How I found Wilder's and why it should be proud

Discussion in 'Forum Related Discussions' started by Galcoolest, Nov 18, 2004.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Primrose

    Primrose Registered Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2002
    Posts:
    2,743
    Well don't let him get to you :D We do not want Alison to get hit in the crossfire.

    Hugs Gal..hope ya make it back home real soon ;)
     
  2. ronjor

    ronjor Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2003
    Posts:
    163,072
    Location:
    Texas
    Galcoolest

    One thing you can do here is add someone to your ignore list. Click on the username and a control panel will open allowing you to not see any posts by the person you want to ignore.
     
  3. suebaby41

    suebaby41 Registered Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2004
    Posts:
    17
    I am not getting into the "arguement". I just want to say how much I appreciate Wilders Security Forums.

    When I need information, I query by the information I am seeking. That is how I came to Wilders Security Forums. The search listed Wilders Security Forum as one source for the answer. I am careful to check if the person answering my question is experienced, but I also check out how others have resolved the issue. I enjoy the discussion.

    Thank you very much Wilders Security Forums.
    :-*
     
  4. RobZee

    RobZee Registered Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2004
    Posts:
    290
    Location:
    Texas
    Under the proviso of "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread...", I feel compelled to make a few personal obervations without any rancor or ill will intended in any way.

    As you can see, I am a newbie to this forum (and actually to any forum). However, I enjoy surfing a number of them for both assistance in specific situations and knowledge in general. I must say that WSF is absolutely my favorite for both the technical expertise it offers and the general exchanges that I just watch from the sidelines. I have learned a great deal in a short time at my layman's level in the security area, although I consider myself a fairly literate computer user on a home and small business basis.

    Having said all that in a rather verbose fashion, I have been following this thread and several others with some of the same participants. Out of curiosity I then read all the posts that still_longhorn has made in WLF. In a number of these SL has provided and received info and a number of others where SL's posts definitely have an acerbic, if not caustic tone. I can see why the Administrators have felt it necessary to become involved in some of them. However (and this is the other side of the coin), it seems he draws the ire of a number of the repected members who all express it in the threads. Understandably it seems SL has managed to establish himself as a "lightening rod" with his posts, although some new ideas were also brought to life when Benjamin Franklin flew his kite in a storm.

    I have not tried to rile anyone, although as a newbiew I'm sure I didn't fully appreciate the nuances in some of the posts. WSF is without a doubt my favorite forum and I respect all the members and appreciate all aspects of it (yes SL, even Ten Forward). I guess it's time for me to head for the sidelines for a while. Best regards to all!
     
  5. Pollmaster

    Pollmaster Guest

    I agree with Galcoolest

    Personally I think SL is expecting more from this forum than what it is designed for. Is he expecting a forum full of security pros rather than merely educated laypersons?

    This might explains the impatience he exhibits when dealing with people with clearly less knowledge. On the other hand, the way some people are acting (high and mighty as if they were pros) coupled with their clearly superficial knowledge of computers, makes it very tempting to mock them :)

    I repeat, from my POV, I see this as a place primarily for homeusers to learn the basics of how to protect themselves.

    Occasionally fairly technical discussions occur, but usually only when vendors get involved in a war of words or in rare occasions when a guru decides to give a lecture.

    Most people who stay here learn quite a bit and quickly reach a plateua beyond which they have no incentive to go further, since that would require serious study of networking,operating systems, APIs and programming of course.

    That's okay really. The rest who catch the "Security bug" , probably move on to more advanced mailing lists or "underground sites" (all of which is against the TOS to link to).

    One must however guard against the temptation to think that just being a member on wilders will eventually makes you a security expert or pro, sine wilders is basically a wading pool at best.

    Conversely, one must realise that many people who are not wilders members, are on par if not more knowledgable than the typical senior member here, so the odd newcomer or guest who posts shouldn't be treated with disdain (on the assumption that they know nothing) or suspicion (when they exhibit knowledge).

    I learnt this lesson recently, when one member accused me of being a hacker because of my "terminology"... Hee Hee . I suppose if i had a wilders senior member title, than he wouldnt be suspicious?

    The irony is the member who accused me, himself, posted a week back asking for sites to learn about "white hat hacking" . I just got a message from him, where he warned me that he would keep and eye on me to protect the other members of this forum.

    Sigh...
     
  6. Pollmaster

    Pollmaster Guest

    SL,

    While I agree with a lot of your points, I think you dont have to mock the forum too much. Except for those with delusions of grandeur, we know that most people here are not security experts. Even a lowly CISSP holder would be a security expert here :)

    And for the rest of you, let's not get too defensive, correct me if I'm wrong but isnt this site is geared to help beginners? If so, you certainly wouldn't expect too many security experts here.

    That's not to say there are not people of true experise here of course. But the ordinary member certainly isn't an expert.
     
  7. Primrose

    Primrose Registered Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2002
    Posts:
    2,743
    I consider the flavor of this thread with Long's shift to the input just an attempt to study the Effect of White Noise, Irrelevant Speech and Gender on Intellectual Performance..it is fun to participate when you know the ground rules.
     
  8. ssgtmax

    ssgtmax Registered Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2004
    Posts:
    385
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    How'd I find Wilder's? Total accident. Tripped over it like a tree root in the dark. Glad I did. I've enjoyed this place ever since. I'm just a guy whose computer got totally boogered up with junk last year and who was searching for answers. Voila! Wilder's....

    Not being a computer "techie-type", I mostly kibbitz here, picking up tips & hints from the various categories. I also appreciate the Update Alerts. And, of course, I do chime in @ Ten Forward now & then, whenever the subject matter strikes my fancy. There seem to be a lot of bright, pleasant folks here @ WSF. I enjoy their experience, expertise & wit.

    Last add: If you respond to a poster spoiling for a fight :mad: , you only encourage
    more rants designed to bait you. The "thrill" for him is in the fight, not in the free exchange of knowledge, thoughts & ideas. Somebody (Ronjor, I think?) mentioned that we are all able to put such posters in the Ignore :blink: box where they belong. See....lots of good ideas here! ;)
     
  9. Pollmaster

    Pollmaster Guest

    Wow, that's the longest description of the word "trolling" I have ever seen. That's what you are implying no?
     
  10. LowWaterMark

    LowWaterMark Administrator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2002
    Posts:
    18,278
    Location:
    New England
    Indeed, expectation plays a big part in any assessment of Wilders. If you thought Wilders was a place where Network Engineers, Webmasters and DBAs hangout to discuss the latest information in their respective fields, then certainly you will assess Wilders very poorly. Clearly, this isn't that type of security forum and it never claimed to be. We don't have discussions among webmasters regarding the latest exploits in Apache. DBAs don't come here to debate the most efficient tablespace layouts based upon available disk arrays. Network engineers are not designing redundant networks here either.

    I've never tried to put the forum's purpose or target audience into words before, but I guess the people who've mentioned "home computer users" have it about right. Here you can ask questions about configuring your software firewall on a Windows OS, receive input on the differences between various AV or AT products, visit the product specific forums for help on those applications, or ask general "How do I do this?" questions regarding your Windows PC.

    While there are those among us who are from the IT industry, most regulars here are not. Paul and I both have technical backgrounds, but frankly management offered more opportunities (at least for me) so my last hands on work was more then 11 years ago on DEC VAX and Alpha systems.

    I notice some people are still concerned about the title progression on normal member IDs. Yes, it is entirely based upon number of posts made, and is not any type of assessment of knowledge. I explained that over here recently.

    As to those who carry titles with the orange colored member IDs, well, I wouldn't go making any quick assumptions about what they know. Most are either developers, specific product or subject matter experts, or those who run their own security websites or forums. Generally they pick and choose what topics they get involved with on an in-depth level, usually based upon how interesting the question and how much time they have at that moment.

    We do have some topics with a good depth of technical insight from time to time as mentioned above, usually when some new malware is being discussed, or regarding the scanning properties of some application and so forth. But, for the most part Wilders is a direct end-user support forum, providing specific product support or general Windows support. Most people asking the questions are home computer users, not IT people, nor asking from the perspective of a company IT department's concerns.

    Wilders fills a specific need for a certain user base. It's a place to learn the basics and to discuss some higher level topics at times, along with relaxing and amusing yourself in the more socially based threads. If anyone is looking for more, then there are certainly other forums out there, some of which will be very focused on the desired topics - such as in-depth discussions of the latest Bugtraq alerts.
     
  11. Primrose

    Primrose Registered Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2002
    Posts:
    2,743
    Not really..I have long thought SL was doing a blind study here at Wilders that has nothing to do with Security..but rather the study of the Community itself.
     
  12. MikeBCda

    MikeBCda Registered Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2004
    Posts:
    1,627
    Location:
    southern Ont. Canada
    I've kept my two cents (Cdn) out of this so far, but ...

    I first came to Wilders because it's the tech-support site for Javacool's stuff, and found a lot of other goodies and other useful info here. There was a time, back in DOS days (and a few years with CP/M before that), when I was considered a wiz, but ever since newer versions of Win became the OS rather than operating under DOS as in the 3.1 days, these days I consider myself just one more point-and-click-and-pray user. And as has been pointed out at least a couple of times in this thread, users is what Wilders is all about.

    I'm fairly active over at the avast! forums too (started out same as here, support for my software), less active elsewhere except for my medical-support groups. And I regularly recommend both places to "outsiders" for two reasons: (1) regular forum participants range from professionals down to folks who got their first-ever computer last Christmas, and just about every level of experience and expertise in between. And (2) with extremely rare exceptions, responses to requests for assistance are usually fairly quick, plus anything that's only a best-guess is usually honestly identified as such.
     
  13. still_longhorn

    still_longhorn Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2004
    Posts:
    256
    My sentiments exactly. And perhaps I should have mocked individuals... so the mockery would be person-specific rather than the indictment of a whole community.
    . That makes me a well-fed troll, doesn't it?
    Sayang! Could have been more. Should have been more... In your country, you call it a cop-out, don't you? You fail by default IMO. Metallica (Peter?) must be someone at cexx.org... and he can tell you that the Spyware Help (HJT) forum there is practically run by only two (2) volunteers: yokenny and submit2s. Yet, there is practically no backlog. You have a membership base of 25,000 and you will find it messy. But of course. But it is the most relevant thing for a "security forum" to do today.

    And this is where I get riled up. (I do peep in on quite a number of Boards.) I can practically feel the tears of the "malware" victims who post at the Yahoo Anti-spy Community BBS, begging for help. People there want to help but the BBS is simply not set up for it. The people who post there are perhaps 2 or more notches below the user base referred to by LWM in terms of computer savvy. Most of those who try to help out are transient and not too many notches up the food chain either. But by God! They are trying to help the victims. You don't want to be an honest to goodness security forum. Nor do you want to dirty your hands in this war against malware. You simply want to to discuss the trends and post the occassional "Nice Post LWM! Interesting link there." Of course I can hear your reactions as "This does not concern us!". True enough! But you are a community, an organization of the internet. Where you could have been a critical organ, you chose to be GC's beautiful blue eyes. Well, let me tell you that "No organ survives the body it is in!"
    Really now! Most of you don't like my posts but ignoring them is not an option for various reasons:
    1. I'm the best fed troll in the internet LOL :D
    2. My posts, though controversial, are interesting
    3. A great number of you would love to see me put my foot in my mouth (Don't hold you breathe for too long)
    4. The logic is pretty good;
    5. Some of you have made it a habit to read my posts LOL (Looking for flaws in this arrogant bastard's posts)
    6. No polystyrene posts from me... WYSIWYG!

    Abhor? Yes! Ignore? ROFLOL.... You're kidding Ronjor... right? LOL
     
  14. wildman

    wildman Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Posts:
    2,185
    Location:
    Home on the range.
    :mad: SL: Just how egotistical can you get? Your head must be a size off the scale. How long have you been associated with computers? Myself over (30) thirty years, and I still don't profess to be an expert, because they are always evolving. I am smart enough to garner knowledge where ever and in what ever amounts it is presented. Are you?

    Wildman
    :mad: :mad: :mad:



    Wildman
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2004
  15. snowbound

    snowbound Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2003
    Posts:
    8,723
    Location:
    The Big Smoke
    ~sigh~

    and around and around we go....

    Now, what was the topic of this thread?

    How I found Wilder's and why it should be proud

    Please people, stick to it....



    snowbound
     
  16. Acadia

    Acadia Registered Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2002
    Posts:
    4,325
    Location:
    US
    It's really quite simple: Wilders has helped me ... PERIOD! (And any outfit that can help this idiot has GOT to be good) :cool:

    Acadia
     
  17. still_longhorn

    still_longhorn Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2004
    Posts:
    256
    It is! And I use it mostly to get reactions... Hey! Please put me in your Ignore list... LOL

    Mod... Wildman's getting personal.... LOL But I can't put him in my Ignore list. What should I do?

    Kinda hard to make me cross the line, no? I won't....
     
  18. still_longhorn

    still_longhorn Registered Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2004
    Posts:
    256
    LOL! What contest was that again?
     
  19. wildman

    wildman Registered Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Posts:
    2,185
    Location:
    Home on the range.
    "It is! And I use it mostly to get reactions."

    DON'T FEED THE TROLL!

    MUST NOT FEED THE TROLL!
     
  20. Bubba

    Bubba Updates Team

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2002
    Posts:
    11,271
    How I found Wilder's and why it should be proud

    Unfortunatley some folks can't adhere to a simple request.

    ~"Please people, stick to it...~"

    Maybe another day....but this one is finished.

    Thread Closed.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2004
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.