After PRISM, still using Gmail/outlook??

Discussion in 'polls' started by dogbite, Sep 18, 2013.

?

Away from Gmail/Outlook after PRISM?

  1. Yes, 100%. I do not use any US giant's webmail any longer

    15 vote(s)
    16.9%
  2. I carry on using it

    56 vote(s)
    62.9%
  3. I keep using but not as main one

    18 vote(s)
    20.2%
  1. Pinga

    Pinga Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2006
    Posts:
    1,420
    Location:
    Europe
  2. SweX

    SweX Registered Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Posts:
    6,429
    Yeah yeah, we could all buy pigeons to solve this problem :D
     
  3. new2security

    new2security Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    517

    Haha true.

    In today's big-brother era, there isn't really much you can do to stay private. No matter what state-of-the-art technique used, in the end it all boils down to that you have to trust that someone /something. Even if the infrastructure and software part are covered, what about the hardware?
     
  4. mattdocs12345

    mattdocs12345 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2013
    Posts:
    1,892
    Location:
    US
    You can use old computer from 2002. After WTC and the patriot act, the domestic spying intensified. I would assume that anything up to 2004 would be pretty safe.
     
  5. guest

    guest Guest

    You can't be serious.
     
  6. chris1341

    chris1341 Guest

    If only my life was interesting enough for the intelligence agencies to care about ;) .

    Not changed anything because for years now I've made the assumption nothing I do on-line is private.

    My banks, my employer, my health records etc are all more accurate guides to my habits and lifestyle than my e-mail or surfing activity which is mostly functional and they've always had access to those so..........
     
  7. ams963

    ams963 Registered Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Posts:
    6,001
    Location:
    Parallel Universe
    @chris1341
    Just couldn't agree more.:thumb:
     
  8. mattdocs12345

    mattdocs12345 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2013
    Posts:
    1,892
    Location:
    US
    He asked me about hardware. Do you think 2004 is too late? Personally I wouldn't go with anything before 2000. But it's up to you if you are okay or not with running Windows 98 on 1997 desktop.
     
  9. Daveski17

    Daveski17 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Posts:
    9,779
    Location:
    Lloegyr
    Pigeons are no good ... there's nowhere to stick the modem. As to the OP, yes I still use Gmail. If MI5/GCHQ want me for anything I'm pretty sure using Gmail or not won't matter.
     
  10. guest

    guest Guest

    Sigh, no matter how I put it my response will have a high potential to be off-topic. What to do, what to do...?

    Well okay, surveillance has already been around for a very long time. Old hardware doesn't necessarily mean it will be safe, and vice versa. The thing is we need certain level of knowledge to spot oddities in our hardware. And besides, a lot of people treat new hardware as mandatory.

    Also, I don't think it's too late. I think it's trivial.
     
  11. new2security

    new2security Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Posts:
    517
    2004, it's Pentium 4 era, when machines were slow and also ran hot. Recently got rid of one box from that era, felt it was a good riddance. :) Privacy is good an all, but going back to sluggish machines and perhaps gain a pinch of extra privacy isn't an attractive option.
     
  12. MrBrian

    MrBrian Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2008
    Posts:
    6,032
    Location:
    USA
  13. SweX

    SweX Registered Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Posts:
    6,429
    Haha that's true :D
     
  14. Daveski17

    Daveski17 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Posts:
    9,779
    Location:
    Lloegyr
    Well, I'm pretty sure there's nowhere. ;)
     
  15. luciddream

    luciddream Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2007
    Posts:
    2,545
    I'm not a fan of the rationale that you just consider it hopeless and so don't even try to obtain privacy. You should at the very least try to make their job more difficult even if they can get to it in the end. The more hoops they have to jump through, and the more people in the world that employ these methods, the less likely they are to be able to sift through it all.

    Also not a fan of the rationale that if you don't have anything to hide you just roll over and give in. It's a matter of principle... of being entitled to your privacy. Give that freedom away and the next day they ~Possibly offensive phrase removed~ with another piece of the Constitution. There's a bigger picture there. If more people cared we wouldn't be in this situation in the first place.

    You don't have to live under a rock to obtain a modicum of privacy. The phone I have can call and text people, and that's good enough for me. It has no GPS, no tracking, no plan, no personally identifiable info. linked to it. I have no devices that do. Have a Zune too to listen to my music, and my handy hoodie buddies to do it with. Hardly primitive.

    And have nested VPN's in a VM on one box just because... even though I'm not doing anything shady. Even if all I'm doing is watching Youtube videos of cooking shows... I do it just because I feel that while doing so it's nobody's business but my own. Same as if I want to draw my blinds.

    As for webmail... I've been using Vmail with Roundcube for awhile now. I trusted it back when many didn't, and still do. Roundcube is open source and implementing PGP. And Vmail is very privacy friendly. They're still pretty new, once PGP is implemented and the kinks are worked out I'll migrate to them exclusively. I've been using Thunderbird for a long time.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2014
  16. Daveski17

    Daveski17 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Posts:
    9,779
    Location:
    Lloegyr
    That's OK, we don't have a constitution anyway.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2014
  17. chris1341

    chris1341 Guest

    I don't have anything on-line or in e-mail etc that you can't find out from a number of other sources. I'm not rolling over and giving in either, just realistic but you're right it's about principle.

    You have an expectation of privacy of on-line activity I've never shared. In principle we have a different perception of what can be achieved.

    Do I agree it is right for governments to have access to every aspect of my life? No I don't. Neither do I agree it's right for every action I take on-line to be tracked via dozens (sometimes hundreds) of scripts and cookies dropped everywhere across the average browser session so I can be commercially targeted but, hey it's what happens.

    The biggest challenge to what governments do came through the PRISM revalations. People now know nothing is private on-line. Did it bring down governments? Will it influence how the vast majority of people vote? Has it seen a massive shift away from the web-mail services and up-take of VPN from more liberal coutries?

    I think you'll find the answer is no to all because the majority of people don't care. The fact some put enough of their private lives on Facebook to make them easy targets for identity fraud and open aspcts of their lives up to marketing junk voluntarily must mean they have no expectation of privacy.

    My view is do what you can. Protect youself from theives stealing information that will result in financial or reputational loss to you and your family and accept it is not possible to obtain absolute privacy in a digital world.

    I use the same principles I'd apply to securing my home. Good locks, windows and doors. A good alarm system and keep the gardens well lit. That is done in the hope it puts the casual/opportunist burglars off but I know the determined will get in if they target me specifically. That is mitigated by the knowledge I have nothing worth targeting. If I did the precaution level would be higher.

    For on-line security make sure you use decent protection software, avoid the dark side and don't keep anything you don't want others to see on you're hard drives. Again a determined attacker could get in but the question why they'd want to remains.

    Someone wants to attack me outside my home none of the precautions I've taken to protect my home will help me. Similarly all the precautions I take to secure privacy on-line don't help me when banks, employers, companies I transact with, ISPs, security vendors, VPN providers even are subject to disclosure rules that would expose my life to authorities anyway.

    Also I'm from the UK and we don't have a constitution that is inviolate. I understand that it is sacred to many Americans and anything that goes against it's principles is staunchly opposed. You are supposed to have series of checks and balances that protect you from governments.

    We don't. We have a series of laws, some from antiquity, and a legal system that provides for our civil liberties. Laws are amended to suit the requirements of the time. They are passed by parliament and becuase of our first past the post version of democracy end up being built based on the requirements of the biggest party, currently the Conservatives (for our sins) but all major parties are aligned on this.

    What we share though is that the only way to change views on this is for voters to let politicians know it is not acceptable by withdrawing their vote. Post PRISM there is no move towards this. Why?, because it's not top priority for most, therefore it won't change. Democracy at work.

    Realism not defeatism.

    Regards
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2014
  18. Dave0291

    Dave0291 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2013
    Posts:
    553
    Location:
    U.S
    Yeah, I still use Gmail. If anyone fights back against NSA spying and actually is at success at making it more difficult, it's going to be Google. Does that mean I'm comfortable with letting Google siphon my data for their company profit? Absolutely not. However, other alternatives will do the same thing and MS tends to not be very open about their policies. There is no practical..and I do mean practical, very different from impossible..way to avoid someone gathering and/or making a profit off your data. If Google and the NSA won't do it, your ISP will. If they don't do it, any number of the services you sign up for whether online or off, will do it. At some point in time, you're gonna dance with the devil. Just do what you can to not get burned too badly.
     
  19. safeguy

    safeguy Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Posts:
    1,794
    I still use both although I have a preference for Outlook's layout over Gmail. I would state 3 reasons.

    1. Convenience. Pretty much accessible across various OS platforms and devices.

    2. Common use. People I know and exchange mails with use either one (or both) of these services. It is almost like a de facto standard regardless of whether I agree with it or not.

    3. Long-term sustainability. It's Microsoft and Google we're talking about here so I don't really have to explain, do I?

    As for Prism, if I was
    a lawyer, doctor, journalist or activist, my risk levels would be much higher and warrant an urgent need to use more private/anonymous means and services. Right now, I choose to put convenience and practical needs over my privacy concerns. I am more of a pragmatist than an idealist.
     
  20. nimd4

    nimd4 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2006
    Posts:
    23
    Location:
    Belgrade
    Hotmail was the first provider that I had gotten, almost a couple of decades ago now.. So, unfortunately, I still have it; though I try not to use it (at least not 4 anything important :))

    Also I thought that tormail.org/ was gone, but apparently it's back:
    Code:
    http://reason.com/blog/2014/01/28/fbi-incidentally-seized-entire-tormail-e
    ^ still have my main email, from the looks of it..

    P.S.
    Using the Tor Browser Bundle @
    Code:
    https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser.html.en
    Edit: Oh, yea! Yahoo! closed down my *main* business email address, some months ago, citing "TOS violation" and I've been unsuccessful in getting a reply from them, trying to find a resolution for the fact that Yahoo! threw my life away.. but, wasn't able to get any other reply back - other than a few generic replies, about how I "violated" the Terms (what does that even mean, violated, lol) and how it's over.

    (Used that address for many years, for business and personal mail; had many, many contacts there - previous bosses, colleagues, etc. All gone, forever)

    .. Not to mention, how one can't contact them directly - to get any kind of support - but, have to go through various online forms; where it's hardly possible to include previous correspondence. Terrible, it's been a horribly bad experience: let it be a warning, for anyone wanting to join Yahoo! Meh

    P.P.S.
    I've saved all of the letters && their replies, btw.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2014
  21. Saint Satin Stain

    Saint Satin Stain Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2004
    Posts:
    222
    Location:
    Huntsville, AL and Greenwich Village, NYC
    I have never used Google as my main email; I have 14 email addresses, each one for different purpose or interest. My main is with my ISP.
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.