Emergency Boot CD - Files Missing

Discussion in 'Acronis True Image Product Line' started by BillyDick, Jan 11, 2007.

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  1. BillyDick

    BillyDick Registered Member

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    I do a full image backup nightly of all my drives to an external, USB 2.0 drive and have the following problem.

    If I explore the image of Drive C within xp, all of the system files are there (Boot.ini, NTDETECT.com, ntldr, etc.), but, when I do a re-boot into Acronis with the Emergency Boot CD and choose Restore Files, none of the system files are there.

    How would I restore NTDETECT.com or ntldr or Boot.ini if one of these files was accidentally deleted?

    BillyDick
     
  2. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    There are ways, outside of TI, to recover those files of course but the question remains - why are the files IO.SYS, MSDOS.SYS, NTDETECT.COM, ntldr and boot.ini not available (boot.ini is visible by the way) when restoring Files and Folders within the Linux based rescue environment? o_O

    Acronis must have had a reason for omitting them I guess but I'll be darned if I know the answer.

    EDIT - corrected the statement regarding boot.ini (see my post at #10 below)

    Regards
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2007
  3. foghorne

    foghorne Registered Member

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    That doesn't sound too clever does it :rolleyes:

    I guess I would revert to a Bart PE boot if I wanted to restore them in one step.

    F.
     
  4. thomasjk

    thomasjk Registered Member

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    They are clearly visible using TI from within windows to recover files. I haven't tried the boot cd.
     
  5. jmk94903

    jmk94903 Registered Member

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    If you did an IMAGE restore, the files would be restored since they are in the image. That's what you need to make your system bootable after replacing a hard drive or restoring the boot partition.

    If you want these files but do not want to restore the image, you can always explore the image on another computer and copy the files to a CD or floppy.

    If you want to be prepared for an unlikely event, you could copy those files to a CD now and have them sitting around when you might want them.
     
  6. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    Oh I agree but the question is what was Acronis' reason for omitting them when using the Files and Folders option from within the boot rescue environment o_O

    Regards
     
  7. thomasjk

    thomasjk Registered Member

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    Good question. I tried the boot cd and couldn't see them either. Does Linux not handle hidden files?
     
  8. jsolo

    jsolo Registered Member

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    If you consider this question outside the box, the answer will be quite apparent.

    Consider when you would actually restore an image instead of just the files. You would do so when your OS is so corrupted that the files cannot be restored, or perhaps windows is damaged in other ways - bad driver, registry corruption, etc. Point being is the system does not work.

    OTOH, consider when you'd just want to restore some files. Likely when you just need some data files, or a .ini or something else NOT operating system related.

    I think what acronis did is good and bad. They dumbed it down for the average user, while leaving those of us who know what we're doing to suffer. For the average user, there is likely never going to be a need to ever restore these files (ntldr, io.sys, etc..)

    The question does indeed remain then, why are these files even visible when the image file is explored using the windows version of acronis. That makes even less sense. Since these files are critical to windows booting, they shouldn't be touched, especially in windows.

    Clearly the logic acronis is using is illogical I think. The reasoning above is one such reason why perhaps.

    Acronis seems to have unusual logic in other areas too I think. Such as having the ability to see the cdr/dvdr drives in the bootable media, but NOT having the ability to save to them. If it can read from them, it can surely write to them (ghost 2003/8.3/11 (all dos based) have this functionality).
     
  9. mustang

    mustang Developer

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    This problem was discussed in this Forum some time ago. The answer is that all hidden files do not show up. You can prove it by removing the hidden attribute from a file before running the backup. Then the file will show up in the Linux mode.

    Acronis has not used any logic at all here to exclude certain files. This is simply one of the many problems they have not fixed.
     
  10. Menorcaman

    Menorcaman Retired Moderator

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    Thanks for the reminder Mustang. It was so long ago that I had forgotten all about this <previous thread> :p :blink:.

    The reason I reported above that my boot.ini is visible is that I had it's Hidden attribute unset (have just reset it to Hidden, re-imaged and tried again and, yes, it's disappeared). To save confusion I will therefore amend my Post #2 accordingly.

    Despite Acronis Support's statement on 2nd May of last year, the anomaly is still apparent in TI 9.0 Build 3854. Hoever, BillyDick doesn't say which Version he's using so can't say whether it's been fixed in TI 10.0 Home.

    By the way, excellent work you continue to do with your True Image Plug-In's :thumb: :thumb:

    Regards
     
  11. BillyDick

    BillyDick Registered Member

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    To answer Menorcaman's question; the version of TI that I'm using is 10 build 4.871.
    I do not follow the explanation about 'Hidden Files'.
    If I can see and access the files from Windows, then they should be visible and accessible from the Recovery Media.
    To circumvent a possibly disastrous situation if one the aforementioned files does disappear, I copied the three files to Drive D's root folder and plan to use Recovery Console to get them back, if needed.

    What bothers me is I shouldn't have to do this!!
     
  12. mustang

    mustang Developer

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    Menorcaman, thanks for the thumbs up. Isn't it interesting how Acronis handles problems like this. When a problem gets a certain amount of attention in this forum, they will promise to fix it in a future build. Unfortunately, most of the promised fixes never come. I remember back to when they first introduced a BartPE plugin for TI8. When it finally worked after a very rocky start and many complaints, I pointed out that much more functionality could be included. They promised to add more functionality at some "undecided time" in the future. All these years later the added functionality has never come. In all the versions of TI9 build 3854, their plugin doesn't even work because they forgot to include two necessary DLL's.

    BillyDick, you have hit on the easiest way to handle this problem. If you don't understand hidden files, it all started back with the fisrt versions of DOS. A file can have four attributes (read-only, system, hidden and archive). The first three are used to protect the file from being modified and/or deleted. The fact that you can see these files in Windows Explorer tells me you have modified the default settings under Folder Options\View to show hidden and system files. Presumably, you did this to gain more control over the operating system. If this is causing you concern, wait until you see Vista. Even the Administrator is locked out of portions of the system. There is actually a folder called "My Documents" that I can't get into. It begs the question of who's documents they are.
     
  13. BillyDick

    BillyDick Registered Member

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    Mustang;

    Thanks for the explanation of Attributes. I really do understand what they mean, I just didn't remember telling Explorer to show Hidden files.
    If I understand this anomaly, by using the ATTRIB DOS command to remove Read-Only, Hidden, System attributes of Boot-ini, NTDETECT.com and ntldr, I will then be able to see them from an Emergency Boot scenario?
    If so, is this a wise thing to do?
    Or, should I just leave it alone and go with my alternate plan of copying them from another drive?
     
  14. mustang

    mustang Developer

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    I see no problem with removing the Hidden attribute. I would not remove the System attribute.

    To do so from within Windows, open a command prompt and enter the following commands:

    cd \
    attrib -S -H boot.ini
    attrib +S boot.ini

    To varify enter:

    attrib boot.ini

    You should see S but not H. The A attribute is irrelavent here.

    To restore the H attribute, you will first need to remove the S attribute:

    attrib -S boot.ini
    attrib +S +H boot.ini

    Windows won't let you change the attributes of a hidden or system file. However, you are allowed to remove these attribute. Then you must add both S and H at the same time. The games we have to play.

    Removing the H attribute before you backup is probably your easiest way to be able to restore these files to a Windows system that won't boot. If you don't want to remove the H attribute, you could create a BartPE CD. Then you could easily copy these files into a non bootable Windows. You may also be able to copy in the files with the Windows Recovery Console. I must admit I don't know for sure as I've never used it. BartPE is infinitly more useful.

    EDIT: I wouldn't remove the R (read only) attribute from any of the files that have it. Boot.ini does not use the R attribute.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2007
  15. mfabien

    mfabien Registered Member

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    My CD Rescue disk does not allow seeing these hidden files but they are there because the CD boots the computer.

    Each of My Backups show these hidden files in spite of the Folder Option to hide these system files.

    BTW, before even getting TI 10, I copied the hidden files to a floppy and that opens up Windows seamlessly.
     
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