A closer look at just how badly Windows 8.x is failing

QUOTE="DoctorPC, post: 2370130, member: 139063"]90% of everything bad posted about Windows 8.1 are from haters, and not based on any real substance whatsoever.[/QUOTE]

I totally disagree with this statement. I am a "defender" of MS but 8.1 has presented real problems for me at times. I have 2 desktops and 1 laptop. One of my desktops took 2 Microsoft Support calls and over a week to install Update 1 and there were hundreds like me. Also, Windows Store Application are not working properly for hundreds of users. If you are technically savvy, then Windows 8.1 probably isn't a problem - but there are many users out there (like my partner) who are not technically inclined and really have a hard time with 8.1 unless 3rd Party apps like Classic Shell are added. It can be made useable, but it takes effort.

There IS real substance to many of the problems and I resent and disagree with "not based on any real substance whatsoever" part of your post, DoctorPC. To me that is a pompous, arrogant statement.

 

The people defending 8.X are not wrong but they are also missing something important. UI consistency is a big part of the picture when it comes to OS upgrade adoption and the numbers reflect this quite clearly. Had 8 debuted with both a start button and default to desktop mode if no touch screen was detected I am convinced that 8 would have been a success.

I have always believed that people have the right to turn on their computer and use it. MS took this away from a huge number of users and those users have spoken.

 

agree with that , Win8.1 update 1 should be released as Win8

 

the Start menu should be back within a couple of months if I recall.

anyway, with the emergence of smartphones and tablets the desktop machines are nowhere near as popular as they once where.

 

Yes it sounds like it:

http://www.extremetech.com/computin...-in-august-thanks-to-new-faster-release-cycle

The return of the Start Menu will definitely help. That, combined with "Modern Mix" from Stardock which makes it possible to run Modern apps in resizable windows on the desktop, will pretty much restore full mouse & keyboard functionality and eliminate the confusing switching back and forth between the modes.

 

I believe that the failure of Windows Vista and 8 is to do with bad attitude, grandiose arrogance and a poor relationship with the consumer. Any developer that adheres stubbornly to sales driven projections stategy rather than consumer driven, is bound to fail. There seems to be no desire on the part of the developer for inclusive policy towards consumers. There is not a mutually beneficial, interactive relationship or sense of mutuality between consumer and developer. In terms of listening, respecting existing customers and accepting consumer input the development stategy is sadly lacking.

Running a development by projections of sales analysis based on a useage that does not yet exist (smart phones etc) to the detriment of existing massively popular existing products (XP and lineage on pcs) and userbase to a gamble on a completely different patform is insane. Basing a companies future on wild get rich quick sales office stategies ( I would even go so far as to say 'ploys') before any other consideration does not make sense.

People are getting sick of having these non accountable giants pushing stuff down their throats and having to change their life every six months to suit the needs of the developer.
What we have seen is not a development of an operating system but a series of separate operating systems, each one a gamble on the next big consumer 'thing' (SmartPhones or whatever) and burning bridges as it goes.
All the consumers that have had the previous system can go to hell...'either keep up or go away'.

Consumers are becoming frightened, tired and are undermined by the pace and consumption of these massive insatiable monoliths.
Just when you are happy with an operating system (or anything else for that matter) they change the game. Many people are beginning to see that the benefits of this way of life do not make up for the the disruption, nagging and fear associated with this constant prodding. They are asking us to buy into a treadmill like existance where our only role is to service the needs of an out of control machine. That's why these consumer insulting, dehumanising manifestations of control and power are being rejected...because people have just had enough!

The popular operating systems have had some sort of contiguous relationship to popular existing ones where there is a linear developmental 'feel'. This 'conservative' style of development, more holistic, and taking everything into broad consideration and especially having the finger firmly on the pulse of your consumers and their needs,(I believe) is more likely to succeed. This style of mutually beneficial development creates a generative body rather than a parasite and host one and would be welcomed.
I would suggest that completely separate operating systems be developed for these new devices to save us from being subjected to more incongruous monsters.

I don't want my pc to be a phone to look like a phone, or to act like a phone.

 

Very well said.

 

Just to add to what sdmod wrote...

• Businesses that have relied heavily on Windows found the touch screen inappropriate. W8 was not a good match for their existing PCs
• There was a lot of rumblings about the introduction of an annual subscription being applied to W8. Upgrades then became an issue.

In reading several business articles it has come to light that this has seriously affected the sales of W8. There are many businesses that have moved to MACs which I found a bit peculiar. Others have introduced a PYOP (pick your own platform) policy and a good number of employees have taken to Android over Windows for their communications devices. The corporation's applications have pretty much stayed where they are, either on XP or W7 on existing workplace PCs.

The integration of W8 over multiple platforms has failed to impress. Not sure if this is entirely a PR failure. It is more likely a management misstep. Microsoft has failed to impress users with their smartphone offerings, especially Nokia. Surface skidded in and out, then back again. This did more damage than what the OS had to offer. W8 is an excellent OS, but it has to run on something. Those 'somethings' are more the issue.

 

Microsoft isn't forcing anything on anyone. I've had 8.1 installed on 6 machines here, and haven't interacted with any metro apps, or the metro interface in roughly 9 months. There are choices here, plenty of choices. Classic Shell is free, and almost entirely eliminates ever having to interact with Metro again. That virtually negates the only real argument Win8x haters have put further, and it's a minor consideration given the extremely good aspects of the OS which far outweigh this minor (and very temporary) nuisance. Most of the negative press on Windows 8 was written by people that didn't appreciate what it brought to the table, and focused almost entirely on the metro hate. Which anyone found a solution to in their first few minutes running it.

It's like any self perpetuating myth, it just won't die.

 

It was more than just the start menu. As Mrkvonic points out, it is a GUI failure. The main objection to 8 has always been the inane inclusion of the Metro UI and apps on a non touch desktop OS. I'm sure that under the hood 8 is a slight improvment over 7, but who cares? The thing that slaps all of us in the face is the idiotic Metro UI. That was MS's main mistake. They should have thought ahead and created separate OS's for mobile and desktop/laptop. They didn't, and the numbers in Post #1 reflect this mistake.

It's also perfectly valid and fine to point out flaws in ANY OS. Labeling and name calling as DoctorPC loves to do (ie, "haters" etc) is just a political tactic used by the MS Fanboys.. nothing more. There should always be a free exchange of ideas on a subject, pro or con. That's called free speech.

 

I agree 100%.

 

@sdmod & Kerodo, well said & completely agree.

@DoctorPC they did force Metro on users as well as the desktop GUI changes, MS basically said here is the new interface like it or lump it, most users didn't like it & complained until MS decided to listen to it's customers, they had a lot of feedback from beta testers & users & completely ignored them until lack of sales & massive negative opinion forced them to change things. That's why they have added back the start button & also bringing back the start menu but I'm sure they will find some way to screw it up by adding the silly live tiles to it. They are also forcing the online Microsoft account on users by hiding the local account options, forcing OneDrive & Skype on users etc.

 

that does not mean JACK! heh, how stupid one should be to think those numbers means anything. dont get me wrong, im not a fan of big Microsoft but you cannot deny they are the only contender whih wont lst long until probably google makes chrome OS a viable choice. anyway windows is the only choice on the market that everyone can use for any use and be satisfied with it and dont even try to match the number of softwares available for windows with other OS's.
no one can beat microsoft on desktop OS arena yet! it doesnt mean we love it but it just means we are stuck with it.
and since its following apple and googles path on release speeds and forcing users to switch or it wont support them anymore... those numbers also will change!

 

When you consider the declining PC market in general due to mobile devices, I think the growth rate of Windows 8.x is satisfactory.

I don't expect amazing growth because 1) The new UI is highly controversial and 2) the PC market isn't booming like it was 5 years ago. People have discovered more appropriate (mobile) devices to browse facebook with.

 

You mean, buyers of an OS introducing a sub-par UI experience can beef it up for free, if only they are willing to be a geek?
Like finding out something like 'Classic Shell' exists, where and how to download it and not worry about screwing up your new shiny computer/laptop?
A bit much to ask, I'd say.

 

Spending 19 seconds installing a 432k piece of software now suddenly requires geek levels of skill? I must be a genius then! I install Antivirus software, security apps, uninstallers, even notepad alternatives.. Gasp..

Some people have unbelievably flimsy arguments I cannot believe they even post them.

 

Windows 8.1 update 1 is great even without Classic Shell or Startisback, people just like to hate Microsoft.

 

I don't think it's that simple. I loved Microsoft and supported them by purchasing their OS's and programming compilers etc for decades as well as using most of their products including MS Office thru many generations. But when they came out with Windows 8, we parted ways... I think 8 was a mistake. And yes, I used it for several months and explored it quite a bit. There are some benefits sure, but the combined mobile/desktop UI is a disaster.

 

Geek is not about skills, it's about a mind set. Only a hammer looks at every problem as if it's a nail.
Looking at this from an engineer pov is fine and dandy but it neglects the psychological aspects of the fleshy part aka user.
If a car salesman tells you the hideous spoilers on the new model can be be made invisible in a blink of an eye, making the car look and feel 'regular', it takes a mindset to accept this.
Not mere skills.

 

Lol. Nice and practical sum up. Running xfce debian here and nothing could beat the speed and GUI (fully customized to my needs and habits).

Same thing happened here. I loved windows 95-7. I never tried ME but Vista wasn't that bad and had quite refreshing GUI. On the other hand adjusting from 7 to Linux GUI was easier than adjusting from 7 to 8. Snowden just tipped the balance.

 

That is true of SOME users - not of all users - please don't generalize all user attitudes. I have consistently been a defender of MS over the years - to the point of being "blind" to their faults sometimes. I think Windows 8, 8.1 and Update 1 were poorly planned, released, and executed. That doesn't mean I am now a "hater". Just because my friends are not "geeks" and struggle with Windows 8.1 doesn't mean they are "haters". Some of them don't even have enough computer knowledge to "hate" MS.

I believe Microsoft just didn't plan and look ahead sufficiently - and were in a hurry to stop Windows XP from being used - primary reason? GREED!

 

well said.

give them some obscur Linux distros and when they will spend 30mn to found out how to install a software that finally doesn't work as they expected and are used to , they will reconsider their opinion about Win8.

 

This is precisely my issue with Windows 8. If I had a touchscreen, it would probably be great. However, I don't, and I have a repetitive strain disorder. If you're using a keyboard and mouse, the interface is quite difficult (and painful) to navigate. With all the strides Microsoft has made in regards to accessibility, it was really disappointing to see them fall down so badly with this one. I've now started using Linux Mint Debian Edition on my main laptop, and am finding it really fits my needs so far.

 

I completely agree with your points. Personally my fast notebook with Windows 8 is just great. I've had problems trying to update to Windows 8.1 because of Samsung's lethargic attitudes to new software, but I like Win 8 so much as it is, that I'm not going to try to update anymore.

 

Install Classic Shell, problem solved. Why is this so hard to understand? Win8.1 is actually quite a bit faster than Mint these days. Benchmark it, and see.