I have a problem with TDS... help!

Discussion in 'Trojan Defence Suite' started by Tactics, Oct 23, 2002.

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  1. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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  2. FanJ

    FanJ Guest

    Hi Tactics,

    Have you looked at the first two threads in this forum-section:
    Required System Files for TDS-3, and
    Basic Configuration of TDS-3.

    Are you absolutely sure that, with respect to the required system files, you have them all on your system, and that their version-numbers on your system are not lower than the version-numbers of those files on that Diamond-site?

    Most problems occur when people don't have those right files on their system with the right version-numbers.

    Please check and double-check those files and their version-numbers; it really is important!

    In case everything is right with those files:
    Then there might be a problem with the so-called "Process Memory Space Scan" in TDS-3. What I mean here, is:
    During that scan your system might freeze for some minutes, or even on some systems it might freeze completely. What I would advice in that case, is to disable that Process Memory Space Scan. (I myself have disabled it, cause sometimes it gave me some problems).

    Let us know if this might help you.

    Cheers, Jan.
     
  3. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    TY for the reply.

    yep those 4 files are fine. I double checked.

    As for the process memory space scan - where do I disable that? if it's in the scan console then i'm out of luck. I can't get to this scan console with all the settings. As soon as I click TDS and run the program the running process window comes up and freezes. Should I let it sit there for a half hour? I will but it seems to lock within 5 minutes according to crtl/alt/del

    thx again
     
  4. FanJ

    FanJ Guest

    Hi Tactics,

    You said you checked the 4 files, but there are more to check, sorry! If I counted well, there are 9 mentioned.

    Could you please tell us your OS (Windows 95, 98, 98 SE, ME, NT, 2000, XP etc.).

    Regards, Jan.
     
  5. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    Jan, you might like to have a look at my answers in that thread over there too.
    I'm running win98se too, and i have everything checked in the startup scans and i know it takes several minutes on that memory processes scan but that's no reason for me to disable it, just trying to give it all space and time to do what i asked for and not doing other heavy things at the same time, which is why i don't have it in the windows autostart but have it starting afterwards. I know, i could automate that with wintasks, might look into that in a future time again. So i have no other processes hunting for the same memory places or space at the time.
     
  6. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    Win 98SE

    I was told to look at 4 files at dslreports. I'll check that link again. The other files were dll's. is that the other files your are talking about when you say 9? I have to run but i'll check in 30 min. thx.
     
  7. Scotcov

    Scotcov Guest

    I too run win98 and have the exact same problem as you, Tactics. In fact, if I remember right, it also always locked at about #18 or so. I always killed all runnung processes before clicking on TDS. I tried reinstalling 3 different times with new downloads, but always the same problem. I also let it sit for over an hour twice (is that overkill?), but it stayed frozen.
    I had checked to see if my files were correct, and thought they were.
    I wonder if this is one of those cases where there are just some incompatabilities that can't be overcome.
     
  8. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    ok I had 2 dll's that were older. I replaced one but the other one riched32 is being used by windows. I can't replace it. How do I replace it with the newer version? In DOS? if so refresh me and give me exact step by step. thx a lot. We're getting closer I hope. If I replace that one ALL files will be up to date. I checked and rechecked.

    BTW I just did a complete format and fresh install 2 weeks ago so my system is bug free and clean. I don't have alot of "junk" on it.

    edit: Scotcov I just seen your reply and you might be right but theres gotta be a lot of other users with Win98 that work. I really hope we can get a fix for this.
     
  9. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    You might like this happy "manual" written by a happy user learning himself step by step, encouraging others here
    http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=4071
    I would do it in DOS indeed.
    Fingers crossed for you.
    I run win98se as well and with some patience, but half an hour is really too much if it was only for the memory processes scan.
    For a full system scan that can take some hours on a win95/98/ me.

    You can change scan options in the TDS > Configuration > Startup tab and check or uncheck at wish.
     
  10. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    thx for the link but it didn't mention anything about replacing the file in DOS. ughhh i'm starting to get frustrated here. Like I said in my other reply I need instructions on how to replace it in DOS. o_O

    Windows is currently using that file and won't let me change it. Suggestions? thx alot
     
  11. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    Sorry, you're right, it is one of the ways which works for some as described here.
    Wanted to spare you this long thread, in which i described it too, and Controler mentioned another program. As the user had the same problem (necessity to change required system files for other reasons) and needed step-by-step instruction think you might like the threads.
    http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showthread.php?t=4050;start=15
    If it's still not working don't hesitate to say so, then i'll copy another clear instruction from another place i''ll dig for anyway. But keep a copy of the file you have anyway just in case.

    Thanks to Gavin who gave an example of another file!
    You can use MSDOS if you want, put the newer file in the Windows\System folder but name it MSVCRT.DL2

    in DOS :

    C:\>cd Windows\System
    C:\Windows\System\>ren msvcrt.dll mscvrt.bak
    C:\Windows\System\>ren msvcrt.dl2 msvcrt.dll

    *Reboot*

    First line puts you in the System folder
    Second backs up your old DLL
    Third replaces with new DLL

    That's a nice instruction. I'd recommend to do one file at a time and see if windows still works fine and if TDS is ok with that, for if not, you would know which file is the culpit and to place back if necessary.
    Looking forward to your news!
     
  12. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    Hi, thx for the info. I'm at work right now and printed out the link you posted. As for the info in your post about MSDOS and MSVCRT.32 - i'm not having a problem with this file. I'm having a problem with the riched32.dll file. Maybe you were just using the msvcrt as an example in your post.

    Well I do know this all my files are up to date that are required for TDS to run and be happy. I only had to update 2 and the riched32 will be the 3rd and that is the only one I had to do in DOS. I'll do it tonight and post back with good news... I hope.
     
  13. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    That's right, i used that example here, as i was kind in a hurry so could not edit it anymore to change it into your file, but the way is the same.
    The other two threads are very nice and informative too, which of course not only serve for TDS but for more stuff on your system in future times. Once you know several ways how it could work, you get used to it and it gets easier and more: you can tell others how to!
    I hope this file change helps you. And once through all those startup scans you can also look through the basic configurations what you like and need: even if you uncheck some of the startup scans, you can try those manually from that scan menu, so then you know those first times if they really take that time and you'll get used to it. For sure you'll like to play around with it and try some of the buttons and functions, so looking forward to your good news.
     
  14. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    Well I manged to copy the file. BTW that link had a ton of info but it still didn't explain how to copy a file in DOS. There were examples of file renaming but no copying. Anyway I just went inot DOS and did C:\copy c:\riched32.dll c:\windows\system and bingo copied. :) That's all I was looking for, lol.

    Now I'm afraid to run the TDS exe :p I have to run but I will try when I get home tonight or tomorrow and post. *crosses fingers*
     
  15. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    nah still don't work. I don't have anything running in the background except ZA and ALL the files that needed updating are updated. I let it sit for 4 1/2 hours and still shows up not responding. I guess it just won't work. :oops:
     
  16. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    Must either be something in the settings or a system file overlooked.
    I even have it running on a very old system with very little RAM, but with all the required files in it's proper place, as well on an overloaded win98se system.

    How far did you get in the startup scanning exactly and are you able to get after that in the Configuration part?
    What happens with the rest of the system, can you work on normally or is all the system frozen in that time?

    On top of this TDS forum FanJ described the required files as well in the other the basic configuration.

    You might like to download Faber Toys at www.faberbox.com which is a nice tool to look at what you have running, all the used dll and systemfiles used are showing up; it's a very handy tool and it's free and really easy to use.
    Run the thing, look what TDS is calling and you might like to save and zip it and if it's smaller then 100k you can attach it to a message here, so people are able to look for you or you might prefer to send it to support@diamondcs.com.au.
    With that you can see in the meantime if the files you copied in went all properly, to name an example.
    Which IE version are you using, and with all the security updates? (this can change system files too, hence the question)
     
  17. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    It must be a setting. All my files are updated. I copied them over then checked the version to see if it was done and it was. The files that are required are updated and none overlooked. I'm anal about everything so I double and triple check everything. :)

    I can't tell how far I get with the setup. I click the exe and the tds window comes up like it's going to scan and it stays right there. I don't know what you mean by configuration. Like I mentioned before I can not get in to the any part of the configuration window.

    My system seems fine and does not lock up - only the tds windows seems to freeze.

    Well if you mean running in the background I don't have much. I just did a fresh format on my new hard drive 2 weeks ago and I don't have any proggies installed except ad-aware and spybot. I disabled all that stuff for the time being trying to get tds to run.

    I use IE6 without SP1 and all latest updates from M$. I'll try and uninstall it and reinstall it since I have not done this yet. I also see people mention 3.2.0 - where can I get this if all else fails. I'm using 3.2.1 - should I be using 3.2.0? thx
     
  18. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    The version number 3.2.1. is the latest; in the window (once you get that far) you would see 3.2.0 as the tds-3.exe itself was not updated to 3.2.1, but some other functions were added and rebuilt so you have the most recent one.
    I'm running IE6.0 without SP1 too, also on a win98se, dutch version.
    I'm happy that you were able to check your file versions, so you learned that part from DOS and file replacement too in the meantime. Suppose you put them all in the windows\system and not in system32.
    The Fabertoys many of us use to check what is running, no need to keep it up permanently, but it's a real wonderful tool to look what is running and if all is called what should be called to run. It's a great help for the support as well when we send them a log page; i think you'll like that (free) tool, certainly as you like to check the things!

    I mean indeed the configuration of TDS, but to get to that it should be ready with all it's default startup to be able to get to that part. You can see that if you look here in the forum in the sticky messages FanJ made about the required files and the basic configuration with the screenshots..

    I remember you wrote about the recent format and clean new install yes.
    Are there any other programs freezing or with other problems? Suppose you start it manually after all windows started.
    My system runs lots better since i updated the Virtual Machine and Windows Script 5.6 and the VB6 runtimes (that last one is in the required files so you have that). It's not just updating the java and scripting parts, but some other system files too, which helped a lot on my system.
    Wayne promissed to get other help from the shelf for you, as it should run without problems on your system too.
    So i wonder which additional info you can profide him with; think in fact such a log page of faber toys from a started TDS attached to support could do lot of good with that.
    Which anti-virus/anti-trojan did you install and which firewall?
     
  19. Gavin - DiamondCS

    Gavin - DiamondCS Former DCS Moderator

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    Hi Tactics,

    Please make sure the OCX files required are registered -

    Open an MSDOS prompt, click Start > Run, type COMMAND and press Enter

    Now get to your System folder, which should be done like this

    cd \
    cd Windows\System

    Now just type

    regsvr32 comctl32.ocx /s
    regsvr32 comdlg32.ocx /s
    regsvr32 tabctl32.ocx /s
    regsvr32 richtx32.ocx /s

    Let me know soon, thanks :)
     
  20. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    huh?? That's what I was told - put them in windows\system
    not system32. Was that a typo?

    I still don't know what you mean by running. It has to be what's running in the background. Is that what you mean?Like I said disable everythig in msconfig so it won't intefere with TDS

    No other programs freezing - very stable. I built this PC myself so i'm very familiar with software/hardware. I start it manually all the time. My VM is updated to the latest -ver.3805 I believe is the last ver. for W98

    Macfee 5.0 FULLY UPDATED and ZA - free version. No anti-trojan.

    I can do that when I get home but what do you mean "let me know soon" what am I looking for after I type these, lol thx
     
  21. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    No the windows\system was not a typo, but some people confuse system and system32.
    I asked you to make sure the files are in the right directory.
    I suppose after putting them there you rebooted to have windows using the new files.
    Did you try TDS after that reboot?

    Did you in the meantime get the Faber toys program i asked you to look for?
    Starting a program, running, all the same, just click the exe and see what happens. Faber toys opens a GUI with the running processes in the top window, scroll down till you get the TDS.exe and click that one time; then you get in the window below that all the running processes called by that exe.
    Then you see in the top buttons one to save that page and do so. That is the page people need to be able to see if all is there and properly running. This was the file i would like you to send to support or zip it and paste it here in a message if you like us all to look at it.
    After that you can decide to close that Faber toys or play around a little more if you wish, i just mean there is not any need to have that program in your startup programs, just start it at times when you want to look and you'll see it's an easy and marvelous tool for determining your system.


    The VM, i remember MS security bulletins for that, in the 3000 series indeed, and later updates mentioned there; hard to find real info on the MS pages if it comes to version nrs.
    http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/security/bulletin/MS00-081.asp
    The patch mentioned there included a new version of the VM which might be your version by now.

    How about Windows Scripting Host, think version 5.6 is the actual one.


    I don't run mcafee but that's a personal choice as it caused lots of problems on my system long ago. Short before removing it permanently i started using TDS-2 which had not any problems with that, but that was long ago, TDS has changed and so mcafee will have in the meantime, so can't tell a thing. Only that i never heard of anybody having problems with that at all.
    ZA should not be any problem either unless you installed the one while the other program was active, same counts for any anti-virus/trojan too of course.
    Could prevent system files from registering properly.
    But i think you know this.
    ZA with it's true vector, TDS, mcafee all go very deep in your system and if any of such programs is running while installing the other, they fight. If all is closed and all is installed the one after the other, things should be ok.


    With the command in MSDOS Gavin just gave you, you make sure the required OCX files are also properly registered. Can happen they were blocked by something.
    And with the next line "let me know, thanks" Gavin means "please let me know how it goes after that"
    So after those commands, would reboot windows and try TDS again. Gavin and we all would love to know what happens after that reboot and restart of TDS.



    You are all sure there is not any infection on your system? Scanning at http://housecall.antivirus.com for instance just to make sure? Such an infection could prevent proper installations too.
    In the Fabertoys tool you could see strange processes too, if there were any.


    Looking forward to your next results.

    *repaired url*
     
  22. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    Jooske - no offense but we are way beyond this now. :) Of course I rebooted. I totally updated everything and let it sit for 5 hours. TDS still shows not responding.

    nah I'm not going to download and install that. I don't think it will tell you anything that you guys haven't said already. My problem is something beyond that. It seems like way to much trouble to get this work in 98 imo. I still have to uninstall TDS it and reinstall it. That might help.

    Windows script hosting should be updated with the install of IE6 and all updates.

    Nope no infections or virus's - system is clean. Trust me. :) I even did a boot scan at boot up to check for a virus but all is well. When I reinstall it i'll post back since sometimes that is a "quick fix"
     
  23. Jooske

    Jooske Registered Member

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    Here is the windows scripting host which is not updated with IE 6.
    http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads/default.asp?url=/downloads/sample.asp?url=/msdn-files/027/001/733/msdncompositedoc.xml

    Reinstall with all the other things disabled, mcafee most of all and even if ZA is disabled the true vector is still running.
    Not using any registry blockers/controllers, regrun, that kind?

    A few things:
    TDS is running on every windows version from 95 and up, this included win98, win98se etc. Thousands of people are running this combination without any problem or if there were they were solved rather easily. I am not aware of any win98 user following the directions not being able to run it properly and comfortable.
    The Fabertoys we use lots of time to check if all is properly running and called upon, registered, in a very easy way to help the user both as us on the support side and to avoid lots of wasted time for all parties.
    We are all here trying to help you out in two forums as hundreds of peoples have been helped out if necessary so there is experience.
    So Gavin's advice to check if those required OCX files are properly registered is not just to try something but based on lots of experience with support.
    One of the few questions not asked is where you downloaded the file.
    If not done there already, try http://tds.diamondcs.com.au
    From that location you can trust the files.
    After downloading and installing go back there and get the new radius3 file (they change each day, so you have to grab the new one anyway.)
    After installing TDS you can start ZA if you like again, as an installed ZA/ZAPro but not running, while the true vector part of it is running in the batch anyway can cause problems on a system. Mcafee is your won choice, can run or be stopped at your wish, but isn't that resident all time too on a system, even if not started? As it is known for not allowing other av software installed on a system, not even in another partition and not even if none is resident, but even with that it still had no problems with TDS if all properly installed.

    *repaired url*
     
  24. Gavin - DiamondCS

    Gavin - DiamondCS Former DCS Moderator

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    Hi Tactics,

    Please let me know if TDS runs now, with the files registered as per my post last night :)

    If not, can you write to me at gavin@diamondcs.com.au with detailed information on your

    Mainboard (BIOS revision if possible)
    CPU speed and type (is it overclocked ? bus speed ?)
    RAM speed and type ? (Is it running at the default CAS timings ?)
    Installed cards - VGA, Sound (and driver versions if possible)
    Other cards ?

    Maybe we can find a small timing issue with the BIOS / RAM or some other conflict. Memory scanning is reasonably intensive and you need a stable system. Also if you write to me, mention do you run any intensive 3D games and do they perform with complete stability (I can leave Quake 3 running flat out in timedemo mode all day and night on my machine without a crash)
     
  25. Tactics

    Tactics Registered Member

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    Hi all, just figured I mention a couple things.

    Windows scripting host was updated to 5.5 in IE6 and ver. 5.6 is beta from what I been reading on the net and I don't like beta stuff too much. I haven't got a chance to reinstall it but if I do and it don't fly i'll move on. Thx for all the help though. I don't want to get into sending all my specs and drivers, etc... my system is rock solid, but I will be putting in a new MB, CPU, ram and video in a few weeks so I can try TDS on that also. I have protection from mcafee but could use a little more that's why I hope TDS will work when reinstalled. I also registered those files in DOS like you asked me to do. All files are updated so we'll see what happens. :)
     
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