A six-firewall review.

Ok Raygun, if you go here and look around, especially look at Comparative reviews of personal firewall software and follow all the links, you will get a pretty good picture of the strengths and weaknesses of BI and indeed many other firewalls.
This is from PCWorld and represents one of the major concerns I have about BI.

I hope this shows you why I voiced concern. I am sure you are cabaple of making informed decisions concerning your computing habits and I hope this has not seemed intrusive to you.
regards
root

 

On the contrary, I enjoy your information and thank you for the link! I didn't mean to come off as though I was angry, if I did I'm sorry. I only said what I did because you posted

"Hi Raygun. Even though BID now filters outgoing traffic also, I still believe it is something less than desirable. I wish I had bookmarked a couple of articles I recently read on it. It just dosen't perform well."

Even though you stated it was your opinion I find that too many people/places decide to say these things with out proof. The statement "it just doesn't perform well" is far from the truth and shows somewhere deep down you have some inbedded hate for the product.

Now the article you bring to my attention describes the supposed lack in file protection I think you are refering to. I would like to point out this, and I do not think you can toss this reality aside. You talk about firewalls that take some serious time and learning to get up and running correctly. Yet you want to say BlackIce is bad because if you already HAD a trojan then it would not block that trojans outbound! Well I just think that like any of these programs you must do your research and I did. I installed BlackIce on a fresh install and went further to learn how to block any program with BlackIce's outbound protection. I am able to use BlackIce to block ANY OUTBOUND TRAFFIC! <--this is what I need to get you to believe, if you won't use the program then you are just going to have to take my word. Not only that you can remove all known applications and start from scratch so to speak allowing one program at a time if that makes you happy! Then there is apsolutely NO way it will miss any outbound traffic, of which you seem to be pre-worried about when it comes to your chose in firewalls.

Here is the low down, or MY opinion. It does just what your program does you just don't want to admit it for some reason! If you check and remove trojans with another program, or you install BlackIce after a clean OS install, or you simply learn how it works and remove any questionable known files and ok them one by one or not allow them then it's doing the same as your firewall.

I think you have to face facts, for some reason you don't like BlackIce and have not tried it, therfore this is what bothers me when you make statements like, " It just dosen't perform well."

That's just a bad statement, I continue to read your insight as well as your links and thank you. I can always learn more.

 

Hi again. Actually I think BID was my first firewall. I liked it well enough although the early versions used to drive you batty with the warnings unless you turned them off.
Then, like so many people, I switch to ZA when Steve Gibson convinced me I needed outgoing protection as well as an IDS. I was happy enough with ZA, but I like to try out new and different products. I think I tried Sygate for awhile. It was cool. I then tried Tiny, I believe and learned some about rule making and application control. I used Conseal for a bit, but the rule making on it was difficult and I just didn't know enough to set it up properly. I switched to conseal desktop and I loved it. Simplest thing in the world and seemed to work well.
Well, one day I tried @Guard. I found a preset set of rules and was off. I had finally found my firewall. With all the extra filtering that went with it I was a happy camper.
All good things seem to come to an and and Conseal sold out to McAfee and @Guard sold out to Symantec. I tried NPF and McAfees both. Here is where I developed a deep seated resentment against a couple of Product lines. It was my personal opinion that the two best firewalls on the market were bought up by the big bullies of the industry and RUINED! So, here is where you will find my resentments, not BI and ZA.
I tried Look N Stop but I did not like the restrictions on rule making it had. I felt I had to make too many rules to accomplish the simplest blocking.
I went back to Sygate and then Outpost came along and I got involved in beta testing and I am at home now.
I would not debate you on the qualities of BI verses Outpost, that would lead nowhere, I feel.
It seems like you know enough about the products you choose, and that to me is what its all about. People having enough information to make informed decisions. Of course different people will make different decisions. I never try to sell Outpost as the best possible choice. I just try to sell Outpost on its merits. I love its versatility and rule making ability.
I hope I haven't bored you to tears with my little firewall history, so to speak. It's been interesting and fun trying out different products.
Who knows, I may someday try something other than Outpost. (Shhh) Don't spread that around, please.
By the way, i never thought you were angry. I just know that sometimes I appear to come across as a know it all, and I try to avoid that at all cost. I'm just another guy with another opinion and hopefully I can share some usefull information from time to time and in turn, pick up a little useful information from time to time.
Cheers.

 

That was actually a very interesting road you took us down!

It sounds as though you have found the firewall for you. I find I have to defend BI way too much, yet for user that likes less rule making and more GUI interface I think it's great. You really hit a good point when you said that we each find programs we like more. I have yet to try outpost so that's on my list. Like you I feel at home with what I have now and find all the tests out there I pass with flying colors. However, If and when I try another or find a reason to switch I think you have compeled me to try outpost.

After such a wonderful story I probably shouldn't say what I'm about to, but I can't resist because I feel so strongly about it.
My advice for anyone would be to turn your head the other way when it comes to steve gibson, he spouts more drible each day and there have been many things he simply can not back up. To this day I contend stealthing yourself does you no more good then just blocking. In fact I believe that with a stealth set up you will inevitably be probed more then if you were blocked and had sent an original signal back saying "yes here I am and the door is closed"

this is just my 2 cents though, I have yet to see anyone prove it either way and as I said at the begining of the thread I'm not in a position to know enough to test it myself.

Thanks for the fun thread and great info root. See you around!

-raygun-

 

Appears the comparison on Outposts page is saying NIS comes in second for features Isn't that funny?
Nice comparison posted though.
I have been messing with Outpost myself and I really think the name is COOL right from the frontier days.

http://www.agnitum.com/products/outpost/compare.html