Failed UEFI restores to a new HD

Discussion in 'backup, imaging & disk mgmt' started by Brian K, Feb 21, 2015.

  1. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    when backing up an system drive contains MSR, many imaging apps do not backup MSR(symantec system recovery, acronis), but when you restore the disk image, MSR will be automatically re-created at the correct location. I am not sure about O&O though. Yeah what I am trying to say is, MSR is not a necessity in backup.
     
  2. Robin A.

    Robin A. Registered Member

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    The MSR partition may not be "recognized" by the imaging program, because it doesn´t use a known file system. These partitions must me backed up in sector-by-sector mode.

    The program manages MSR according to the configuration set up for unrecognized partitions. In Paragon programs, there an explicit setting with three options: backup as "raw" (sector-by-sector), ask the user, or skip. In the first case, the MSR partition is included in the backup, in the last it isn´t.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2015
  3. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    The apps vary in their options.

    The image size of the MSR when done with TeraByte's IFW is only 28 KB. When done with Drive Snapshot is only 100 KB. (KB and not MB) The partition size is 128 MB.

    Acronis TI doesn't "see" the MSR during the backup process and it doesn't appear as a partition to restore during the restore process.

    O&O "sees" the MSR during the backup process and it does appear as a partition to restore during the restore process.

    The TeraByte apps allow flexibility in the restore process in that you can restore the Entire Drive image or the partitions individually and in any order. Instead of restoring the 4 partitions in any order (which works) I created a GPT disk with Partition Work as this also creates a MSR. With Image for Linux this was done...

    Win8 was restored with the Restore First Track option
    A 100 GB partition was created (to act as a spacer)
    EFI was restored to Free Space
    A 50 GB partition was created (to act as a spacer)
    Recovery was restored to Free Space with the Update Boot Partition option

    Win8 booted normally.

    The usual partition order is...

    Recovery
    EFI
    MSR
    Win8
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2015
  4. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Here is an alternative way to recover from a failed Drive Snapshot restore of a UEFI Win8 to a new, empty HD.

    Let's say you don't understand the IFL method and you are desperate to use Win8. Boot your WinPE media...

    Open a Command Prompt
    diskpart
    list disk
    select disk x (x being the number of the HD containing the restored partitions)
    clean
    create partition primary
    exit

    Open Drive Snapshot
    Don't restore the partition structure
    Restore the Win8 image (ONLY) to the partition you just created
    set the partition Active
    Exit DS

    Restart the computer and boot back into WinPE using MBR mode (not UEFI mode)

    Open a Command Prompt
    unplug your WinPE before the following. The WinPE runs in RAM so the media doesn't need to be connected.
    bootrec /rebuildbcd

    Restart your computer into Win8. Win8 is now in MBR mode. I did say you were desperate.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2015
  5. tgell

    tgell Registered Member

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    Thanks for this. The Aoemi PE builder includes their Partition Assistant that will allow you to initialize a GPT disk using it instead of diskpart after deleting all partitions or wiping the disk. I have not tried it but I am pretty sure this would do the same thing as diskparts clean and convert GPT commands.

    http://www.disk-partition.com/help/initialize-disk.html
     
  6. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    The Pro version of Partition Assistant allows this. The Free version doesn't.
     
  7. andylau

    andylau Registered Member

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    Brian,

    If you try to use other tools to do that, why don't create an EFI partition(ESP) for it first?
    You can mount the EFI partition first, and then rebuild BCD by using such as bcdboot.exe
     
  8. sm1

    sm1 Registered Member

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    @Brian K can you please test Lazesoft Recovery Suite 4? I took a backup of my C drive and other system related partitions (EFI,MSR & Recovery) using its bootable media and successfully restored them all with no issues:thumb:. While building the recovery media there is an option to choose target system and I chose windows 8.1 64 bit. The bootable media also has options to initialize GPT and MBR drives and various other useful utilities like recovering windows accounts passwords, disk wiping, cloning etc. I tried the free home version. I don't have an empty Hard disk to test a restore to a completely new hard disk.

    Edit: I forgot to add that while choosing the partitions for backup only C drive was selected. I had to choose other partitions manually. While restoring I was informed that the backup image had track 0 and MBR. I didn't try to backup while windows was running. I took backup using the bootable media.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2015
  9. Jim1cor13

    Jim1cor13 Registered Member

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    Thanks sm1. I have used Lazesoft and several of their tools. They are often overlooked, yet
    offer a great free suite and their imaging is solid. A very useful tool kit for being free, and in
    my experience with it, the imaging has been excellent. Customer service is also very responsive
    and listens to requests. A few years ago, I communicated with them in regards to making sure they
    saved the MBR on both partition image and full disk, at the time it was just full disk that would
    save the MBR. Their next release they fixed that and it has worked quite well. Solid suite of
    tools for most.

    Thanks again BrianK and others for some great information and I am sure it will help a lot of folks. :)

    Jim
     
  10. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    I tested Lazesoft v3 early last year. Can not speak for the other tools since I did not really use them a lot, but the imaging tool did not work well for me - maybe I am picky - the compression was just awful. The image size was more than double that of .tib image I made using Acronis for the same partition. I lost interest immediately since the compression was too weak. If you don't care the size of the disk image you might find it fit your needs.
     
  11. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    sm1,

    Add Lazesoft Recovery Suite (Free) to the Success List. It can restore an image of a UEFI Win8.1 system to a new, empty HD.

    It sees all 4 partitions during the backup and restore process.
     
  12. sm1

    sm1 Registered Member

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    @Jim1cor13 You are welcome:)

    @oliverjia Lazesoft backup size may be slightly larger. For me there is about a GB difference between Macrium (high compression) & Lazesoft (default setting- I forgot to check the compression settings and I left it at default). Not much changes in the files; For me Macrium takes about 15 minutes for backup and lazesoft took about 6 minutes. I am eager to test Macrium 6 when I find some time:)
     
  13. sm1

    sm1 Registered Member

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    Thanks Brian for testing it:) I hope the developer adds additional features like incremental and differential imaging in future versions:)
     
  14. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    Thanks for the feedback. They might have changed their compression algorithm in v4. I might give the new version a try soon.
     
  15. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    Thanks Brian for the update.
     
  16. sm1

    sm1 Registered Member

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    You are welcome:)
     
  17. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    oliverjia,

    Here are image sizes for roughly the same systems. It was the same Win8.1 and the only difference was the imaging app that was installed and maybe the Windows ADK that was required for Recovery media creation. If the ADK was present the image would be larger. So the larger images don't necessarily indicate poor compression. It may simply be there was more data to backup.

    Drive Snapshot... 5.19 GB
    IFW...................5.29 GB
    Active@ DI.........5.68 GB
    Acronis TI.......... 5.70 GB
    Shadow Protect...5.71 GB
    AOMEI............... 5.92 GB
    EaseUS.............. 6.30 GB
    Lazesoft............. 6.41 GB
    O&O.................. 6.46 GB
    Macrium............. 6.49 GB
    Paragon............. 6.49 GB
    Symantec SSR.....7.16 GB
    Windows Imaging..10.3 GB
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2015
  18. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Andy, it sounds like a good project. Please let us know if it works.
     
  19. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    Thanks Brian for the info.

    I compared the size of the images for the exactly same system (all images were made using boot media). I changed the default compression level as some apps (Acronis TI for example) are still very speedy even at "high compression" level. For IFL I used "Enhanced size A". For SP I used high compression. Acronis always win in terms of both speed and size of image, followed by SP and IFL. SSR 2013R2 is good also.

    Windows ADK installation takes quite some space (2-3GB), therefore will make a difference in image size.

     
  20. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Add RealCopy Workstation to the Failure List.
     
  21. andylau

    andylau Registered Member

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    I think it should be worked, but I have no efi hardware to test

    First, you can use any partition managers to create a 100MB FAT/FAT32 efi partition(Partition type ID is 0xEF) for storing BOOT files. If you have a efi partition already, this step can be skipped.
    Then, assigning a drive letter for it by using any partition managers/tools such as diskpart or mountvol.exe(Win8's will be better, "mountvol K: /s" means mount the efi partition as K:, but mountvol.exe can mount one efi partition only)
    Last, using bcdboot.exe to rebuild boot files
    Code:
    bcdboot.exe C:\ /l en-US /s K: /f uefi
    C:\ means the OS partition, and /s K: means the efi partition
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2015
  22. andylau

    andylau Registered Member

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    The last beta was released on the 20th of November 2013
    More than 1 year still no other new beta versions or final version, it might be dead?:p
     
  23. Peter2150

    Peter2150 Global Moderator

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    I think they ported all their ideas to AX64, and that isn't going so well either. I wouldn't waste time on it yet.
     
  24. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    If you don't like your UEFI mode Win8 you can convert it to a MBR (Legacy) mode Win8 fairly easily.

    From an Admin Command Prompt...
    reagentc /disable

    Create an image of the Win8 partition (the only partition needed) using your favourite imaging app.

    Boot a WinPE in MBR mode
    Open a Command Prompt
    diskpart
    list disk
    select disk x (x being the number of the HD containing Win8 )
    clean
    create partition primary
    exit

    Boot your imaging app recovery media and restore the Win8 image to the partition just created and choose Set Active. DON'T Restore the First Track or MBR.

    Boot a WinPE in MBR mode
    Open a Command Prompt
    bcdboot C:\Windows /S C:

    Boot into Win8
    From an Admin Command Prompt...
    reagentc /enable

    Now you have the freedom to multi-boot to your heart's content. Unlike with UEFI mode. And you don't have an extra 3 partitions to backup and restore.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2015
  25. djg05

    djg05 Registered Member

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    If you have paragon HDM it has an option to do this in either direction.
     
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