Dogmas r Unconventional beliefs

Hello,
Yes, I did exaggerate with cookies.
Apropos governments - don't worry, if they need to nail you down, they will, regardless of having encrypted or non-encrypted mails. Just live the life. For one who has faced guns point blank in my face (and worse), trust me computer security is one of the better pains you can have in this world.
The most important thing - don't be afraid, or as they say in Latin Illegitimus Non-Carborundum (hope I spelling it ok ...) - Don't let the bastards grind you down.
My friend, my bro, myself we don't stay ahead of malware writers - we stay ahead of ourselves. Self destructivity of the human being is worse than any trojan one can write...
Mrk

 

Who is "they" here? The parents or the teenagers? In any case, they are worrying not because the bad guys are good, but because people don't care. Most people here CARE, and many are still scared.

Yes, yes the dreaded Apropos. you keep mentioning.. The name changes, tomorrow it will be called Sp _ _ _ er so what? Whenever you come to a point when you need to seek help removing it, the game is over already. Have you ever gotten nailed by something like that? I haven't. A lot of people here haven't ( maybe they got nailed once then they got serious about security and nothing after that), so why is this Apropos so scary that deserves you mentioning it over and over again? Because it uses "rootkits" right? lol.


FUD is things like

I'm talking about people fearing stuff like super rootkit in bios/memory card stories. Or *You* talking about cookies being exploited to install malware a few months back in another forum. Or you talking about government hackers attacking you.

I'm not saying they won't, I'm saying it doesn't matter.

You don't get it, coders can make rootkits as "Stealthy" as difficult to remove as they want, but it still can't magically install on your computer! That is why even if Apropos X20 is one million times tougher to remove then Apropos 1, neither you nor me will likely be infected.

The same people who get infected even in the early days of spyware, will still be the same people infected in the future.

No because Stevio has a nice powerful personal firewall called ZA, that saved his butt.

You do not know why, yet it doesn't stop you from hinting darkly and speculating that governments are trying to hack into you.... Yes...

Do you know the mean of a dynamic equlibrium ? One side will gain a short lead, but it is shortlived, and the other side will catch up ...

The problem Stevio is that you always implictly assume the bad guys will get the upper hand. I see no reason why this is the case. They haven't yet so far.

All I see you is saying "the internet will become more dangerous, hackers will be more skillful, malware more difficult to detect etc".

What if the good guys move ahead? Then the internet will be less dangerous.

Can you give me any reason to believe why the bad guys will win? Besides repeating predictions like rootkits, name dropping the laughably Apropros?

LOL. .

Worms are less popular because of both technical countermeasures AND user education that is why they are losing.

The way you put it, you make it seem the only reason why the good guys win is because the bad guys let them win...

Come on S...If I didn't know better, you want the bad guys to win. I'm sure you are the type that hangs out at "holyfather's" forums, pretending to be on e of the guys, even though the technical discussion there passes way over your head. I'm sure he enjoyed the egreeting card you sent him though.

Am I right?

 

"they" are the kids/teenagers, i thought it was clear, most parents don't have a clue ! No i said that "they should worry" meaning that they do not, because it's the parents who pick up the pieces not them.

Yes i mention Apropos, so what ! You don't expect me to mention one of the harmless eicar test files do you, what would be the point in that ?

No i havn't ever been nailed by anything if you were paying attention ! Apropos etc isn't scary for me, but if you read what i said, it's all the folks out there, not on here, that it and lots of other things are problems for, and Apropos was a very big one for a lot of them. And funnily enough, it was also a big problem for some PC savvy types too, ever heard of sysinternals forums !

Now that you come to mention it, i was aware of the very real cookie exploit to install malware. So yes it might be rare, but things like that can and did happen, so it's not a scare or whatever, it's real and a proveable fact. What do you want to see, more eicar accounts !

No we won't be most likely affected i know that, and i keep saying it's the others out there who will.

ZA has as far as i'm aware, stopped all unauthorised connections from entering/leaving my PC, not just those particular ones. But i was specifically saying "IF" something did ever get in/out !

Listen, i report what i see, and what i see is what is happening, not imagined etc, but real daily probes from those IP's. And if you looked at the IP's i have given in the other thread, then you will see for yourself who they actually realy are. Not Benny and Jeromys or McdonaldDuck etc, but Gov/Mil/ etc. Do you think they would email me and ask me or tell me if they were trying to gain access. It's a very remote ( literally lol ) possibility that they could think i was involved in some exploits or the like in some way/s, due to my surfing etc. And/Or for similar reasons maybe even terrorisiom, god bless them ! Either way they are 100% wrong and are wasting their time if that's what something thinks. They are the only reasons i can think of as to why they might be targetting me, if indeed they are of course. Could all be just a coincidence, and it's perfectly normal for everybody on my ISP to get hourly daily scans from them. Maybe it's even wider than that, and all IP's on all ISP's are getting scanned, that would a lot of sense wouldn't it, NOT.

I wasn't implictly assuming that the bad guys will get the upper hand at all. I said "That wouldn't stop the opposite sides from still trying, it all depends on how skillful the upper hand/s were." Meaning whichever side gains the upper hand/s, the opposite of one side is the other, and vice versa !

I never said "the bad guys will win" nor do i think that. I do though think it has been and will be worse for sometime to come, before it does get better. That means for the majority of people out there, Not lucky ole us, we're alright jack, well as far as we know anyway for now ! What's funny about Apropros, might be to you and i and most of us, but not to those who got and still get blasted with it.

Most users no nothing about worms actually in my experience, or Trojans/Spyware/Adware or the R word. Most have heard of a virus, but you would be amazed how many think it's just only one that keeps going round and round ! More technical countermeasures are in place to resist worms, but most script kiddies etc just don't bother with them anymore because there are better fish to fry.

I don't pretend to be a code whizz kid or posess loads of knowledge about PC's etc, never have thought that at all, and not only that i have also stated that many times over too, and on more places than on here, including you know where, and they know that ! As Clint Eastwood said " a mans gotta know his limitations" and i do, how about you hey ?


StevieO

 

People like the one you mentioned as an example, and others that i'm aware of too, i have a admiration for. Why, well because the Really bright ones are very skillful coders in many ways, even better than some in the AV/AT business !

Most seem to code a lot in Delphi, but so do a lot of AV/AT too, rather than the much more efficient and much more difficult to do C, in it's many variations. But that hasn't stopped them writing exploits and Apps etc that have stumped the "security" folks. Maybe sometimes for only a short while, but in some cases for a quite a time. So if the combined forces of All the Anti whatever brigade couldn't break it, then that shows a lot of talent !

Could/should that talent be put to more constructive use on this side of the fence ? I think that the answer is yes to both. But i'm not them, and i can understand the appeal etc it must have to be king of the castle etc, and being looked up to by their peers etc, and finding loopholes etc, and yes, how much fun it might be too ! Most of them will "grow " out of it and move on to other things i'm sure, but they have to come that conclusion for themselves.

If everybody turned them into hate figures etc, then what would/does that do ? Not make them reconsider their position sooner, but just the opposite. So i think it's preferable to respect their skills, and at the same time people having constructive dialoge with them lessens the chance of alienation/demonisation etc and all that can bring. It's very interesting that one of those guys you mentioned, appears to have had a change of heart very recently, and has just publically anounced it !!!


StevieO

 

Hello,
Steve just one thing:
Most bad guys work in companies that have offices all alongside California's coastline, and no one moves a finger against them, because money goes where there's more money. You can read articles about aluria, claria, 180solutions etcs chairmans giving 'beautiful' interviews about consumerism, bringing the store to the customer's doorstep and similiar crap to various magazines ... Sad world of the money grabbers. Stand-alone hack-the-system guys are a minority.
Mrk

 

Stevio, I have no problem with people like HF, but I find it hilarious that they become like semi-celebrities when wannabes hang out on their board making irrelevant remarks just to seem cool. It's kind of like Wilders in reverse, except the coolness factor of chatting with a 'famous hacker' (compared to talking merely to people who write security programs) makes it more exciting. And then they go to forums like this and say "Holy father says this... Holy father says that..."

Oh no, you don't possess loads of knowledge about PC and can't code, but you know for sure what script kiddies and the pros will do in the future. Remarkable. I suppose you believe you have insider access, but lacking the skills how do you know they are not just "blowing smoke" to the laughable newbie?

most code in Delphi?... You know a lot about malware writing by hanging out with Holyfather have you?

Script kiddies with skillz eh... They told you that?

For someone with no skills at all, you seem remarkably well informed about what the bad guys do.

And you wonder why governments are trying to hack you. LOL

Well I know my limitations enough not to 'help' Holyfather by posts links I found googling after 5 seconds in response to a deep technical question he was interested in. What about you?

 

DA you really did make laugh, out loud too lol, but in the nicest possible way, so don't think i'm offended, because i'm not ! If we make each laugh, that's not so bad i don't think, even if it's at, not just with ! Doesn't upset me any.

Yeah i know what you mean about people posting often on that site ! I've never posted often on a site like that.

Actually obviously unbeknown to you and others, i do have insider access with at least one person, not in the malware department, but the antimalware ones ! That's how i know about them most coding in Delphi. Any info that is confidential i respect and keep it to myself, and may at times post in only broad terms. If it's not confidential, then i'm free to pass this on if i think it's beneficial.

Funny because you are the one who keeps refferring to yourself as a newbie ! We're all newbies at certain things, hey me included, so don't feel bad about it will you, i don't. Nothing wrong with learning more about all sorts is there.

"Script kiddies with skillz eh... They told you that?"

Nope, and as if i'm just gonna take their word anyway. I do read what more clever coders write about things, cross reference etc, and then make my own mind up thanks.

"For someone with no skills at all, you seem remarkably well informed about what the bad guys do."

I see so it's personnal attacks now is it, saying that i have NO skills at all ! How nice of you, Not. My info comes from a variety of sources, as previously mentioned, and AV/AT etc vendors who post on wilders etc. And from amongst other places too ! I could give a long list of reputable sites for you to gain the same info, but at least i think you have the skills to that for yourself, don't you ?

Well it takes me usually longer than 5 seconds to google for stuff, so that counts me out !

Once again if you took the time to read carefully. i have never stated that, governments ARE trying to hack me, i was stating what is actually happening, daily and hourly port scans from them. You tell me why you think it's occurring so frequently then, from ALL those sources ?


StevieO

 

"Never posted often"? That means you post sometimes on a site like that?
LOL.

Hiding behind the word "often" doesn't become you , S.

Anyway I know you are trying hard not to lie and yet not reveal the damning truth, but both you and I know you *do* post on such sites! So no need to insult the both of us by trying to imply you don't. Anyone can verify what I'm saying just by visiting the site.

Let's just say you post often enough that you are a 'regular fixture' there shall we?


About not knowing one's limit and answering a deep technical question
posed by Holyfather with a google search...

Good try at humor, SP***** , but obviously the 5 second bit was just an exggaration. . But then again you know exactly which post I'm talking about right? Or are you denying that you answered such a post exactly the way I said you did (except the 5 second bit).

*Yawn*, do you know how many people can make this claim here on Wilders? Just because either Gavin (DCS), Jason (Ghost) , Kelvin (NSclean) etc answer your emails occasionally gives you insider access?

If we are exchanging boasts, I can tell you I have insider access to not only such people, but also bon fide security vulnerability researchers so what?

Wow, I'm in awe of the deep forbidden secrets you know... Like this one
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15653729 lol.

But being a newbie is relative. In any case I don't pretend to act like i know stuff because I have 'insider access'. I don't string a page of links about stuff I don't know anything about and post it all over the net and claim it's the best stuff since forever that is teaching interesting stuff even to security experts.

Noobs I see are fooled and think you really know lots of stuff, when all you did was to google for rootkit scanner, plus collect links from sites. I bet you don't even read most of the links. certainly you don't use most of them.

I don't post links and then post a one liner to act as if I know what I'm
talking about.

And when the conversation continues, it's obvious you don't even understand the link.

So deny it if you will. I notice you never deny it. You just continue hinting at trusted sources and whatnot.

Or give some sort of evading answer like "we are all newbies". Boast a bit, tell me what skills you have with computers. Tell me something you can do, you think I can't or that most people here can't

Any idiot can bookmark websites and post links from them on forums to act like he knows what is going on. It's easy enough to see though for those who do know stuff to see if he really understands what is going on though.

Step 1 : Post a link to some webpage that says something that sounds scary, it doesn't matter if you don't understand what it is saying, as long as it sounds important.

Step 2 : To avoid showing that I don't really understand most of the stuff, I just stick some one liner.

"Hey guys look at this scary stuff I found. I don't really understand even 1% of what it says except for the subject line , but I'm not going to say that of course, so I'll just say 'See! the bad guys are becoming more evil' "

Oh sure, everyone has skillz then. Just copy off my bookmarks, or yours and he becomes an instant expert.

I have "skills" enough to watch you misinterprete things and make all sorts of erronous claims. At Broadband DSL forums, it's literally one of the main past-times of people who do know what they are doing to correct your errors and tame the FUD you spread.

It's amusing if it isn't sad.

Knowing your "skillz" , I wouldn't rule out PBKAC particularly when you claim you can track down government fronts and all that. Or something innocent.

 

1.) Dogma is a chihuahua - name is Luci.

2.) "You need several security layers to protect yourself"
True until about the age of 6 months.

3.) "HIPS are necessary"
A matter of personal preference. My preference is proportional.

4.) "Beating leak tests are of primary importance"
Especially true in public.

5.) "Antiviruses are necessary"
Over-prescribing is possible.

6.) "Payware is better than freeware"
Once again, a matter of personal preference.