NoScript vs RequestPolicy vs Ghostery

Discussion in 'other anti-malware software' started by TomAZ, Sep 29, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. hello_there
    Offline

    hello_there Registered Member

    I'm just saying that organizations buying from Ghostery cannot (AFAIU) identify you from what they buy. What you quoted there is about principles, not practice.
  2. ghostery
    Offline

    ghostery Registered Member

    Hi Justenough,

    We block similarly to AdBlock in many ways. The main difference isn't with the technical way page elements are blocked, it's with the lists, the extensions' options, Ghostery's company profiles (we have a privacy team that researches them) and with our interfaces. A lot of our users layer ABP and Ghostery. We definitely do "fight cookies." We used to actually have a "cookie protection option" in our FFX extension which would just nuke cookies, but we wound up just integrating it into regular blocking because we figured out how to make everything work/it was kind of confusing.

    Also, this guy (Mike, not Schneier) is confusing our autoupdates (which are turned on by default) with ill-intended data collection. The only data that may "leak" during updates is any data that normally gets sent with any request. We don't look at that, or even care about it, and every extension that autoupdates does this.

    As far as the data that people opt-in to submit to us, there's two topics here, from your comment:

    I suppose companies could create some intense system from the tracker lists. They're all publicly available anyway. But they don't need to buy them - they can just look at ABP or Ghostery's DB. Both lists are user-submitted ours is just heavily vetted and maintained.

    With the aggregate data (Ghostrank) that actually gets sold, we sell it to companies so they can monitor what tags are on their sites without their knowledge (often through redirects), we sell it to the BBB to help them monitor companies for privacy compliance, we create reports (http://purplebox.ghostery.com/?p=1016022235), and we just generally try to see what the heck is going on with trackers on the web. We're the first company to really get a handle on just how widespread and, in many cases, ridiculous the amount of web tracking is these days. Making the web transparent for all parties and giving them control over tracking is what we do.

    Does this help?

    Adam
  3. justenough
    Offline

    justenough Registered Member

    Yes Adam, very helpful. I appreciate the clarity and thoroughness of your reply, thank you. If what you say is true, then Mike wasn't quite the expert he made himself out to be. I say 'if' because my security understanding doesn't go deeper than what others have taught me. For instance I can't take your code apart and see what's what. Or assume negative motives to what others are doing with the information you are collecting from Ghostery users. Your reply seems straightforward and complete, so I will go back to using Ghostery along with ABP, unless someone here at Wilders who knows more than I do about this stuff has some convincing rebuttal.

    A side note, sometimes I am impressed with helpful attitude some developers can maintain when dealing with customers and their doubts and dissatisfaction.:thumb:
  4. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    Interesting how Better Advertising/Evidon's mission has evolved:

    2010
    2012
    http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1905935

    http://www.evidon.com/about_us.html
  5. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    Apart from the bla bla bla... do you have any real proof of all your conspiracies, suspicions and accusations over ghostery? please share it.
  6. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    Absolutely, I have referenced every fact. If you feel those are 'conspiracies, suspicions and accusations' - well, then it's your turn :D

    http://www.wilderssecurity.com/search.php
  7. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    So you have nothing,... you can find real arguments to dismantle your "staments" here: www.google.com

    PD: Everybody knows how to play troll.
  8. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    That is not even an argument so I shall not comment it. If you search this forum for Better Advertising or Evidon you'll find plenty of information, plus links to the sources.

    In the meantime, I stand by my argument that Better Advertising/Evidon cannot be trusted since their raison d'être is avoiding regulation and making profit, not protecting anyone's privacy.
  9. The Red Moon
    Offline

    The Red Moon Registered Member

    In a general sense that could apply to most software companies and not just ghostery.:eek:
    What about noscript and adblock?
    The list could go on and on.o_O
  10. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    Please show us your arguments and stop to behave as a troll.

    Do they protect your privacy? yes
    Do they make money with the stats of the trackers found? yes, it does not affect to your privacy and it's optional you can deactivate it
    Regulation? jajajaja they don't do the rules, they don't have the power of regulate anything, any other conspiranoic idea?

    I know the info that I can find in this forum about Evidon/Ghostery, but sadly for you this info does not prove anything, and has been contested several times by ghostery dismantling all the lies and conspiracies.
  11. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    Name-calling does not add to your credibility, nor does it make people like you. Show us some evidence instead!
  12. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    Jajaja Please could you answer to the entire post? removing from the quote the things that you can't answer only show how wrong you are.

    Everybody here is still waiting the "irrefutable/not answered" proofs that you have make up. Since everything you have said have been dismounted in ghostery blog btw other sites.
    If you don't have them don't make us lose our time. How can we answer to your lies if you don't even tell us where did they come from and where they are?

    If you incriminate a company at least your should indicate in what are your statements based, is not the work of the others to proof YOUR accusation (unless you are a troll and you are playing with us)
    It's like if I say that you are an assassin, a pederast or something..., everybody would require some kind of photo or proof. I hope you can understand how the things works.

    Last edited: Oct 15, 2012
  13. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    I've researched Better Advertising/Evidon/Ghostery and posted some of what I've found here. Opinions and facts are clearly separated. Ghostery has responded:
    and explained why it is doing what it's doing. Indeed there are several reasons why I don't like Ghostery: Posing as an open-source cutesy little something while being a commercial company with an agenda is one of them.

    It is you who dumbs down the discussion by making random unsubstantiated claims. Again: Feel free to do your own research and post what you have found here. I look forward to a fruitful discussion.

    http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showpost.php?p=2128429&postcount=18
  14. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    Tracker data is not personal data, or data that can affect to your privacy in any way.
    I don't see in their website that the are a NGO. Furthermore this is optional and comes disabled by default in the configuration.

    Open source? what are you talking about?
    What is wrong with this? it's illegal? are they lying somewhere? Men if you haven't read their website is not our problem. Everything you have said is public information, you haven't done any research or discover anything new.
    BTW all the companies are commercial... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company
  15. focus
    Offline

    focus Registered Member

    @Pinga Ghostrank (data collection) is an option with Ghostery, I have seen no indication that they do not honor this opt out feature. All of the information you have referenced about them selling statistical data from those who opt in to using Ghostrank is not a secret, they are quite open about it IMO. If you have any information that they are not honoring the opt out commitment for data collection, that would be something I would like to know about.
  16. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    If you feel comfortable using Ghostery, by all means do so. But keep in mind that Ghostery's primary purpose appears to be avoiding industry regulation, not protecting your privacy.

    http://www.itworld.com/it-managementstrategy/249964/ghostery-machine-tracking-trackers

    http://www.iab.net/about_the_iab/recent_press_releases/press_release_archive/press_release/pr-100410

    http://www.iab.net/iablog/2011/02/self-regulation-solves-the-do-.html

    http://blog.evidon.com/2011/02/24/cutting-through-the-noise-on-do-not-track-and-self-regulation/
  17. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    Ghostery is avoiding the regulation? this is the biggest lie of all and totally lack of sense and arguments.

    1) Ghostery does not have any means, power, authority or jurisdiction to regulate the advertising market.
    2) And since they can't the only thing they do is offer a tool to block trackers.
    3) By default is disabled but if the user want, he can collaborate optionally with antonym tracker info not related at all with the user privacy to finance Ghostery development which costs money.
    4) DNT option added by the browsers has nothing to do with Ghostery. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Do_Not_Track

    End of the story
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2012
  18. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    I'm afraid you misunderstood. The above post refers to Evidon, the company that bought Ghostery. Perhaps it makes more sense to you if you actually read the material ;)
  19. Tong
    Offline

    Tong Registered Member

    So I get better privacy and at the same time make a stand against regulation? That's awesome!

    Turning GhostRank on right now. :)
  20. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    I'm afraid you misunderstood. The thread refers to Ghostery. Perhaps it makes more sense to you if you actually read the thread title ;) But please instead to answer the real questions with arguments continue making the troll and answering the first thing that comes to your mind.
    "Ghostery is a product of Evidon..." congratulations! xD you have discover the americas.

    Anyway:
    Evidon is avoiding the regulation? this is the biggest lie of all and totally lack of sense and arguments.
    1) Evidon does not have any means, power, authority or jurisdiction to regulate the advertising market.
    So please don't make us lose our time.
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2012
  21. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    Evidon's business model, its attempts at influencing legislation and public opinion, as well as the impact of their Ghostery extension in terms of privacy and security are all highly relevant topics on this forum.

    Your righteous tone, your lack of interest in a dialogue and your total disregard for both content and context suggest you are merely trying to derail the conversation for your own purposes.

    If you are shouting at people online and refusing to have a dialogue, you're bullying. There are other opinions than yours on this particular subject - which is broader and more complex than you seem to comprehend.

    I'm not fighting with you. And, quite frankly, more interested in continuing this debate in a constructive way.
  22. lordraiden
    Offline

    lordraiden Registered Member

    Do you have any evidence of evidon influencing in the legislation?
    What impact in security and privacy are you talking about? good, bad? in what sense?
  23. justenough
    Offline

    justenough Registered Member

    Pinga, if you have any information that using Ghostery will somehow compromise security, I would be interested in seeing it.

    Supposedly Ghostery and AdBlock Plus overlap in coverage. I am using Fanboy's Ultimate List, but I still get lots of blocked trackers in Ghostery, sometimes a long list of maybe 15. Wonder why AdBlock Plus isn't catching them?
  24. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

  25. Pinga
    Offline

    Pinga Registered Member

    The State Of Evidon: Meyer on Regulation, Extending Into Performance and The Roadmap Ahead
    http://www.adexchanger.com/the-state-of/evidon-2/
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.