Tracking School Children With RFID Tags... [Wired Article]

[TheWindBringeth]

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...nt-monitoring/

FWIW, I think for some it is about acclimating children to privacy reducing technology/designs with the full knowledge and expectation that when they become adults they will not only be far less likely to oppose it... they will likely defend it and further increase its use in the products and services they contribute to. If it isn't being done already, such IDs will likely be tied to mom/dad's credit card so that lunch time items can be purchased with ease. Which of course will be promoted as a way to monitor and protect your child from an unhealthy diet thus reducing opposition to it from parents. Growing up with such convenience and no adult appreciation for the inappropriate consequences for privacy, such kids will likely be the ones pushing "RFID tags for everyone" when they grow up.

[noone_particular]

They always seem to find some way to make it sound good or justified, no matter how invasive and repulsive the idea is. Sadly, I think it will become the norm and the next generation will embrace this surveillance society. It makes me glad that my child raising days are over. That said, if they ever try to implant one of those things in me or my clothing, property, etc, I will treat it as a physical assault and respond accordingly.

[mirimir]

I wonder whether they'll chip me after I'm out with Alzheimer's

[TheWindBringeth]

Originally Posted by mirimir

I wonder whether they'll chip me after I'm out with Alzheimer's

You could take them to a few Alzheimer patient *caretaker* support group meetings. That might encourage other plans.

[Snoop3]

eh, its also a case where the students are the mealticket for the teachers and admin. They're not all that interested in educating them but they want to make damn sure they all show up for class so the teachers and admin can get their fat salaries and pensions and bennies. Kind of like a rancher puts ear tags in his cattle, the schools will be putting tags on their students.

[Mman79]

Originally Posted by Snoop3

eh, its also a case where the students are the mealticket for the teachers and admin. They're not all that interested in educating them but they want to make damn sure they all show up for class so the teachers and admin can get their fat salaries and pensions and bennies. Kind of like a rancher puts ear tags in his cattle, the schools will be putting tags on their students.

Unless you haven't been in school for a very very long time, you'd know that teachers actually make far too little. As to this "tagging", it's simply a way to get people used to such things for the future. I'm not "1984'ing" the thread, it's just something that is coming and is touted as security. It's really not all that hard to convince people to accept it. The number of chipped pets is growing and no one sees much wrong with it. On the contrary, it's praised for its ability to prevent a lot of pets being taken to shelters and possibly put down.

If it prevents Fluffy from being lost and people consider it beneficial, how much more would it comfort them to know their precious child can be found at any time? It'll be spun like a top to look good, then it will be enforced down the road.

[Snoop3]

Originally Posted by Mman79

Unless you haven't been in school for a very very long time, you'd know that teachers actually make far too little. As to this "tagging", it's simply a way to get people used to such things for the future. I'm not "1984'ing" the thread, it's just something that is coming and is touted as security. It's really not all that hard to convince people to accept it. The number of chipped pets is growing and no one sees much wrong with it. On the contrary, it's praised for its ability to prevent a lot of pets being taken to shelters and possibly put down.

If it prevents Fluffy from being lost and people consider it beneficial, how much more would it comfort them to know their precious child can be found at any time? It'll be spun like a top to look good, then it will be enforced down the road.

eh, nevermind. i had a big rant on teachers' pay but this ain't the place for that. if you really interested in if teachers are really underpaid i would read up on the recent chicago situation(avg salary $84,000/year + health +pension + 3 months off/year was not enough, they wanted 16% pay increase also in these times(for the children mind you))


as far as RFID being innocuous, read or listen to what Catherine Albrecht has to say on the subject. She seems to think they will put these things in our shoes and clothing in the future (understandably RFID will help with theft prevention) but then when you leave the store these RFID will remain and will be tracking you as you walk around town in the future. Maybe gov't will come up with a security reason why these RFID tags should remain your clothing and shoes(who knows?) This is all speculation by her but seems possible considering what gov't and private sector have been doing on the internet to violate folks' privacy.


Thanks.

[Marja]

In some states, a lot of stores already use them on electronics, perfumes, makeup, shoes, highend clothing,
books, alot of drugstores use them on everything.

Those little raised white plastic stickers? The stores say they are for scanning inventory only.
"Those are Just passive information" .... Employees are told, hmmm...
Still they never quit working unless you take them off and break them in two, once you own the merchandise.

(Not talking about the tags on dvds, cds, electronics that have to be run through a scanner to shut down,
those are another story.)

It's infuriating that people in power think they know what's best for us,
nobody protests, because there's too many subjects to protest in this world.

Yeah, they'll keep spinning this as a good thing..

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
FYI-

http://www.teacherportal.com/teacher-salaries-by-state

http://certificationmap.com/teacher-salaries/

http://www.salarylist.com/jobs/Ceo-Salary.htm

[Fly]

You can't start early enough ...

But this is so limited !
Why not release a nano-cloud of tiny chips into the atmosphere, either to act as an adhesive or something of a more invase nature ? Complete with transmission capabilities, of course. Those signals can't be strong, but with local repeaters connected to a larger network it could work !

Maybe the capabilities are not there yet ? It will just take a little time
You can bet some people at the NSA are thinking about something like this.

[Snoop3]

Originally Posted by Marja

In some states, a lot of stores already use them on electronics, perfumes, makeup, shoes, highend clothing,
books, alot of drugstores use them on everything.

Those little raised white plastic stickers? The stores say they are for scanning inventory only.
"Those are Just passive information" .... Employees are told, hmmm...
Still they never quit working unless you take them off and break them in two, once you own the merchandise.

(Not talking about the tags on dvds, cds, electronics that have to be run through a scanner to shut down,
those are another story.)

It's infuriating that people in power think they know what's best for us,
nobody protests, because there's too many subjects to protest in this world.

Yeah, they'll keep spinning this as a good thing..

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
FYI-

http://www.teacherportal.com/teacher-salaries-by-state

http://certificationmap.com/teacher-salaries/

http://www.salarylist.com/jobs/Ceo-Salary.htm

agree with most your post there but links comparing teachers to CEO's is laughable. do you want to compare them NFL quarterbacks, Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan, etc(top 99.99th percentile in their field)? because those are the equivalent in our society of CEO's. Why not compare teachers' salaries to electricians, plumbers etc? or maybe all the bench warmers in the NFL need to be paid what Joe Montana got. i mean that is what you really want isn't it?

btw, i think i deserve to make $80k/year plus bennies too, so start sending some of that teachers' money my way.

(hope its not too political and the mods zonk it)

[Marja]

snoop3, you lost your sense of humor somewhere!

Putting the CEO"S salary there was supposed to be laughable.

Teacher's do waaaay for more society than QB's or CEO's, and for a pittance.

[Snoop3]

Originally Posted by Marja

snoop3, you lost your sense of humor somewhere!

Putting the CEO"S salary there was supposed to be laughable.

Teacher's do waaaay for more society than QB's or CEO's, and for a pittance.

actually, no, they don't(and its not for a pittance). this is what their union tell them unfortunately.
What about electricians, plumbers, ditch diggers, etc. - are they worth $80k/year plus bennies? we don't hear propaganda ads from their unions all day so we don't think so. we pay $10k/year per student so thats like $200,000 to $250,000 per classroom - where's all that money going? and yet where i live i hear day after day after day that the schools don't have enough money.

[Marja]

If you had looked at the links, you would see the majority of teachers
make half or less than 80,000.

Where's the money going? Ask you local politicians, for starters...should be
interesting, with all the 'money' from Lotto, shools ought to be rolling in dough.

Since this is a computer security forum, I'll desist,
but you haven't changed my mind about what I know about teachers.

[Snoop3]

Originally Posted by Marja

If you had looked at the links, you would see the majority of teachers
make half or less than 80,000.

Where's the money going? Ask you local politicians, for starters...should be
interesting, with all the 'money' from Lotto, shools ought to be rolling in dough.

Since this is a computer security forum, I'll desist,
but you haven't changed my mind about what I know about teachers.

whats that, their base salary before health + pension benefits?

and then they get 3 months off per year so their salary is equivalent to 133% of whats listed to fairly compare them to others. what they fear is the free market (vouchers etc) because they know they're vastly overpaid.

funny that you shift the blame on the money to politicians but that doesn't explain anything - where's it going? seriously where is all that money going and why do i hear ads every day about how our schools are underfunded?

its all a fraud and likewise you haven't changed my mind about what i know about greedy selfish teachers and teachers unions.

[Sir paranoids]

the hole RFID topic is a bad joke and this is one of the worse iv seen so far.

if you like this topic then you'll probably like the fact that they have all ready placed RFID in a lot of financial cards {5" range} and in the Us your drivers license and passport have 50" range and any 14 year old black hat can get around the encryption.

and that's just for starters.

[TheWindBringeth]

Court Grants Rutherford Institute Request to Stop Texas School from Kicking Student Out for Refusing to Wear “Smart ID” Tracking Badge
https://www.rutherford.org/publicati...as_school_from

after

Student Suspended for Refusing to Wear a School-Issued RFID Tracker
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...nt-suspension/

[Hungry Man]

Texas.

[Thankful]

Texas school can force students to wear locator chips, judge rules:
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...dge-rules?lite

[TheWindBringeth]

Originally Posted by Thankful

Texas school can force students to wear locator chips, judge rules:
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...dge-rules?lite

IANAL but I suspect that the NBC article title doesn't accurately reflect the situation and nature of the judge's ruling. Based on what I've read so far it appears that a critical aspect was/is the school's offer to allow her to remain on her current campus by wearing the newer badge *with the RFID chip removed*. The last sentence of the judge's order (https://www.rutherford.org/files_ima...dez_Ruling.pdf) is:

"If Plaintiff refuses to wear the uniform badge issued to all students at Jay High School, even without a chip, the District may exercise its discretion and transfer Plaintiff back to her home campus,where she can wear her old student ID badge."

Some of the other commentary in there might not bode well for her and/or someone else if they were to continue to pursue such a case though. I don't feel like trying to figure that out, and again, I'm not qualified to do so to begin with. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable will comment further.

FWIW, here is the the Rutherford Institute comment page:

https://www.rutherford.org/publicati...favor_of_texas

[Nebulus]

I really don't like the idea of tracking anyone 100% of the time, using RFID chips or any other means, for that matter. But from what I read in the Wired article, it seems that there is a financial justification behind usage of chips:

Like most state-financed schools, the district’s budget is tied to average daily attendance. If a student is not in his seat during morning roll call, the district doesn’t receive daily funding for that pupil because the school has no way of knowing for sure if the student is there.

But with the RFID tracking, students not at their desk but tracked on campus are counted as being in school that day, and the district receives its daily allotment for that student.

While I'm not sure that is the real reason, greed could be an appropriate justification for this kind of tracking...