unallocated space (partition?) question

[savagcl]

WinXP Home SP2
My HD layout:
1st disk:
C,D,E,F

2nd disk:
Unallocated (7.844MB)
G,H,I,J
Unallocated (7.844MB)

Granted, its only a few MB but why waste it.

2 unallocated spaces, shows as partitions (in ADD) on the second HD.
First is at the begining of the HD (before partition G, second is at the end (after partition J).

The first of these unallocated spaces, before G partition is new. Is this
due to installing Disk Director?
The last unallocated space (partition) was put there by PM (PM unstalled now).

How do i get this space (or both) added to another partition?

NOTE: The Acronis Secure Zone is showing as located between the last (J)
partition and the unallocated partition.

Thank you,
savagcl

[AngelArs]

I have always noticed this too, and it's very frustrating to see. I have tried everything and cannot find a way to get rid of it. Seems like a real waste of space

[Acronis Support]

Hello savagcl and AngelArs,

Thank you for using Acronis Disk Director Suite (http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing.../diskdirector/).

We are really sorry for the inconveniences.

Try to increase the partitions near the unallocated spaces with Acronis Disk Director Suite 9.0. Please note that you may move or resize Acronis Secure Zone like any other partition.

If you are unable to do that with Acronis Disk Director Suite please tell what happens when you try to.

Thank you.
--
Ilya Toytman

[savagcl]

Tried to resize G and J to include the small unallocated space but nogo.

Disk 2, Current description of Partitions:

1. Unallocated------------------- 7.844MB
2. NTFS(G)----------------------49.29GB
3. NTFS(H)----------------------49.06GB
4. NTFS(I)-----------------------44.05GB
5. NTFS(J)-----------------------40.35GB
6. Acronis Secure Zone-------------3.539 GB
7. Unallocated-------------------- 7.844MB

How do i assign the 2 unallocated spaces (#1 and #7) to partitions G and J
above. I.E., increase the size of both partitions by adding the size of each
of the unallocated spaces.

In automatic mode, the unallocated space does not show on screen at all.

In manual mode, the unallocated space shows on screen but selecting "J:"
as the partition to resize, then selecting "unallocated space after" will only
create another unallocated space (using the same space already there).

Please be specific in your reply.
thank you,
savagcl

[AngelArs]

Originally Posted by Acronis Support

Try to increase the partitions near the unallocated spaces with Acronis Disk Director Suite 9.0. If you are unable to do that with Acronis Disk Director please tell what happens when you try to.

Just like savagcl I've tried to make the bigger but no go. Most of the time the options are grayed out, and the only thing it will let us do is to create a primary partition. Why would I want a 7 MB primary partition? Even then it won't access the full 7.844 MB size and only allows for 7.13 MB creation

I don't want to hijack savagcl's thread, I was only letting him know that we have his problem too We'll watch and see if you can fix his problem, and then maybe start our own thread regarding this

[AngelArs]

Originally Posted by savagcl

How do i assign the 2 unallocated spaces (#1 and #7) to partitions G and J above. I.E., increase the size of both partitions by adding the size of each of the unallocated spaces.

Have you tried to moving #7 to where #1 is? As soon as it's next to it they should merge. If memory serves me right then I don't think it will let you move them as a option. That was one of the problems...

[savagcl]

I did manage to get one (# 7 of above msg) of the unallocated spaces added
to partition J.

Had to create a partition of it first (yes, a Pri, act only, not possible to create
a logical because it was greyedout bug here??).
Then had to remove the Acronis secure zone via true image!!!
then, i could increase free space on drive J using the automatic wizard.
Of course, then i recreated the Acronis secure zone.

No success with the unallocated space (#1) even if i created a partition of it
(partition X) first. Tried to add this partition to drive G, the operation ran ok
but after rebooting, Drive G was the same size and the unallocated space was
still there. In the window where it says to select the new size of G, i couldnt
get the slider to move past what it was already maxed-out as.

End result - i removed the X partition and reverted it back to unallocated
space.

I think you guys might have a bug here.

savagcl

[savagcl]

AngelArs,
hang in there. We'll see what acronis says.
acronis, please be specific in answering (a global answer is of no use and dont
do anything good for acronis).

savagcl

[Acronis Support]

Hello savagcl,
Hello AngelArs,

Thank you for using Acronis Disk Director Suite (http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing.../diskdirector/).

There are two types of partitions: Primary partitions and Extended partitions. One can create only four partitions on every single hard disk drive. Please note that also there can be only one Extended partition on each hard disk drive. So there are only eight partition configurations of a hard disk drive:

1) One primary partition
2) Two primary partitions
3) Three primary partitions
4) Four primary partitions
5) One primary partition + one extended partition
6) Two primary partitions + one extended partition
7) Three primary partitions + one extended partition
8) One extended partition

Further more, Primary partition can be set Active. There can be only one Primary Active partition on each hard disk drive.

Every Extended partition consists of several (one or more) logical disks.

The "7.8 Mb" problem:

1) The 7.8 Mb of unallocated space is in the end of a hard disk drive (it is created in order to allow Windows to convert basic disks into dynamic ones). In this case this unallocated space can be merged into an adjacent Primary partition / Logical disk in Extended partition.

2) The 7.8 Mb of unallocated space is in the beginning of a hard disk drive. In this case this space can be merged only into an adjacent Primary partition. The thing is that an Extended partition can't start from the very beginning of a hard disk drive. So if you try to merge this unallocated space into a Logical disk in Extended partition - this operation will not succeed.

If you want me to answer any specific question regarding the current setup of your partitions/logical disks, please feel free to post a message here.

Thank you.

--
Andrew Berezovsky

[AngelArs]

Thank you savagcl I'm hanging in there, but as you know this is a very frustrating situation

Originally Posted by Acronis Support

2) The 7.8 Mb of unallocated space is in the beginning of a hard disk drive. In this case this space can be merged only into an adjacent Primary partition. The thing is that an Extended partition can't start from the very beginning of a hard disk drive. So if you try to merge this unallocated space into a Logical disk in Extended partition - this operation will not succeed.

So then what you are saying (basically) is that this IS a bug with PartitionExpert, because I KNOW from past experience that this same thing does not happen with Partition Magic or any other partitioning software...

Also, what is so significant about the 7.8 Mb figure? Why can’t it be made smaller to say 1 MB?

[chasingmytail]

You havn't examined the HD when you used other partition manages if you've never noticed that a HD that starts with an extended(logical) partition has a piece of free space at the beginning. Partition expert just assignes a drive letter, partition magic doesn't. If you wnat to make use of this space you have to make the first partition a primary one, then you can extend yourself.

[AngelArs]

Originally Posted by chasingmytail

You havn't examined the HD when you used other partition manages if you've never noticed that a HD that starts with an extended(logical) partition has a piece of free space at the beginning.

Actually we have I will uninstall PartitionExpert and re-install Partion Magic and take a screen shot for you

Also, what you are suggesting is that if a person has two hard drives, but one OS, then they would need two primary partitions even though only one would be used? That doesn't make sense. That would be a waste of a partition...

[chasingmytail]

on your second hd, just make the first partition a primary one, don't hide it, just use it, then you can make the rest of the space logical.

[Acronis Support]

Hello AngelArs,

This is definitely not a bug in Acronis Disk Director Suite. This is a standard for partitioning hard disk drives. If you create an Extended partition starting at the very beginning of a hard disk drive - Windows will not work with this hard disk drive.

Thank you.

--
Andrew Berezovsky

[chasingmytail]

re that last reply, windows will work with the disk, you just lose thst little space at the beginning, well, it's true for 98 and nt and 2000, so I presume for xp as well.

[LetzRoll]

The space at the front of the physical hard drive is not really empty, it contains the meta-data necessary for allocating and addressing the rest of the disk. This is true regardless of the number or type of partitions the disk is divided into. This area also holds the meta-data the System BIOS reads to recognize the disk exists, and it can also be used to store 'bad sector' locations, although they can be stored on the system partition, depending on the OS. If the first partition is Primary, some Windows flavors place the hand-off code here to transfer control from the BIOS to the OS at boot. You can see the files by using a disk editor or some defrag tools allow them to be viewed as well. PerfectDisk is one defragger that comes to mind.

By the way, it is not a good idea to allocate the entire disk. Better to leave a few megs on the tail end to avoid partiton addressing problems, especially when moving and/or resizing partitions on a disk that's been carved up for awhile and has data everywhere. Think of it as a temp parking area. If your disk is full, there is no place to park address info temporarily while rearranging the deck chairs. Also note that unallocated is not synonymous with unformatted. The OS and disk utilities can - and do - use unallocated space.

[savagcl]

I solved the problem!

I stopped using ADD to manage my partitions and am now using XP Disk
management.

No more unallocated space in front of "G".

My HD Config as of now:
Disk #1 - Primary
Extended partition for remainder of Disk #1
Logical partitions: C, D, E, F,
Disk #2 - Extended partition only (Note: No Primary required)
Logical partitions: G, H, I, and J, with ATI partition set as 2 Gig at end of J.

Its better to recognize a bug and be up front about it. Its not a crime, its a bug.

So another piece of software go to a CD and then the shelf (to get dusty).

savagcl

[Acronis Support]

Hello savagcl,

Please note that Windows Disk Management will never show you this 7.8 Mb of unallocated space.

Please also note that Acronis Disk Director Suite 9.0 doesn't change anything in your partition structure until you press the "Commit" button. When you start Acronis Disk Director Suite and see the partition structure - this is just a reflection of the real state of your hard disk drives.

Thank you.

--
Andrew Berezovsky

Hello everyone,
I have re-formatted my computer with a 20GB hard drive and now it is down to 2GB because there is 18GB unallocated space...does anyone know how to get rid of all the unallocated space so i can have all my space back on my computer?

[Acronis Support]

Hello Mawc,

Thank you for your interest in Acronis Disk Director Suite (http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing.../diskdirector/).

You may increase the space of your 2Gb partition to include all the unallocated space. Also you may create another partition and use the unallocated space for this. The third variant is a mixture: you may use part of the unallocated space to increase the existing partition and all the remaining space to create new partition (or several of them). It's up to you which variant suits you more.

Thank you.
--
Ilya Toytman

yes, thank you, but that still doesn't expain HOW to increase my 2GB drive...

[Acronis Support]

Hello Mawc,

Please launch Acronis Disk Director Suite 9.0, right click on the partition you wish to increase and choose "Resize" option. After that drag the border of the partition in the way you need. When you finish partitioning please choose "Operations" -> "Commit" to apply changes.

Thank you.
--
Ilya Toytman

there has to be a way to do it on regular windows because i don'r want some crappy program taking up the only space i have....

[Acronis Support]

Hello Mawc,

Please note that this Forum is devoted to those who have questions concerning Acronis Disk Director Suite. I can explain how to perform the desired operation with this software. I am afraid you won't be able to increase the space of partition using standard Windows means.

Thank you.
--
Ilya Toytman

The 7.8 mb of un-allocated space is supposed to be there. Listen to the Acronis Support team. The only way you can remove it is to change the drive from Logical to Primary. Doing this will most probably cause lag in your systems performance. This is due to the fact that primary drives are best suited for Operating Systems.