a² and Gladiator ... my thoughts

Discussion in 'other anti-trojan software' started by rodzilla, Oct 25, 2003.

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  1. rodzilla

    rodzilla Registered Member

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    Three Buddhist monks contemplated a Crown of Thorns starfish stranded in a rock pool.

    "What would the Lord Buddha wish me to do with this starfish ?" asked the oldest of the three.

    The youngest monk replied, "Master, this type of starfish eats live coral. If it is destined to die today and you return it to the sea then you will have interfered with its life cycle and the life cycle of the coral."

    The second monk, older and wiser, replied, "Master, if the starfish's destiny is not to die today and you return it to the sea then you will have become one with its life cycle and the life cycle of the coral."

    The oldest and wisest monk said, "The Lord Buddha has made me arbiter of the fates of the starfish and the coral. Whatever action I take decides their destiny." He then picked up the starfish and crushed it to death.

    =====

    Not too long ago Andreas and Michael were worshipped in the security forums as The New Messiahs.

    Now some of their former worshippers regard them as Spawns of Satan.

    How the mighty have fallen!

    Over the past fifteen years, a few "one man band" programmers wrote antivirus programs which became household names ... TBAV, F-Prot, KAV, and NOD32, for example. Many other promising "one man band" antivirus programs faded into obscurity ... their programmers' hopes and dreams shattered by the harsh reality of the business world ... their best intentions overwhelmed by the need to survive and to feed and house and clothe themselves and their families. Most of those programmers sold their skills to an established antivirus vendor.

    Some of you made donations to support Andreas' and Michael's projects. Your donations helped keep them alive for a while, but obviously there were not enough donations to keep them alive forever. Now you think they've "abandoned" you, and you feel they owe you an explanation. Perhaps they do ... but slagging them off won't encourage them to give you one. Try wearing their shoes. Would you want to face an angry crowd of former friends who seem determined to stone you to death ?

    Unlike the stranded starfish, a man is substantially the arbiter of his own fate ... a fate decided by the choices he makes during his lifetime. Andreas and Michael would have found it ego-shattering to give up their dreams and go to work for someone else, but life is filled with difficult choices. I'm sure they both think they chose the right path, and I wish them both success.
     
  2. Andreas Haak

    Andreas Haak Guest

    >... their best intentions overwhelmed by the need to survive and to feed and house and
    >clothe themselves and their families. Most of those programmers sold their skills to an
    >established antivirus vendor.

    Well this might be right but you forgot an important thing:
    I don't need a² to get money to pay my monthly costs.


    >Some of you made donations to support Andreas' and Michael's projects.

    Nobody donated money - just to clarify this.

    >donations to keep them alive forever. Now you think they've "abandoned" you, and you
    >feel they owe you an explanation. Perhaps they do ... but slagging them off won't
    >encourage

    Well ... perhaps someone can not give an explanation? Perhaps he wasn't online cause he was ill? Ever thought about that?
     
  3. rodzilla

    rodzilla Registered Member

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    Re:a² and Gladiator ... second thoughts

    > Well this might be right but you forgot an important thing: I don't need a² to get money to pay my monthly costs.

    Ah ... a fellow eccentric millionaire. :eek:

    >> Some of you made donations to support Andreas' and Michael's projects.

    > Nobody donated money - just to clarify this.

    I stand corrected. I hadn't delved deeply enough into the mountain of bullshit surrounding the demise of a² and GAV, and I assumed from all the venom-spitting in the forums that a² must have also been donationware.

    People who voluntarily donated a few dollars to support the Gladiator project may have some slight justification for feeling that they've been let down without an explanation, but the fact that a² was 100% free puts it in a different light.

    > Well ... perhaps someone can not give an explanation? Perhaps he wasn't online cause he was ill? Ever thought about that?

    Actually, I did. There's that and a million other reasons for you not being online ... and a million more for remaining silent even if you were. You could have been run over by a bus. Your computer could have been stolen. You could have been trampled by a herd of stampeding wildebeeste. After looking at the mood of the angry mob, you could have simply thought (as I have sometimes thought) "Bugger it!" Instituting or participating in a hate campaign over such a triviality is, in my opinion, a waste of energy and emotion.

    As I said in my original post, "Try wearing their shoes." Unless one has all the facts and a vast understanding of human behavior, one cannot pass judgement on you unless he or she has been you ... and the same applies to Michael.
     
  4. Andreas Haak

    Andreas Haak Guest

    Re:a² and Gladiator ... second thoughts

    >Ah ... a fellow eccentric millionaire. :eek:

    No ... not really ;). But I have enough every month to live :).

    >venom-spitting in the forums that a² must have also been donationware.

    No, a² free is freeware and a² personal/professional is normal shareware. But until now nobody give any money (and in fact I won't accept any order until its released).

    Well and to give a little "explanation":

    I had a pneumonia and wasn't online for a long time. You can ask John oder Magnus if you want. If I was online than just for a few minutes to reply support mails for YAW.

    Last week I started my new job at ESET (with an delay of 2 weeks cause of the pneumonia). Christian and I reconsidered a² free - especially its GUI and basic functions. I finished the changes this week but until now Christian didn't give its "ok". First part of the week he was on the Systems and the later part I was in Bratislava.

    So until now no time for any conversation.
     
  5. AAP

    AAP Registered Member

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    Hello,Andreas Haak

    Well first thing glad to hear you are not ill
    & that all is going great with the new job
    now i will check back again to see if your new
    program is out as for the free Ver or pay Ver

    i have no problem at all paying for it i would
    just like to have a look at it & see what it is
    all about just as i do all the software i pay for
    now is it something like what LWM helped me
    with TTT3 which is one of the best progs i have
    paid for thanks again LWM

    well that said you have a good weekend
    & that gos for all of you

    Good luck :D

    Hey,Paul
     
  6. xor

    xor Guest

    First at all thanks to Rodzilla for the nice words.

    Since one month i have finally my own home. Remember, i am almost a half year now here. There was no chance to
    get a home for rent here. Terrible. I did have _NOTHING_ during this time - not even a normal telephone. I was
    all the time moving - from one hotel to another - last time i did live in a very small room from an co-worker.
    Frustrating. Really. Then i had a room and a new co-worker (Stefan Kurzhals, former author of FWIN/32 - a very
    good Macro Virus Scanner and a good friend of me) did come to our company. I gave him my room - even in this
    time i would have need this room. To help him. That he has not the same trouble as me with monthly waiting for
    a home because i had a new offer for a home for me and my wife. So can anybody please explain to me HTF i should
    have a clear head for a freewareprogram and it's users if i did not even know where i sleep the next night ?
    Just for info - we are 3 persons my wife, son and me. Can you imagine how it feels if you dont know where you sleep
    the next night ? This may be funny if you are alone - but not with a child. So instand of looking for a home and
    other things which are important for life (i mean here not a internet connection...) i should walk around online
    and contribute the ex gav members ? Do they care how i life and if i have a bed for the family ? Nope.
    I could also say i did waste my time (over one year) with a full time development of a freeware program. I could,
    but i dont. These donations was not even enough to life (only food) for one single person. Around $3000 in a full year
    donations. Dividide it with 12 and you know my monthly "salary" for helping other people. Not even a prunk would go work
    for this. And speaking about development in the free time beside a normal job of an Antivirus Program (with worms
    and viruses beside Trojans and Backdoors) is in plain words *impossible*. I did sleep around 3 or 4 hours maximum per
    day during my GAV development - otherwise it would not even be so "successful". It was not only development time, it was
    also support time to helping various people over ICQ with removing malware. I got a "thanks" for this and it was enough
    for me. Think about this.

    And to be honest - i would not even waste one moment to think about an other freeware project. Not because of money.
    Build your own mind.

    But it is nice to see that some of the contributors still following me. Some of them i did meet in our company forum.
    Instand of crying around they help me to betatest some modules. And we are having fun like in old times. Way to go...
     
  7. illukka

    illukka Spyware Fighter

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    way to go mate ;)

    i didn't know you had a son... that makes your decision even more understandable( i'm a father of a 7 week old son)

    cheers

    illukka
     
  8. Well, Michael.. I had no idea it was THAT bad for you... I guess it's tough being in the AV business... You were on the verge of releasing and selling GAV to the public.. I think some folks were looking forward to that.. If HBDev is going to get the brunt of your knowledge, that's both good and bad... Good becasue we as users benefit.. Bad because you lose your intelectual property... On the other hand, through others I've been hearing that ANtiVir is becoming a great proggie.. The American Version is Vexira... I never liked that one, maybe now though, it will be a contender... Your handling of unpackers was your unique point.. Very nice...

    Very well, I agree, and I apologize. On the other hand I didn't know.. and I'm sure others here didn't too... I think you know as well as I do that their was a lot of hostility on IM's and ICQ though, (to which I took NO part of...) about what happened with Trojan Hunter.. I'm glad you openned up and are now telling us what's going on... Your critics are human beings with hearts too..

    I do now because I know now.. I didn't know before.. Frankly, I didn't know you were married and with a kid... I at least hope you are making a decent pay...No sarcasm intended...

    Well, you did get a job because of your GAV project, or at least, it helped..

    All successful folks made drastic changes and some suffered in their pursuit of success.. Sounds liek you're a regular "AV Thomas Edison...". You benefited too... ;)

    I don't have a great love for freeware, except for Kolla's Spybot S&D and Javacool's stuff.. BUT I did say I'd buy them if they became shareware..

    Great!... However, at this time, I not going to HBDev or Vexira.. I'm not saying they are not good.. I just don't wanna..

    Like I said before, I don't think they are "Crying' about GAV.. I think they were upset with the TH deal.. You started that one...
     
  9. Pretender

    Pretender Registered Member

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    Peace to all! Lack of communication sometimes leads us to speculation..........I am guilty..............and will help if you need or want it.
     
  10. the Tester

    the Tester Registered Member

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    To Michael and Andreas.

    Sometimes it's too easy to link a name with a program and forget about the human element.
    You have basic needs like a place to live or maybe a family to support.Health too.

    I don't have it in myself to judge either of you.
    I have no idea what it's like to develop a program, then make it available and support it.

    All I will say,is that I hope both of you have success,good health, and happiness.

    Take Care.
     
  11. Mr.Blaze

    Mr.Blaze The Newbie Welcome Wagon

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    :mad: what the mofo you all smokeing

    first off no one had probs with the program or why hey left

    :mad: we had probs with the no real explenation run alway or hide or ignore you attitude

    lucky my foot ony a 9 cause this deserves a 12 size shoe right up there

    its not like people didnt understand the hey guys im starve to death if i dont hook up with a JOB

    its the the straight up abandoment i owe you no explation i had a prob with

    you think i want to see either mike or andreas siting behind a kentucky fryed chicken dumpster diveing saying ohhh theres still some meat on the bone.

    its the f -u laters thing that bugs me

    iTS NOT LIKE THERE BAD GUYS BUT ID WOULD Leave it at this nice to see them back but trust is perty much urnd to ash

    and the sad thing was all it would had taken is in f'ing sorry

    i f -up or hey this the situation sorry

    not weeks later get an explenation by a third party that just jacked up

    i hope you guys are well with full belly nice woman and are geting payed well

    but if this turn out for another resume threw a well renound security bord then :mad: wrath of the wooden spoon well fall on you

    well at least at my mr.blaze blog website :D lol lol lol lol lol lol

    here at wilders all il do is this :rolleyes:

    still i had to put my 2 cents in as every one else was had to get some of it off my chest i feel better
     
  12. bellgamin

    bellgamin Very Frequent Poster

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    I am glad to see some forgiveness on the part of SS. He is one of my favorite posters over at DSLR & I was sincerely dismayed by his previous anger toward Michael.

    Forgiveness is important for everyone. It is done, not so much for the benefit of the person forgiven, as for the benefit of the person who does the forgiving.

    I myself am benefitting greatly by the new and vibrantly re-born antivirus program known as AntiVir PE. The program is rock steady on my Win ME. The scanner is fast. The updater is amazingly well designed -- reveals everything about what is going on during an update. AVPE has a VERY small footprint. The scanning engine is being modified often -- I have no doubt that those changes are progressively for the better. I am very eager to see the next test of AVPE by such outfits as www.virus.gr &/or www. rokop-security.de.

    Hey, Michael -- I'm glad you now have time to "smell the roses" & enjoy your kid's childhood. When you are old one day, & look back at your life, you may have a few regrets [we all do] but I doubt that even one single regret will be that you failed to spend more time in the office or in front of a computer working on Gladiator.

    Live long & prosper.....bell
     
  13. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    Thanks Michael and Andreas for the personal touch in the explanations. They make us convinced of you both being human beings with all that can happen in life.
    Very glad circumstances are bettering a lot for both of you.
    And thanks to Rodzilla for the beautiful setting in the start of the thread.
    Heya Rod, Andreas a collegue for the same company, who'd ever thought that?!
    And daddy(s) make sure those kids know everything from the computer and serious security at their first tries, wizzkids as they are! :D
    Again, wish you all good luck and for sure we'll hear from you!
     
  14. Wayne - DiamondCS

    Wayne - DiamondCS Security Expert

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    Andreas has no time for a²

    Might as well close any threads relating to a², Andreas no time for it, as he is spending all his spare time trying to find ways to attack our software so it doesn't seem he has the slightest interest in spending his time developing a². Can't blame him though, it's a lot easier to attack software than develop something unique.
     
  15. Andreas Haak

    Andreas Haak Guest

    And again ...

    Working 8 hours for ESET a day, 8 hours on a² and 8 hours free time. Testing products is done in my free time.

    Mentioned it several times before. But well ... Its very difficult to read such tiny letters if someone sits on such a high horse ;).
     
  16. AAP

    AAP Registered Member

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    God this is gething sad big time
     
  17. Yup... You're right...
    I hope this doesn't turn into another "Andreas and Wayne "pissing contest" thread.. LOL...
     
  18. 8 hours free time? How dare you?

    LOL... Just kidding...
     
  19. Gavin - DiamondCS

    Gavin - DiamondCS Former DCS Moderator

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    We have no free time ;)

    Ok 8 seconds to type this :D
     
  20. Andreas Haak

    Andreas Haak Guest

    And a few hours a day to eat and to sleep. To go to the doctor, buying food, meeting friends etc. ... .
     
  21. illukka

    illukka Spyware Fighter

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    and feed the dog... lol

    next time don't feed him your hand :D
     
  22. Andreas Haak

    Andreas Haak Guest

    In Austria (and some other europe countries) every dog that bites a human has to do a behavior test. Gismo failed this test. As a consequence he had to be euthanised :(.
     
  23. illukka

    illukka Spyware Fighter

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    well sorry to hear that :eek:
    not in my country.. if dog bites strangers then yes.. but finnish dogs can bite their owner without fear..
     
  24. Primrose

    Primrose Registered Member

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    Which brings to mind......

    **********************
    God is sitting in heaven when a programmer prays to Him.

    God, we don't need you anymore. Programming has finally figured out a way to even create life out of nothing - in other words, we can now do what you did in the beginning."

    "Well, that's very interesting...show Me", replies God.

    So the programmer bends down and starts to mold some dirt into the shape of a man.

    "No, no, no..." interrupts God, "Get your own dirt."
    ******************
    This has been a very inspiring thread.


    ;)
     
  25. Pretender

    Pretender Registered Member

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    Anreas,

    I appreciate your hardships. What is the prognosis for a squared at this time? Wishing you well!
     
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