Is Ubuntu ready for prime-time? A test.

A better test would be taking someone who has not use a computer before and asking them to do a series of tasks on both machines.

That test is more of a is Ubuntu ready for windows users, but I found it quite positive, if the same test was been done with OS-X there would be alteast as many problems.

My wife had no problems running a Redhat fork for about 6 months - using IM, email and web. I managed the config (cmd line), but the desktop stuff in gnome she had no problems with.

For my current needs and uses Linux (Ubuntu/Debian) do 95-99% of what I need, whereas Windows XP does 100 % what I need.

I think Linux big issue is lack of marketing, ask the average person on the street what linux is and they do not know.
IMHO Linux Desktop will be perfected (ready for prime-time) soon (a year of 2), but it will take longer to popularise and gain recognition.

 

I'm not insinuating anything, how could I when until this moment, I didn't know what sort of setup you have?

I was just making a few observations about the positive benefits of using Linux with it's out of the box security and outstanding stability plus extolling the virtues of PCLOS which because of it's usability, is a wonderful OS in my opinion.

 

I agree with you, Linux is developing at a rate of knots. It's very exciting. There are some wonderful Distros out there such as Puppy which loads and runs entirely in RAM to the extent that I can take the Live CD out of it's drive and Puppy will happily work away.

 

Its interesting, as we suffer speed, security and stability issues at work with Windows desktops and servers, heres some examples compared to Linux:
Our new .net webservices require a 4th webserver, when we only needed 3 using redhat/apache tomcat services.
External security audits of the same servers showed the Windows webservers to be using insecure default SSL configurations, which the apache machines did'nt.
Our Team Foundation Server database has errors/corrupt in 6 months of use by 2 developers (branching is broken), when our SVN server running for years with a team of 6 has been 100 % reliable.

Then on my desktop, a new HP laptop with XP as of Sept 2007, Outlook 2003 crashes on average daily, with a dll exception - this issue affects many users on different machines. Microsoft is aware of the issue (with IMAP), not fix yet (waiting 4 months).
Both Evolution and Thunderbird on Hardy Heron live work flawlessly.

Just examples, I know there are probably examples where windows is more secure, stable and faster than linux and as you say we have choices which is why we use a mix where I work.

 

- Linux is really difficult for people who have Windows hard-wired into their brains.
- Linux can be frustrating to people who think that they are "tech-savvy" but can't get things to work in two-clicks in a GUI.
- Linux is utter easy for grandma when she buys an OEM computer (i.e., a Dell or HP preloaded with Linux) or her grandson setups the machine for her.
- Linux is of no use for people who depend on Windows-only applications.
- You don't need to be a Microsoft basher to see the advantages of Open Source software.
- You don't need to be a Linux zealot to see the advantages of an OS with Unix roots.

 

I installed Ubuntu 8.04 on my laptop last week. I did have to do some CLI work to get my Atheros wireless working but other than that it wasn't too bad. It just felt "clunky" since the last time I used it (6.10) and it is on a faster computer at that. I took it off and put Vista back on it since then.

When I first tried Linux some years ago it seemed like everything had to be done in CLI. I wondered why there was even a GUI since most of the time you were in Console. But over time this has gotten a lot better though it still has some ways to go before mom and pop can use it.

I also tried the Linux Mint LiveCD but after I rebooted I got a boot error from Windows. Fortunately Vista told me that it could fix the problem for me and it did so I didn't have to do the recovery console-fixmbr bit. I wasn't aware it could do that but glad it did, lol.

I also downloaded PCLOS Gnome (I prefer Gnome over KDE) because it looked kinda cool. But I must got a bad download because I got errors trying to run the liveCD on both my laptop and desktop. I will download it again this week and try again.

 

You see, the linux developers are the kernel guys. OS's are many. Which one.

Did you check the Ubuntu docs, PCLinuxOS docs, Debian's, Suse, RedHat, Arch...
See where i'm getting at?

Refer to a specific OS, or we won't get anywhere.

As with Windows, you don't just hand over a pc with Windows to someone who never used one. You tell him/her how it works, or can Windows talk?
The experience the OP links is most interesting, and reveals things to improve still.
But all the "problems" his girl friend had would be easily solved if she could ask questions, exactly like in Windows.

 

This is important. The end-user does not care whether the fault lies with the hardware mfr. or the distro. Most notebook/laptop users want wireless working. Most are not CLI literate in Linux or Windows. This is a common use case.

 

I've distro hopped a lot for the past year and a half, and I would have to say that learning either OS, Linux or Win, is perhaps about the same. If you work with Linux for a while, you learn the ins and outs, and it's fairly easy. But I think perhaps many of us forget our early learning curve days with Win as well.

That said, I do lean toward Win, mostly because I think it's just more polished and a bit better done in general, rather than being easier to use or learn. Linux distros are quite inconsistent and sometimes pretty buggy. They are more user friendly now, especially ones like Ubuntu or PCLOS. But for some reason, I usually return to Win.

Truth is, they both have their merits and drawbacks....

 

I am not speaking about any particular Linux distro but linux in general. To make this easier on you why don't you just list the Linux distros that are as easy to use as windows and have as short a learning curve as windows. Oh I guess that isn't a fair question because there isn't one. that is the point I am making. Like I stated several times before, I don't think Linux is a bad program at all. It just isn't ready for Mr. or Mrs. average computer user yet. I am sure it will eventually get there but the time is not now. And I will agree that Ubuntu has done quite a bit to address new linux users but so far it is not enough.

 

Ok, you insist on "linux in general". It's just wrong, but ok, i drop it..

So i've already replied?
PCLinuxOS, Ubuntu/Kubuntu/Xubuntu, Mandriva, Suse, WinLinux (just for you), Fedora, Linspire, Xandros, + more probably. Didn't try them all, then again i'm not criticising them either..

Did you try the ones above? And which for more than 1 hour, if any?

The problems i've seen are basically linked to hardware manufacturer's support (drivers, hence the complicated CLI instructions), and 'oh no i can't read MS docs properly' - proprietary, almost a secret, which shouldn't exist.
And it's an installation problem, not a problem with using it. The learning how to use it is mostly the same as with Windows. The program's names change.

Shoot

Edit: i don't know if it's Winlinux or LinuxXP, i forgot mostly because i didn't care for those.

 

I have tried all of the ones you listed and more except Xubuntu I have even used the server versions of several of them. When I had my computer shops I had to know how to use linux to be able to work on and service some of my customers desktops and servers. I know how to use linux but I don't really care for it as you have probably deduced by now.

Bye the way Pedro, I am enjoying our little exchange of thoughts.

EDIT I always dual booted so I could give them at least a week before it hit the deep six. I almost kept SUSE at one time but I came to my senses

 

I always enjoy exchanging thoughts with you too Bigc, which is why i'm have a hard time with the 'linux program' and 'linux geeks'.
I think i know you know, or something like that, but..

I think i know why too. It's those programs that are only available for Windows right? A few programs you just got used to, besides those docs you need to read.

 

It is just easier to call it "the Linux Program" or the Linux Geeks. I am probably one of the biggest computer nerds there is and a bit geeky. To me calling someone a geek is not a cut or detremental remark but just more of a fit all nick name. And I do realize how many people give their time and effort to open source and Linux in general and it is no small achivement but a herculean endeavor.

 

I didn't think it was a detrimental remark either, but rather putting everyone in one bag. Some program for the kernel, others the windows system, others the package manager for distro xyz, others just code programs for it..
One distro with objective no.1 performance, another with objective no.1 security, another grandma proof, etc.
For example, one can't criticize Slackware or Arch or OpenBSD even, because "even i cant use it let alone granny"
They're just built for other purposes, and don't give a damn about granny, or market share for that matter (true for many, but not all).

 

How long has it been then? And did you try the latest PCLinuxOS / Ubuntu?

I can tell you i saw Ubuntu beta on a laptop and i was stunned. Vista was on another partition, and no bs, i thought it was slower, and i don't find it appealing at all.

I bet Windows 7 will be much better (just have a gut feeling), but i won't use it, not by my own free will.
Notice free will. If i'm forced to use Windows, am i free?

 

Yep you are free to use what you wish. Actually I really do like vista. I won't go into datail why but I love it. and would never go back to Xp. I have had not one problem with Vista. I couldn't ask an OS to run any better. In reality there are a lot of people that are having the same experience with Vista that I am.

 

No i'm not. Word is the only one that can properly read MS documents. Standards aren't enforced, and Microsoft bribes everyone. I'm not free to choose.
I can and will choose for home computer, but for work i'm basically stuck.

And, as time goes by, MS makes new formats that older versions of Word can't read. Eventually my legitimate copy of XP + Office 2003 can't cut it.

 

I guess that is what you call between a rock and a hard place

 

I'm still waiting for the European Comission, and the whole OOXML debate.

 

Yep, it is likely to hit the fan

 

Again, that can apply the other way as well. I could use either but I choose to use Windows. No one is putting a gun to my head--that is freedom of choice.

I used to believe in Linux and what it stood for until I was disturbed by the obvious smear campaign against Vista with all kinds of wild FUD being spread. There are alot of Linux fanatics out there that quite frankly scare me with their writings. The community itself is fragmented with over a hundred distros in existence. Examples of the factions within the communities are the "Purists" vs the "Neos" (my terms for the Old Guard and the New), Debian vs RPM, this distro vs that disto, etc. As long as these conflicts exist Linux will never become a major OS.

Used to you didn't see this in the Windows world. There are just "software fandom" such as in security which is evidenced on this forum. But now you see battle lines drawn everywhere between XP and Vista. It is certainly saddening to see.

 

No, it's not the same by a long shot. No one forbids MS from using odf, and they have all the specs.

If i can exchange documents without technical issues with you, on whichever OS, then i'm free to choose the OS i prefer.

You're just confusing things. The World is like that. While i don't like those arguments, i like that the world is diverse, multi-colour. I don't like grey.

 

I do not use ODF, which is another freedom of choice, so none of that applies to me.

No I am not confused but far from it from my observations in the Linux world. By the very nature of this "diversity" you speak of Linux will never be a major player. It took a billionaire "capitalist" to bring Ubuntu to where it is now in popularity if you hadn't noticed.