Every internet user to be monitored and credentialed- Australia

Discussion in 'privacy general' started by Sheldon7, Jan 24, 2010.

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  1. Sheldon7

    Sheldon7 Registered Member

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    Wow. So the Australian government is pushing for legislation for all ISP's to "monitor" rogue software or viruses on all Australian internet users computers - or be banished from online access.
    What ever the magnitude of its implementation, it only sets a baseline for further govt intrusion in comings months and years. This global, left-wing "big brother" push for a security state is beyond acceptable.
    How does society push back against this?

    I pasted the article below, which was published in The Australian newspaper today.

    http://www.news.com.au/technology/i...cut-off-from-web/story-e6frfro0-1225823088868
     
  2. Daveski17

    Daveski17 Registered Member

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    Yes, this is disturbing news & it could give other governments around the world ideas. I can understand forming cyber-crime task forces but I don't think that governments should step in with a Big Brother attitude.

    What would Skippy think?
     
  3. quintile

    quintile Registered Member

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    And the rates of the ISPs will do what?
    They can barely keep up with mundane help desk problems anyway...

    People do need more education about security...most really don't have a clue!
    Why is personal intrusion always the first thing pols think of?

    Does anyone actually think this scenario will work? Am seriously curious here..
    I can already see the abuses, but is there an upside anywhere?
    A better way to do all this?
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2010
  4. Sheldon7

    Sheldon7 Registered Member

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    The "reasoning" given by Government for this initiative is that it would allow ISP's to eliminate rogue software attempted to be used, downloaded, or uploaded by its users. :)what: )

    One would then assume, that this would involve some form of a scan of a users-computer. This appears then to be the starting point for a voluntary intrusion of a users computer.

    What is more alarming, is the bait and switch tactic potential being used here. In Australia the government is:
    1) Building a national broadband fiber optic network - government owned;
    2) Pushing its proposed "internet filtering blacklist";
    3) Now pushing this ISP-based scan for "rogue or malicious" software.

    What greatly concerns me is how easily these initiatives quickly become something much more over bearing and invasive. What, or rather who defines "rogue or malicious"? Who says websites on the blacklist are inappropriate? Given the government will own the majority of the national broadband network, what sort of traffic analysis will be used (or even disclosed?)?

    How does the public fight back against this? The obvious choice is a new government - but let's assume that is not an option - what other options do users have?

    I can't suggest credible solutions because I cannot yet even define the threats that stem from this sort of intrusion. I would though love to hear some of more expert posters from Wilders comment in on this.
     
  5. chronomatic

    chronomatic Registered Member

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    Is it true that you Aussies are forced to vote during elections or face a fine and/or jail time?
     
  6. Sheldon7

    Sheldon7 Registered Member

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    Yeah, apparently all adult Aussies are required to vote. By not doing so, they would be liable for a fine.
     
  7. arran

    arran Registered Member

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    Actually I might agree with this, this could be an effective way to eliminate DOS attacks on the internet.

    There is no where in the article which says they will be scanning peoples files on their pc's or looking to see what people have installed on their pc's. It will be done by looking out for any zombie dos spam attack type TRAFFIC.
     
  8. Sheldon7

    Sheldon7 Registered Member

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    The article states that "ISP's will.... identify infected computers". That implies that their goal will only be achieved by some form of a scan.

    Does that concern you? Or can that be actually done in a way where those of us who are privacy conscious do not have a stress? Any feedback appreciated.
     
  9. arran

    arran Registered Member

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    They cannot scan your computer it isn't possible they would have to have physical access. They identify infected computers by analyzing traffic packets.
     
  10. culla

    culla Registered Member

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    wrong :D they can scan without physical access
     
  11. arran

    arran Registered Member

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    eh are you saying that ISP's can access your computer files? but they wouldn't they first have to bypass your router?

    I started a similar thread to this last year.
    https://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=230909

    and no one else seems to think its possible
     
  12. Nebulus

    Nebulus Registered Member

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    This may be possible in some circumstances, but it's not reliable for ISP to do it. There are some conditions for that, like: they need physical acces to your router (if any), then they need you to have a SMB/NetBIOS port opened, then they must get past your software firewall, then they must be able to actually login to your NetBIOS port. Granted, maybe a lot of users are careless enough to let all these conditions become possible, but it's not a foolproof method for an ISP to scan files on a client's computer. It is much easier to scan a client's traffic to find out if he has any malicious activity.
     
  13. Tarnak

    Tarnak Registered Member

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    As one who comes from the land down under..if this big brother intrusion comes to pass...it would lead me to chunder. :thumbd:
     
  14. Searching_ _ _

    Searching_ _ _ Registered Member

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    @arran
    Verizon has the ability to scan and access an individuals computer.
    Definition of a "Service":
    (Emphasis is mine)
    Verizon Consumer TOS PDF
     
  15. arran

    arran Registered Member

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    Verizon can only scan and access an individuals computer because their software is installed on every ones computer, other wise it wouldn't possible for them to do so.

    Verizon is only 1 company 1 ISP there are many other ISP's to choose from
     
  16. Searching_ _ _

    Searching_ _ _ Registered Member

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    I don't see any wording in the Verizon TOS that states you are told about the installation of any software.

    What software?
    Or they may not.
    What "other method" is there instead of download, CD, other media?
    Could that be Remote Installation; Worm; Trojan; Rootkit; Quantum Teleportation?

    Something else I found, seems to be anonymous.
    http://networking-forum.com/blog/?p=231
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2010
  17. arran

    arran Registered Member

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    They probably tell you about the software on your first initial contact. and The TOS elaborates more about it.


    It is obvious that the installation of their software happens either by them remotely doing it or by you installing via a cd. as for the Specific name of the software we don't know it is not menthioned in the TOS.

    They also say in their TOS.

    So you see they need your assistance to access to your computer. MY point is no ISP can access your pc unless your allow them to do so.






    I fail to see why you class this subject as being "anonymous" ?

    when it is about ISP's analyzing packet flow through a router.
     
  18. Searching_ _ _

    Searching_ _ _ Registered Member

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    Poster uses an alias and doesn't name the ISP he works for, therefore anonymous.

    The FiOS router, which has a firewall built in, allows remote administration access to all computers on a network even if set to maximum level.
    Blocking specific RA ports is the only way to prevent it, but the internet service is interrupted if you do.
    Cooperation may be required, but it may not.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2010
  19. arran

    arran Registered Member

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    But how many of us use a FiOS router ? this article doesn't really apply to the discussion in this thread.



    The word "may" is referring to, that it may be necessary to install any
    updates or upgrades to the Software.

    Not whether or not Cooperation may be required.
     
  20. tsec

    tsec Registered Member

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    "Left-wing" Big Brother?

    You sure about this Sheldon?
     
  21. Searching_ _ _

    Searching_ _ _ Registered Member

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    It's relevent in that it points out the amount of control being levied against citizens of all countries, legislation or no. Sure, it is one example of a corporation building into it's network access to it's customers computers.
    It is indicative of an infection (The need to see and exercise more control mechanisms against citizens/users), that if not remedied will be lethal us all.
    Maybe, maybe not.
    Defining terms are written by lawyers while courts rule if definitions of terms is so.

    I vote NO for any political system that wants to institute an Internet User Identification System.
     
  22. Sheldon7

    Sheldon7 Registered Member

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    Yeah, I guess I furious-typed as I posted the article. I should say "both left and right wing". I do not live in the United States, and obviously most people point to Bush republicanism as an example of a right-wing government pushing big brother initiatives.

    That said, around the world leftist governments are known for being expansive, "big government focused" and on the contrary, those to the right are accepted as small-govt.
    (I note that the US-right has completely gone against this trend in recent years though).

    My comment was intended to represent a more global view -
    Left Wing:
    China
    United Kingdom under Blair and now Brown
    Australia under Rudd
    Venezuela
    Cuba
    Russia

    We could expand this list all day - but what do they have in common? All big government, information control, surveillance states.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2010
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