system partition, no mounted partition.. I do not understand this.
     
  5. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    OK, your Linux disk is outside any experience I've had.

    Beats me.

    Anyone have an idea?
     
  6. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    restoring images under Linux ALWAYS requires rebooting?

    Further testing revealed that I cannot restore ANYTHING when under Linux without getting the message that a reboot is required!?

    Is this normal behaviour?

    Whenever I try to restore an image the restore process tells me at some point (near the end or inbetween) that I need to reboot in order to complete the process; if I don't do that, the process would be canceled.

    De facto, this means for me:
    I cannot restore anything from Linux (be it from my self-made livecd, be it from a normal hard drive Linux installation with a running True Image 9.1). Why can't I restore anything? - Because the program insists on a reboot and rebooting doesn't trigger the Acronis loader for me, but only the normal boot process; after a reboot I only get the boot loader and can launch Windows or Linux, but there is not even the slightest sign of an Acronis Loader. This is different from TI under Windows XP where in such cases after rebooting the Acronis Loader gets launched!

    To summarize, this means:
    When under a Linux environment I can only make images, but I cannot restore them!
    Is that what the program is supposed to do?

    Well, I forgot one thing: I can also mount them. Well, uhm, great. :-(


    cheers
     
  7. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    Okay, still no explanation! Fine.


    Another strange thing:
    For the first time, I used the dos executable of True Image 9.1 (TrueImageCmdDos.exe) and tried to restore the DOS partition I was working from! And I was mystified when I made the experience that TI was able to restore this very partition (the same that I was working from) WITHOUT demanding a reboot! So how can this be? Is it all taking place in RAM, or what?

    So I ask again:
    Why does TI 9.1 Server Linux always demand a reboot, even if I am not working on the partition that I am going to restore, but hey, on a CDROM?

    Conclusion:
    a) I cannot understand how I could restore the same partition that I was just _using_ myself (Trueimage for DOS)
    b) I cannot understand why I cannot restore without rebooting when using the Linux version of TI (even when not using the corresponding partition, but working from CDROM)


    Still curious and waiting for an answer.


    Regards, jura0001
     
  8. K0LO

    K0LO Registered Member

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    jura0001:

    Acronis support may chime in here later with an explanation, but I think you've hit upon it in your last post. When you run the Acronis recovery CD it boots into a variant of Red Hat Linux and is all loaded into RAM. After loading you can remove the CD (this is so that you can then insert a CD or DVD containing a backup image).

    It isn't normal for the Acronis recovery CD to request a reboot after restoring a partition. I've never seen it do this. So I suspect that if you see this behavior then it has something to do with the way you are running the program in your handcrafted Linux environment.

    I wish I could point to the reason but I've not delved that deeply into the workings of the recovery environment; I just use it. You stated in an earlier post that you don't use the recovery CD because of hardware issues - have you tried adding the different kernel arguments while booting? Some of these will work around certain USB chipset problems or other issues. See the sticky post at the top of the forum listings called "Please read before you post" for some of these "cheatcodes". Another alternative is to contact Acronis support, who may ask you to run their diagnostic script on your machine, and then they may be able to provide a custom ISO image that will support your machine. Their Linux recovery environment has none of the issues that you describe.
     
  9. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    Thanks for your answer, k0lo.

    Actually, I made some progress:

    In addition to the "normal" Linux version of True Image 9.1 (the one with the reboot annoyance) I _also_ put the contents of the "Recovery Manager" (the rescue boot cd) on my customized Linux CD.

    Now, indeed, when restoring a partition from CD using the latter option (selecting TI via the Linux executable called "product") I am able to do WITHOUT having to reboot. So basically this works.

    Unfortunately, there are some disadvantages, too:

    Using "product" I cannot backup from "non-real" mounted partitions, only from physical partitions (and hey, they have windows drive letters, even under my Linux!). By "non-real" partitions I mean mount points within the Linux file system. In fact, I can only backup from fat OR ntfs file systems, but not from ext2/3 or even truecrypt mount points!

    So even if I use the command line version of truecrypt and mount a truecrypt partition via loop device and if the encrypted directories and files nowbecome accessible to Linux and appear unencrypted, the rescue cd and its executable "product" obviously cannot handle this scenario. All in all, the rescue cd doesn't seem to be able to backup from "virtual" partitons or from ext2 or ext3 partitions - while, by contrast, saving to ext2 or ext3 partitions IS possible, am I right?


    Sadly (but of course, better than nothing), the only way to give me perfect control appears to be a BartPE CD with the Windows version of TI 9.1 (or, in my case, a UBCD4WIN). I say "sadly" because the boot-up process of such a CD is many times slower than with my customized Linux CD. At any rate, with the BartPE CD TI works in all aspects (mounting, backing up, restoring - and no reboot needed); and of course, I can also launch truecrypt and let True Image backup from or restore to the virtual truecrypt partitions.


    Hm, okay, enough for now, jura0001
     
  10. Howard Kaikow

    Howard Kaikow Registered Member

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    When you restore an OS partition, you are not running Windows, so when the restore is finished, the PC has to reboot to get into Windows.

    This would also be so if the recovery disk used Windows, rather than Linux. When you switch an OS you have to reboot.
     
  11. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    I can't follow you - sorry to say so, but this doesn't seem to make any sense.

    Why should I have to reboot in your opinion? Of course, I am not running Windows, and why should I? I am running the native Linux version of True Image in order to backup and restore partitions. And just like the windows version of TI which doesn't need a reboot after restoring a Linux partition (!!!)
    I wouldn't expect the Linux version to need to reboot after restoring (for instance) a Windows partition. I already wrote above that the darn thing wants to reboot whenever I restore something (be it a Windows partition, be it a Linux partition). And this is not only so when using TI from within a running hard disk based Linux system, but as I repeatedly wrote now, this is even so when running TI from a CD. There is no logics, in my opinion.

    And think about it: The "product" (= the Linux executable on the rescue CD) doesn't need a reboot either, even when used under my running hard drive Linux!

    So if I am not wrong:
    The TI Linux version appears to be somewhat crippled in its capacities.

    Another possibility that crossed my mind is:

    Maybe, the info message that a reboot is required is a nonsense message? When restoring from Linux and getting that message, I can't complete the process (according to that info message) because when rebooting Acronis Loader doesn't get triggered, nevertheless my partition appears to be fully restored, but maybe not, who knows...

    Just to come back to your initial statement:
    The Windows version of TI does NOT require a reboot when I restore a Linux partition on the same PC (even if it is the system partition of Linux!). So restoring for a different OS has no relevance.


    Regards, jura0001
     
  12. Howard Kaikow

    Howard Kaikow Registered Member

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    When one does a restore, all that does in write a bunch of files on a drive.
    THe OS does not get initialized until you reboot.
     
  13. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    This still doesn't explain why a reboot is needed.

    Just to be absolutely sure:
    a)From XP I now restored a Windows Millenium partition: no reboot needed.
    b) From XP I then restored a Linux partition: again, no reboot needed.

    So the requirement of a reboot is the absolute exception. Only needed when you are going to restore the partition you are just using.


    When I, however, try to do the same things as in a) and b) under TI for Linux I always get the weird message that a reboot is required to complete the process and that not doing a reboot will cancel it...
    This is even so when none of the hard disk partitions is mounted, while in the above case with Windows XP I can even have all my partitions mounted!


    I am more and more considering the possibility that the challenge to reboot Linux is nothing but a fake, or let's put it this way: a bug.


    Regards, jura0001
     
  14. jura0001

    jura0001 Registered Member

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    While there is still no good explanation why a reboot is needed after each and every restore I do under Linux (even from CD), and while there is still no official statement by Acronis, I once again made some progress on my own:

    a) Obviously the challenge to reboot the PC after restoring from TI for Linux does NOT mean that the Acronis Loader has to start after rebooting! If I am not wrong (and only Acronis could explain it), "only" a reboot is suggested; and since I am normally able to interrupt my work and reboot, I can do this - no need to wait for Acronis Loader. - Thus the situation is far less dramatic than I thought before (when under the probably erroneous impression that the Acronis Loader should start at reboot time). - Nevertheless, I still believe that the reboot challenge is misleading and that a reboot is (normally) unnecessary just like with TI for Windows when completing a restore process!

    b) I also discovered that even with TI for Linux after trying to restore the system partition of Linux the Acronis Loader DOES get launched now (I seem to remember that in the past this didn't happen, don't know why it now "works"); well, I say "works", because the Acronis Loader, indeed, gets triggered, BUT: the restore could not be done, for immediately after the appearance of the Acronis Loader GUI I got a message that "the operation has completed with errors". Boing! Impossible to restore under these circumstances. Just to do more tests, I tried it again: Same message!

    c) Since the normal rescue CD does not work (but locks up my PC, keyboard, mouse, everything, with not even a chance for F11) I extracted kernel.dat and ramdisk.dat and made my own rescue CD (Attention: This is not the Linux CD I was talking before in this thread because version A boots to a full and graphical Linux environment with multitasking etc. while version B (my own rescue CD) just launches True Image, it is my isolinux based version of the regular Acronis rescue CD but with all Windows stuff removed
    - I am still convinced that not all people have problems with the rescue CD due to its Linux components but by contrast (!) due to its windows files (which I removed, keeping just ramdisk.dat and kernel.dat). I am convinced that many, if not most of those who cannot boot the rescue CD cannot because the windows components cause their keyboard or PC to lock up (like bootwiz.sys), this is especially true for those who cannot even type F11 and get a command line! That's also why in the poll I voted against making Acronis rescue media Windows based but still prefer Linux.

    To avoid too much confusion, I say it again:
    The same Acronis TI 9.1 rescue CD that hangs even before I have a chance to press F11, this very same CD works fine and reliably (every time) after I removed the *windows/dos* components and just kept the Linux components ramdisk.dat and kernel.dat. - So in my case the problem with the bootcd is a MS problem and not a Linux problem.


    Okay, time to come to an end... ;-)
    1)It was a nice learning process once again: TI 9.1 for Linux can be used to restore partitions because the reboot challenge is something different from the need to launch Acronis Loader.
    2) The boot CD can be modified and work with the same Linux components as before
    3) I still think that the reboot challenge after a restore from Linux does not make any sense (as compared to restoring from Windows and NOT getting any need to reboot, in most cases).
    4) My other customized Linux CD is my best option to use TI because it is independent of the hard disk, needs no Acronis Loader at reboot and is many times faster than a BartPE CD -and mounting images also works!


    Regards, jura0001
     
  15. rubyuser

    rubyuser Registered Member

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    True Image 10 Home, XP: My experience is very limited, but I was able to determine that if I have existing partitions on the target HD, and try to restore an image to the HD, it wants to reboot. If I first go to Administrative Tools, Computer Management, Storage/Disk Management, and delete all the partitions from the target disk before starting the restore, it doesn't insist on the reboot. Maybe this information will help Linux users in some way.
     
  16. Acronis Support

    Acronis Support Acronis Support Staff

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