Basic/noob's questions before cloning Win8

Discussion in 'backup, imaging & disk mgmt' started by dogbite, Feb 15, 2015.

  1. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    I am getting a new laptop within a few days.
    It comes with Win8 Pro and it'a a Dell, but I think without any installation disk. I guess it will have a recovery partition.
    The first thing I want to do is to change the HDD to an SSD and move the HDD replacing the DVD, using a caddy.
    So, I need to reinstall Win8 on the SSD.
    It's the first time I am in it, I have some basic questions:

    1. When cloning the HDD (I think I am going to use AOMEI Backupper), should I clone it all, including Dell's recovery partition or just the Win8 system partition?

    2. Having created a system clone myself, do I still need a recovery partition? I think I can eventually restore my system from my own clone, but can you please confirm?

    3. After reinstalling Win8 I want to set-up Ubuntu in dual boot on SSD. I will use the HDD as a data partition, accessible by both OS. Should I consider something I am missing when reinstalling Win8?

    Thanks guys.
     
  2. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    dogbite,

    It will be a UEFI system so you should clone the entire drive. Maybe you could post a screenshot of Disk Management when the the laptop arrives as that will give us a better idea of what needs to be done.
     
  3. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Ok will do. Thanks much.
     
  4. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Brian, actually the PC booted up with Win7 Professional, which I prefer over Win8. I checked in BIOS and UEFI is not enabled.

    Anyway, here a screenshot of the Disk Management.
    Thanks again in advance for your support.
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    dogbite,

    That makes things easier.

    Firstly, what size is your SSD?

    Can you create an entire drive image of the HD to an external HD, as a safety net in case something goes wrong with the following.

    The Dell Recovery partition is 13 GB and you don't really want to lose 13 GB of space on your SSD if the partition isn't essential. You will be managing your own backup imaging. But the Dell Recovery partition is System, Active (typical Dell Win7 system). This means the partition contains the Win7 booting files and Win7 won't boot without the partition being present. So you will have to copy the booting files from the Dell Recovery partition to the Win7 partition before you can delete the Dell Recovery partition.

    Prior to installing the SSD I'd resize the Win7 partition so it will fit on the SSD and leave space for your future Ubuntu.

    Happy with this approach?
     
  6. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    SSD is 120GB so plenty of room.
    Actually I am more concerned than happy...:D I mean can you help me finding the booting files I need to copy to the Win7 partition?

    Maybe we have another option. With the laptop I have got the Windows installation disk, even if it's a Win8 Pro installation disk, Dell customized.

    Thanks again.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2015
  7. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Sure, I can help with all the steps.

    Would you like to install Win8 to the SSD using the Dell installation disk? If you don't like the result you can just delete the partition and clone the HD to the SSD as we discussed above.

    I like Win8. If you do install Win8 I suggest installing in MBR mode rather than UEFI mode. It makes management of your system easier.
     
  8. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    What brand/model is the SSD?
     
  9. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Well, I am more familiar with Win7 than Win8.
    For the moment I prefer to stick with 7, maybe in the future I can update to 8.

    If I do not care about the wasted space of the Recovery partition, would a full image of the current HDD work when copied to the SSD (I mean Recovery and OS after resizing)?
    When resizing the Win7 OS Partition, which size do you suggest to keep?

    Mind that for documents and data I am going to move the 500GB HDD to the DVD tray, so I do not face lack of storage.

    EDIT: SSD is a Crucial M550, 120GB.
     
  10. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    No problem. I misunderstood what you meant.

    Yes, it would.

    That depends on whether you keep the Recovery partition or not and how much space you intend to use for the Ubuntu partition.

    That's great.
     
  11. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    So that drive will have 111.79 GiB of space for partitions.

    Don't use these numbers but say...

    39 MiB for Diagnostic partition
    13 GiB for Recovery partition
    89 GiB for Win7 partition
    10 GiB for Ubuntu partition(s)

    These add to 112 GiB.
     
  12. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    I just noticed, if you want to have Ubuntu and the Swap partition in primary partitions you will have to delete the Recovery partition or the Diagnostic partition. You can only have 4 primary partitions.
     
  13. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Nothing against deleting the Recovery, but I do need some help how to move the booting files to the OS partition.
     
  14. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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  15. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Have you created an image backup of the 3 partitions?
     
  16. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Hi Brian, I just went through the link you gave me. It's pretty clear.
    I have basically to go all through Part 1 and then Part 3 (Deleting the Recovery Partition). Right?

    I did not create an image, yet. Lack of time.
    Maybe later today I can make it.
     
  17. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    Yes, copy/paste the lines to an Admin command prompt. Don't type.

    Don't delete the Recovery partition until you see Win7 as System, Active in Disk Management.
     
  18. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    First concern here: AOMEI does not let me clone the whole HDD without an internet connection. And for the moment I do not want this PC connected.
    It offers me to clone each individual partition. Basically I would have two steps:
    1. Cloning RECOVERY
    2. Cloning OS.

    It this going to work? (I mean, if something goes wrong, can I get my system back with two separate clones?)
    Thanks

    EDIT: I can also use another cloning software. It seems Macrium Reflect Free can do easily the job.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2015
  19. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Another problem: Windows does not let me shrink the OS partition below 200GB because of some "unremovable files".
    Shall I resize with Gparted live? I know how to do it, that's not a problem.
     
  20. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    Yes Gparted Live is the way to go.
     
  21. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    Brian, the swap partition of Ubuntu can be even logical, so no need to delete a primary one.
     
  22. oliverjia

    oliverjia Registered Member

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    Win 7 can do GPT partitioning scheme as well, which allow many more than 4 primary partitions.
     
  23. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    dogbite,

    Can you have Ubuntu and the swap partition as two logical volumes inside the extended partition?
     
  24. Brian K

    Brian K Imaging Specialist

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    oliverjia,

    The current Win7 is installed in MBR mode so you can't make the disk GPT. My old favourite BIBM could create up to 200 primary partitions on that HD by making it an EMBR disk.
     
  25. dogbite

    dogbite Registered Member

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    I think so, but maybe some Linux expert can confirm.

    From: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DualBoot/Partitions#Example_Partitioning_Scheme

    Example Partitioning Scheme
    On a system with a Recovery Partition but plenty of space and plenty of Ram, it makes sense to arrange the partitions something like this

    • sda1 Recovery Partition, unchanged
    • sda2 Windows partition, shrunk preferably from inside Windows, hopefully about 30Gb
    • sda3 Extended Partition at least 25Gb
      • sda5 Logical Partition, 10Gb, file-system = ext3, in the Partitioning Section of the installer change the "Mount Point" = /
      • sda6 Logical Partition, at least 10Gb, file-system = ext4 or to share with Windows as Ntfs, in the installer change the "Mount Point" = /home
      • sda7 Logical Partition, 10Gb, file-system = ext3, no Mount Point. This is an experimental area for trying other distros and installing a new release of Ubuntu before upgrading to it properly
      • sda8 Logical Partition, between ram & 2xRam, perhaps slightly over 2xRam, 'file-system' = "linux-swap".
    Notice the numbers 1 to 4 are reserved for Primary Partitions whereas Logical Partitions are numbered from 5 onwards.

    Tomorrow I am going to resize, copy booting files as Brian recommended and then image.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2015
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