FD-ISR problems with Vista

Discussion in 'FirstDefense-ISR Forum' started by Karen76, Aug 22, 2007.

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  1. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    I used FD-ISR on my old Windows XP PC for two years without any significant problems. So long as I remembered to turn off ProcessGuard, snapshots were always created or updated without any errors. Last month, I bought a new PC (HP m8120n, Intel Core 2 Duo Q6600, 3 GB RAM) with the Vista Home Premium OS. I installed FD-ISR v3.2, created backup snapshots labeled Alternate and Secondary as well as a couple archive snapshots, and the program seemed to function perfectly. There was no ProcessGuard or other HIPS software to disable and under “show details,” FD-ISR always reported 0 errors when snapshots were created or updated.

    This morning, as a snapshot was finishing being updated and just before the window closed, the scrolling text reported 2 errors while the “show details” error block said 0. Checking the activity log, 2 errors were listed. Reviewing the log, I was shocked to discover that most of the updates I’d made on my new PC contained errors; usually 2, sometimes 16, and occasionally 4,580! (this despite 0 errors invariably displayed under “show details” at the time the snapshots were updated). When 2 errors were shown, they were always: “Error - SSN::GetTempFileName[1]: Access is denied. Windows error number 5.” When 16 or 4,580 errors were listed, they were always: “Error - SSN::SetFileShortName: Cannot create a file when that file already exists. Windows error number 183.”

    I uninstalled FD-ISR using the option to save existing snapshots. I rebooted, reinstalled FD-ISR, rebooted again then updated the Alternate and Secondary snapshots. The activity log listed two errors for each snapshot; the update window stated 0 errors. According to the log, a recent archive snapshot had been updated without any errors. I copied that snapshot to my Alternate snapshot, rebooted into that snapshot, renamed it as Primary and renamed the old Primary as Alternate. Then I copied my Primary snapshot to the Alternate with zero errors shown, both on the update window and the activity log. Success! Then I copied the Primary to the Secondary snapshot. 4,580 errors! :eek: I can’t comprehend why making these two updates resulted in one perfect snapshot and the other with thousands of errors.

    Not keen on having a backup snapshot containing 4,580 errors, I had FD-ISR remove the Secondary snapshot. I then set FD-ISR to create a new copy of my Primary snapshot as Secondary. I returned to my PC a half hour later expecting the process to be nearly finished. I was stunned to discover the new snapshot was only 10% complete with an estimated 4 hours remaining. In the past, creating a new snapshot always took less than 40 minutes. The 18.48 GB Secondary snapshot eventually took 3 hours 47 minutes to complete, over six times as long as normal. I decided to experiment and created a new archive snapshot. That 18.67 GB snapshot only took 36 minutes to complete. Thinking the previous unusually long copy process was some sort of fluke, I removed that snapshot and created another new Secondary. This time it took 3 hours 51 minutes to finish.

    I’m in a state of utter befuddlement. When I update snapshots, FD-ISR’s activity log usually reports 2, 16 or 4,580 errors while the “show details” window invariably shows 0 errors. Sometimes creating a new snapshot will take 36 minutes, sometimes an identical size snapshot will take nearly four hours. I hope some of the FD-ISR experts here have a clue how I may resolve these bizarre problems.
     
  2. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    There is a bug in Vista that produces horrifically long copy error's and that is what you may be dealing with. I may try and load up my vista snapshot and see if I can get FDISR to run. I would turn in a support ticket to the vendor you acquired FDISR from, but realize you may be fighting the vista bug itself.

    Pete
     
  3. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    Hello Pete,

    I purchased my copy of FD-ISR from an authorized Raxco reseller.

    I'd read about other posters in this forum who also experienced inexplicable copy/update errors with FD-ISR, but I wasn't sure they were using Vista. They reported filing support requests with Raxco without receiving any response. Between (1) Raxco no longer selling FD-ISR, (2) Raxco demonstrating a lack of zeal in handling FD-ISR support inquiries, and (3) My own negative experience with Raxco technical support, I'd hoped you or another guru here on Wilders might have some advice. I hadn't read of anyone else encountering the incredibly long times to create new snapshots I experienced today.

    FD-ISR v3.2 is a tad short of being "Vista compatible" as I view the term. What I find particularly baffling is the lack of consistency in these problems. One minute FD-ISR works; a minute later you duplicate the same procedure with drastically different results.

    Thanks for your reply. I always read your posts with great interest. You're the person primarily responsible for my buying FD-ISR in the first place and the program saved my bacon several times on my XP PC.

    I'm able to restrain my enthusiasm for Vista. Unfortunately, HP no longer offers Windows XP on its PCs.
     
  4. PoetWarrior

    PoetWarrior Registered Member

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    Hey Karen76,

    I own Vista Home Premium and had the same problems with FD-ISR v 3.2. The logs indicated anywhere between 2 and over 4 thousand errors after a copy session while none were listed in the immediate summary.

    I contacted Raxco and I believe it was Susie who worked with me. Raxco provided me with an updated copy engine file and they provided directions for file replacement. For me, it worked. No more errors in the logs.

    Since Microsoft recently patched Vista, I found that I no longer need the Raxco fix. I can install FD v. 3.2 after reinstalling Vista and FD works perfectly now. Try Raxco's support team. They were responsive on my behalf.

    Even trying SP 3.0 now and all is working nicely.

    Wish you the best,

    PW
     
  5. Horus37

    Horus37 Registered Member

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    So are you using the "old copy engine" then? Wonder what it was with microsofts own patching that somehow helped FDISR and it's copy engine? Why did they have you reinstall vista?
     
  6. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    See PM
     
  7. PoetWarrior

    PoetWarrior Registered Member

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    Hey Horus37,

    Yep, I am now using the FD original 3.2 copy engine instead of the Raxco replacement file.

    I reinstalled Vista just to make sure nothing's hiding on my system. Why? I recently discovered Returnil and thought I should start fresh. Plus, I like tinkering.

    It's my pure speculation that the patching from Microsoft made the difference because I never had the original FD 3.2 perform without log errors (never any contact with MS by the way). The only thing I can think of is that I acquired the performance patching before I installed and used FD 3.2 this time.

    Have to admit I wasn't expecting it and I could be entirely wrong, but something changed. I've installed Vista a few times now partly for practice (OEM version) and FD 3.2 always gave me the log errors. Getting spooky ;0)
     
  8. mrfargoreed

    mrfargoreed Registered Member

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    I've just installed Vista, too, and having the same problems with FDISR - over 4000 errors, most of them the “Error - SSN::SetFileShortName: Cannot create a file when that file already exists. Windows error number 183" error.

    When I boot into Vista, it seems to wok ok though. Very strange.
     
  9. Coff

    Coff Registered Member

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    Do you get errors if you use RSS rather than the default VSS? I've gone back through about a dozen logs involving making vista snapshots/archives/exports but can't find any errors but I use RSS.

    You can change from VSS to RSS using the command prompt :

    cd \$ISR\$APP\Setup
    ISRSetup -install -rss

    Reboot.

    To change it back to VSS, use the same command prompt but insert -vss instead of -rss.

    (In Vista, you should probably run the command prompt with admin privileges.Right click the command prompt shortcut, properties, advanced, and tick the appropriate box.)
     
  10. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    I just did an upgrade install of Vista, to test FDISR as itis installed along side of SP which also uses VSS. Created a new shapshot and did a copy of about 135000 files with no errors.

    Preboot was disabled and wouldn't enable, but what the heck, you can't have everything.:D

    Restored XP pro image so that is gone.

    Pete
     
  11. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    Yesterday, I contacted Raxco support and sent them the (very large) SupportInfo file and screenshot they requested. My last e-mail from them said their development team would review the information.

    Today, I updated or created six FD-ISR snapshots. Four were completed with no errors, two had 16 errors (even though the error field in "show details" always reported 0 errors). If there's a pattern to when errors are made, or the number (2, 16 or 4,580), I can't discern it.

    The feature to schedule FD-ISR backups also isn't working on my Vista PC and the FD-ISR system tray icon doesn't appear 5-10% of the time after rebooting.
     
  12. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Karen

    Just so you understand, what they do is send the info you sent to "development" which in this case is Leapfrog. Need to allow a bit for back and forth time. Scheduling as has been mentioned isn't one of FDISR's strong points. Most of us don't use it. I like to update FDISR stuff when I am not doing anything else.

    Cheers,

    Pete
     
  13. mrfargoreed

    mrfargoreed Registered Member

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    Tried changing to rss and still the same amount of errors. Everything appears to work ok though. I would have thought that if the errors were bad ones I wouldn't be able to boot into Vista or install anything. Seems to work fine - just don't like seeing such a huge amount of errors.

    Thanks for the advice, by the way :thumb:
     
  14. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    I wish these inexplicable, recurring errors were the only problems I was having with FD-ISR and Vista. Yesterday, I created a couple new archive snapshots with no errors which took around 35 minutes each to complete. Last night, I removed my Secondary snapshot (which had been updated with errors) and tried to create a new one. An hour later, FD-ISR was at 10% progress and an estimated five hours to go. I cancelled the operation and removed the partial snapshot. I tried again with the same results. The third time, after an hour and 10% progress, I went to bed thinking surely the operation would finish during the night. This morning, FD-ISR said the snapshot was 27% complete with an estimated 26 hours to go! :eek:

    Twenty-eight minutes ago, I tried for the fourth time to make a new Secondary Snapshot. FD-ISR is set to "High" Priority as usual. At this moment, FD-ISR says the snapshot is 9% complete with 5 hours remaining. It's going to be a long day. :rolleyes:
     
  15. ErikAlbert

    ErikAlbert Registered Member

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    Karen,
    As far I understood, your previous computer was running WinXPproSP2.
    Don't you have a "WinXPproSP2 Installation CD" anymore to install WinXPproSP2 on your new computer to get rid of all these problems.
    I would go crazy, if I had your problems. :)
     
  16. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Karen, I think you might be fighting the infamous vista bug about slow file coping. You can google 'vista File copy slow" and get pages of stuff.
    Erik's suggestion is the only thing I can think of.
     
  17. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    Erik and Pete,

    My new and old PCs are both Hewlett-Packard models. HP PCs (and those of many other manufacturers) don't come with Windows installation CDs; instead, they have a recovery partition in case a reformat is needed. Also, the developer needs to identify and correct these problems and that's only going to happen if lab rats ... er, FD-ISR users with Vista PCs ... report the deficiencies and assist in fixing them.

    While it's possible the update/copy error problem has existed all along with FD-ISR on my Vista PC (since the "show details" window always reports 0 errors even if there are actually thousands), this delay of several hours to create a new snapshot which should only take around 35 minutes has only occurred in the last few days.

    The only recent change to my PC is I installed the trial version of ShadowProtect. The first time I ran it, I got a BSOD (the first one on my Vista PC), system crash, then upon restarting my PC emitted a terrible noise like a hog being gelded. Evidently, ShadowProtect conflicted with Seagate DiscWizard or some other software. Reviewing the activity log, however, confirms that my FD-ISR problems predated the (brief) installation of ShadowProtect.

    I just sent a new SupportInfo file to Raxco and hope it's of some use to the development team at Leapfrog. In the meantime, I'll patiently munch some cheese and stick more needles in my Bill Gates doll. :)
     
  18. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    Pete,

    I did the Google search you suggested and discovered two commonly proposed procedures which seemed to help some people. These were to go into Control Panel and turn off Remote Differential Compression and/or install Windows Vista hotfix KB938979. I performed both of these steps and they made no difference on my PC. FD-ISR snapshots which should take around 35 minutes to create still require about four hours or longer.

    I hope the wizards at Leapfrog can devise some solutions.
     
  19. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    Do you have something on your machine with a large number files you can try coping off disk. That might give you an idea if its just FDISR or Vista.
     
  20. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    I've been copying a large number of files off disk in anticipation of possibly doing a reformat. The copy times aren't unusually slow. The problems I'm experiencing are definitely related to FD-ISR or at least FD-ISR and Vista together.

    I just sent Raxco support a screenshot showing a snapshot update which contained 7 errors despite the Transfer Info block showing 0 errors.
     
  21. stapp

    stapp Global Moderator

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    With you having vista Karen, is your system restore turned off?
     
  22. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    Yes, I turned off System Restore just prior to installing FD-ISR.
     
  23. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    I removed a number of off topic posts(including one of mne) from this thread.

    Pete
     
  24. Karen76

    Karen76 Registered Member

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    One of my two FD-ISR-related problems may be fixed now.

    Raxco support sent me a different copy engine file to replace the one normally present in FD-ISR v3.2. What should have been a simple procedure took three frustrating hours. I was told to go into Control Panel > Administrative Tools to stop the FD-ISR service. This couldn't be done since "stop" and other commands were grayed out. I was told to try it in Safe Mode. I then discovered I can't get my new Vista PC to reboot into Safe Mode. I don't know if the F8 key on my Logitech wireless keyboard isn't working or what. I finally used Process Explorer to kill the service.

    Then I had to replace the old copy engine file in the \$ISR\0 folder with the new one. It took two infuriating hours before Vista finally allowed me to open this file even though I'm an Administrator. It was a recurring nightmare in the Security/Advanced tab following Windows' listed edit procedures only to be constantly told "access is denied."

    When I finally did get the new file installed, I updated two regular and four archive snapshots (stored on two different hard drives) with no errors or unusual delays. When I attempted to create a new snapshot, however, it took several hours instead of the usual 35 minutes or so. I guess my last resort will be to do a reformat in the hope this might solve the problem. Raxco support wondered if my hard drive might be going bad. I would like to think an Hitachi drive would last more than one month. System diagnostics report the drive is healthy and my only file copy problems occur when I use FD-ISR.

    I did notice one tiny glitch using the new copy engine file. When snapshots are renamed, the text which appears at the end of the process says "ARENAME" instead of "RENAME." I can live with that. :)
     
  25. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    FDISR is fine under Vista here. Unfortunately tasks which are simple under XP are a pain under Vista.
     
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